Couple things here.

[lilwanderer]

So as i mentioned in the title I have a few things I'm wanting to become familiar with.
So I've been told already on how breeding chocolate works and how to get mauve with it using blue and splash, but how soon can i get a mauve? From the first crossed offspring's offspring or the offsprings offspring's offspring . Or so on..?
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I can't remember if I've asked this in the past, I think i have but i forgot what the answers were soo.. I also have a chocolate mottled girl (not yet laying but I'll ask to know later.)
I know that mottled to non-mottled carriers will give mottled carriers/splits right? But is that for all or just the male offspring or only half off all offspring? And the chocolate coloring works the same when breeding to bbs correct? How soon could i get more chocolate + mottled using her, will one come before the other?
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And now I different topic involving a splash hen- I got her as I wanted more splash girls in my bbs group. I liked her type and skin tone.
But while bathing her (she sat with 4 other birds for a 3-4 hour drive in one cage.) I noticed extra toes .
I don't see anything else that would say she's obviously from a silkie or some other extra toed breed, besides that she's slightly larger in size but nothing dramatic
She came from a lady who had a lot of nice cochins, I've never gotten a bird I was disappointed in and this five toed thing was a first.
I know the lady had several faverolle projects (Silver Columbian, and White faverolles were some she shared with me) and i know they're five toed too.
The question with her is how likely is it her offspring will have five toes or possibly express other colors? She has no leakage, just a pretty splash.
Pictures for reference of the pretty birdies:
Sun bleached blue boy the girls are with:

chocolate girly:

Chocolate mottled girly:

Five toed cochin girly:

m

Might I mention, the lady doesn't own silkies. She told me this girl along with the other birds i git from her are last years or earlier breedings, so I assume she's from her pens.

 

[The Moonshiner]

If you cross a chocolate rooster to a splash hen all the pullet offspring will be mauve from that first cross.
Crossed to a blue hen half the pullet offspring will be mauve. So earliest would be f1s for pullets. I'd take another cross for mauve cockerels so f2s for them.

 

[lilwanderer]

If you cross a chocolate rooster to a splash hen all the pullet offspring will be mauve from that first cross.
Crossed to a blue hen half the pullet offspring will be mauve. So earliest would be f1s for pullets. I'd take another cross for mauve cockerels so f2s for them.

the rooster isn't chocolate, he kind of looks it but he's blue. He's just been in the sun (yard bird before i got him which was less than a week ago )
I won't get chocolate this first round as the hen is chocolate.
And the splash hen isn't related to why i was asking about chocolates and mauves, i had multiple different questions asked in this thread, which i can see why it can get confusing.

 

[The Moonshiner]

the rooster isn't chocolate, he kind of looks it but he's blue. He's just been in the sun (yard bird before i got him which was less than a week ago )
I won't get chocolate this first round as the hen is chocolate.
And the splash hen isn't related to why i was asking about chocolates and mauves, i had multiple different questions asked in this thread, which i can see why it can get confusing.

Ya the multiple questions wasn't so much confusing as just too much lol.
I was just gonna start with the first and answered the question without putting the pics into the equation.
@NatJ will come along and probably be glad to go through and answer everything.

 

[lilwanderer]

Ya the multiple questions wasn't so much confusing as just too much lol.
I was just gonna start with the first and answered the question without putting the pics into the equation.
@NatJ will come along and probably be glad to go through and answer everything.

Yeah, I didn't expect one person to answer everything. I probably should've done separate threads but all these birds are in the same breeding pen and will be put with each other.
So although i had different questions for each bird, they all play a part with each other lol.
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But the rooster is blue and he has a chocolate hen, chocolate mottled hen and multiple blue and Splash hens.
With the rooster being blue, and i only have two chocolate sources (the mottled and the solid), when can I expect mauves?

 

[The Moonshiner]

Blue rooster over chocolate hen = 50% black and 50% blue chicks. Cockerels will carry one chocolate gene. Pullets will not.
Same with mottled chocolate hen but all will also carry one mottling gene.
If you breed those blue cockerels back to their mothers then you'll get an average of 25% of each sex offspring being mauve.
If you breed the blue cockerels from the mottled hen back to her on average I think it's 1 out of 16 will be mottled mauve.

 

[NatJ]

I know that mottled to non-mottled carriers will give mottled carriers/splits right? But is that for all or just the male offspring or only half off all offspring?

Mottling is an autosomal gene. That means it is inherited the same way by males and by females. It is not on the sex chromosomes.

And the chocolate coloring works the same when breeding to bbs correct? How soon could i get more chocolate + mottled using her, will one come before the other?

Yes, chocolate inherits normally for chocolate, and black/blus/splash inherits according to its normal pattern, and chicks that have both chocolate and blue are called mauve.

For chocolate and mottled descendants from that hen, you can get both traits in the same generation: when you cross a son back to her.

Blue male x chocolate mottled female will give:
black sons, carry chocolate and mottling
blue sons, carry chocolate and mottling
black daughters, carry mottling
blue daughters, carry mottling

If you breed a black son back to the chocolate mottled hen, you should get some sons and some daughters with chocolate, some of each with mottling, some with both mottling and chocolate. You will also get some that do not show chocolate or mottling. With the chocolate mottled mother, all chicks must at least carry mottling, and all sons must carry chocolate, but daughters that do not show chocolate will not carry it either.

If you breed a blue son back to the chocolate mottled hen, you will get all the same colors as you would with a black son, plus all those colors with blue added (that would be blue, blue with mottling, mauve, mauve with mottling.)

And now I different topic involving a splash hen- I got her as I wanted more splash girls in my bbs group. I liked her type and skin tone.
But while bathing her (she sat with 4 other birds for a 3-4 hour drive in one cage.) I noticed extra toes .
I don't see anything else that would say she's obviously from a silkie or some other extra toed breed, besides that she's slightly larger in size but nothing dramatic
She came from a lady who had a lot of nice cochins, I've never gotten a bird I was disappointed in and this five toed thing was a first.
I know the lady had several faverolle projects (Silver Columbian, and White faverolles were some she shared with me) and i know they're five toed too.

The question with her is how likely is it her offspring will have five toes or possibly express other colors? She has no leakage, just a pretty splash.

I think there is a high chance of her producing offspring with five toes. I would expect about half of her chicks to be that way, or maybe even all of them.

Regarding other colors, it will partly depend on who you mate her with. If you want to test, use a male that shows other colors (especially if you have one with lots of red in his pattern: Rhode Island Reds are great for this kind of test). With the hen being splash, you should get one of two results:
--all chicks are blue
or
--half of chicks are blue, the other half show patterns of blue-and-something (the "something" might be red or gold or silver or any shade of one of those.)

If all chicks from the test are blue, then she should not produce unexpected colors of chicks with your blue rooster either, or with any other rooster you are likely to use. (Possible exceptions for some recessive genes: the test I suggested will not show if she has recessive white, or lavender, or carries mottling, or a few other options.)

 

[lilwanderer]

Mottling is an autosomal gene. That means it is inherited the same way by males and by females. It is not on the sex chromosomes.


Yes, chocolate inherits normally for chocolate, and black/blus/splash inherits according to its normal pattern, and chicks that have both chocolate and blue are called mauve.

For chocolate and mottled descendants from that hen, you can get both traits in the same generation: when you cross a son back to her.

Blue male x chocolate mottled female will give:
black sons, carry chocolate and mottling
blue sons, carry chocolate and mottling
black daughters, carry mottling
blue daughters, carry mottling

If you breed a black son back to the chocolate mottled hen, you should get some sons and some daughters with chocolate, some of each with mottling, some with both mottling and chocolate. You will also get some that do not show chocolate or mottling. With the chocolate mottled mother, all chicks must at least carry mottling, and all sons must carry chocolate, but daughters that do not show chocolate will not carry it either.

If you breed a blue son back to the chocolate mottled hen, you will get all the same colors as you would with a black son, plus all those colors with blue added (that would be blue, blue with mottling, mauve, mauve with mottling.)




I think there is a high chance of her producing offspring with five toes. I would expect about half of her chicks to be that way, or maybe even all of them.

Regarding other colors, it will partly depend on who you mate her with. If you want to test, use a male that shows other colors (especially if you have one with lots of red in his pattern: Rhode Island Reds are great for this kind of test). With the hen being splash, you should get one of two results:
--all chicks are blue
or
--half of chicks are blue, the other half show patterns of blue-and-something (the "something" might be red or gold or silver or any shade of one of those.)

If all chicks from the test are blue, then she should not produce unexpected colors of chicks with your blue rooster either, or with any other rooster you are likely to use. (Possible exceptions for some recessive genes: the test I suggested will not show if she has recessive white, or lavender, or carries mottling, or a few other options.)

Saving this, thank you.
I just spoke with the lady I git the splash from- (also where i got the blue roo pictured from.)
She showed for years and stopped last year, she owned the parents and grandparents, and what she didn't own her friend who still shows did/does.
All her birds that are in the same family as the splash went to show before she stopped. As of then, none of them had five toes. She made sure I knew that. She told me the only possible explanation is it was inherited from a couple generations or so ago, none of her cochins have been mixed while she's bred them.
(Fun fact, she's also where i got my white roo mentioned in different threads.)

 

[NatJ]

All her birds that are in the same family as the splash went to show before she stopped. As of then, none of them had five toes. She made sure I knew that. She told me the only possible explanation is it was inherited from a couple generations or so ago, none of her cochins have been mixed while she's bred them.

Um, in that case I don't know what to say.

From what I've read, the gene for 5th toe is a dominant gene. That would mean a chicken can only inherit it from a parent that also shows the trait. Obviously that doesn't fit with what you learned.

[Poking around a bit more...]
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/five-toe-genetics-question-favaucana.1617145/

Ah, here's a thread with several people saying that the gene for 5 toes can be present in some birds that only show 4 toes. Not what I usually expect when a gene is described as "dominant."

But that probably means your 5-toed bird came from a parent with the polydactyl gene that just didn't show it.

So I tried looking for more scholarly papers, and had to refresh my memory on a few terms. Apparently polydactyl in chickens is a dominant gene with incomplete penetrance (so it's dominant, meaning it shows an effect when the bird has just one copy of the gene rather than two, but "incomplete penetrance" means that only some of the birds with the gene will actually show the effect.)

Given all that, I don't know how many of her chicks will show 5 toes. It could be anywhere from none to all of them, although I think the most likely number is about half.

 

[lilwanderer]

Um, in that case I don't know what to say.

From what I've read, the gene for 5th toe is a dominant gene. That would mean a chicken can only inherit it from a parent that also shows the trait. Obviously that doesn't fit with what you learned.

[Poking around a bit more...]
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/five-toe-genetics-question-favaucana.1617145/

Ah, here's a thread with several people saying that the gene for 5 toes can be present in some birds that only show 4 toes. Not what I usually expect when a gene is described as "dominant."

But that probably means your 5-toed bird came from a parent with the polydactyl gene that just didn't show it.

So I tried looking for more scholarly papers, and had to refresh my memory on a few terms. Apparently polydactyl in chickens is a dominant gene with incomplete penetrance (so it's dominant, meaning it shows an effect when the bird has just one copy of the gene rather than two, but "incomplete penetrance" means that only some of the birds with the gene will actually show the effect.)

Given all that, I don't know how many of her chicks will show 5 toes. It could be anywhere from none to all of them, although I think the most likely number is about half.

Never heard of that before. It some way It makes sense though. Interesting.