Crate to Coop Conversion -- Part 2

[supercoops]

Well, I could repurpose some of my dog crates and have a bigger footprint. I have two 7 week old chicks in a dog crate right now and am thinking it's too small. By the time I put a small waterer and small food dish, they only have room to sleep. No room for a nestbox. If they were adults, no way. I'm not sure how your having bantams will alter the perception of space though. LF Cochins have big butts, big hair and take up room. They get hot and want space around them.

Since this dog crate is over 10 years old- I think that pretty much makes it free. I guess I could use dog crates as housing inside a secure run. I have enough of them around the place

Easy to clean, just pop the top and bottom apart. Ventilation, locking door.

There are several coops on the market that agree with 2 sq ft per chicken for the living area depending on the run size.

This one claims 3-5 large hens with 9 square feet at a cost of $675 where you assemble the kit yourself. It's $170 per chicken including the run.

http://chickensaloon.com/the-parlor-backyard-chicken-coop-2/

This one claims3-5 large hens with 4 square feet of living space at a cost of $525 where you assemble the kit yourself. It's $131 per chicken including the run:

http://chickensaloon.com/the-tavern-backyard-chicken-coop/

Now please compare to my coop which costs $70 and it is already fully assembled. You must buy chicken wire to enclose the run and 2x4's to frame it up. I could do that for $100. So mine is $170 and a coop that is more crowded costs $525 and requires more set-up. It probably looks nicer but the cost difference is $525 - $170 = $355. I could do a lot with $355 -- like buy two more coops and build two more runs so I have three times as many chickens. I like chickens. How about you?

 

[tridentk9]

As far as chickens lumping together... my cochins are still young (7weeks) but they've been spreading out for several weeks. They must have short fat muscles that need to displace heat ;-) Add in all those feathers .... The crevecoeurs do huddle among the cochin. Some allow, some don't. They have long skinny muscles- maybe it's harder for them to keep warm?

Ventilation could be increased by drilling several 1inch circles at roof line front and rear then covering with hardware cloth. Wouldn't take much time or supplies.

I'd also recommend using trim around the roof. Looks dangerous to have all those staples. My luck, I'd run into a couple of them daily.

Fully assembled does me no good unless you're close. As far as the other coops- well I didn't buy one of them either. Though why not compare yours to a really expensive coop! http://inhabitat.com/neiman-marcus-...-book/heritage-hen-mini-farm-neiman-marcus-1/

My crate to coop would still cost less than your crate to coop.

 

[supercoops]

Both of the following coops from Chicken Saloon claim to house house 3-5 chickens. Are they "just too small" with "no space to lay eggs" and "no space for water or feeder with "inadequate ventilation or windows" etc.?



9 sq feet of living space (including nest area) / 21 sq feet total for $625 and you assemble it yourself. Two nest areas are included in the 58" dimension.




6 sq feet of living space (including nest area) / 21 sq feet overall for $525 and you assemble it yourself. Two nest areas are included in the 13.2" dimension.

testimonial: Hey, Guys. A few weeks ago I received my “Tavern” coop and I love it as much as my chickens do. The hens are happy and comfortable and laying eggs like crazy. It is truly a great product.

Super Coop:

Here's my box for $70 with 8 sq feet living space including nest area to house 4 egg-laying chickens and it is already assembled. Owner must provide run area:




Super Coop comments:

After reviewing the Chicken Saloon products I see that I need a latch down lid that opens from the rear with hinges in the front. I also need to show a framed up run so people will get the idea. Their asphalt roof looks good too. Their products don't seem to have all the problems that are purported for a "small box".

I will return with a "Part 3" coop.

 

[aart]

Quote:
Both of the following coops from Chicken Saloon claim to house house 3-5 chickens. Are they "just too small" with "no space to lay eggs" and "no space for water or feeder with "inadequate ventilation or windows" etc.?

Yep!

 

[supercoops]

Yep!

Hmmm....show me a coop that is big enough for 4 chickens and please show me your source that says it is made for 4 chickens. Otherwise I will conclude you are "gold plating" chicken coops.

 

[supercoops]

Facts are better than opinions. The University of Maryland Department of Poultry Science recommends 2 sq feet of living area for large chickens. I think their recommendations are reasonable, and a "gold plated" chicken coop is not the direction to go in. thank you

http://extension.umd.edu/sites/default/files/_docs/Raising Your Home Chicken Flock_FINAL_0.pdf

 

[madicakes]

I think our coops look great, and if I were in an area where I knew, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the ONLY time my chickens would be in there would be to roost, I would consider purchasing one. However, I KNOW my chickens aren’t only in their coop to roost. They are invariably up before I get out to let them out of the coop, which means they are up and about, scratching around, walking, etc, inside the coop. I feel confident in my 48 sq. ft. coop (not counting nesting area), housing 10 chickens, that I don’t have to be concerned about space if they were to have to be closed up for several days. I know that when I introduce new chickens after a quarantine, I have enough room in my coop for a separate area for the new chickens to be introduced before they are let loose with the existing flock. I took those things into consideration when building my coop. I, personally, wanted a coop that I could walk into if need be, etc.

I would have two concerns with your coop, were I to be in the market for a coop:
1) Ventilation: Yes, you can open the roof, but there seems to be no protection for the flock once it is opened. Have you thought of a removable but secure “frame” of sorts, with hardware cloth, to cover the entire ceiling of the coop, providing some protection when the roof is opened? Of course, if this coop is placed entirely in a secure run that would not be an issue.
2) The coop is ideal for roosting but doesn’t allow the room for much else. You mentioned that nest boxes, feed, water, etc, can be placed in the corners. I may not be judging the size well based on the photos, but the way it appears to me, placing anything on the floor in that coop is asking for it to be pooped on/in. That is, unless you’re lucky enough to have the chickens to point their rears to the center of the coop.

I think your design is great though, and with a few more tweaks, I think it would be something people would be interested in purchasing. As a consumer, however, I would want at least double the size for 4 chickens, as well as the comfort in knowing that I am not giving up protection and security in favor of ventilation.

Honestly, the cost per chicken was not a factor when I was researching building/purchasing a coop. The design was a HUGE factor. I would be willing to pay more for a coop that provided what I was looking for. When I was first looking into chickens I had the intention of getting only four. I passed up all of those coops that you linked, that indicated they were suitable for 4 chickens, because I thought they were way too small.

ETA: Please keep in mind that, no matter what the University of Maryland, or other reputable organizations claim, I, and many others, err on the side of caution when housing our chickens. Yes, I read that 2 sq. foot per chicken was suitable, but I also read, much more frequently, that 4 sq. foot was the smallest area that I should allow. So, I built my coop with that in mind. Yes, your coops may meet the minimum requirement as far as space, but they do not meet the more commonly adhered to, and recommended, requirements. You came here for constructive criticism, which many have attempted to provide, but you seem to be so set on your views and ideas, that you aren’t really listening to what these people have to say. Pray tell, if every single person who has responded to this thread seems to believe that your coops are too small for four chickens, then the likelihood is that consumers will think the same, if they have done any amount of research. If you will not have the demand for your coops, then you will not sell any, regardless of how “right” the size is.

 

[21hens-incharge]

When the water freezes I take out warm water. My water dishes have held up well to having warm water poured on the bottom to make the ice drop out. They get fresh water 2 times a day anyway so bringing it cold in the summer or warm in the winter is no extra work for me. I dump and fill and dump and fill and dump and fill. Side effect is I can grow a few plants that prefer wetter soil and I rather like that.

Looking through your posts it seems you are a mechanical engineer. Would that be correct?

Something to bear in mind is that as an engineer you are dealing with constants. A 10-32 x 1/2 inch pan head screw will do what any 10-32 x 1/2 inch pan head screw will do for example. When dealing with living things they do not always adhere to a set of parameters. A one and a half year old child for example may or may not be drinking from a bottle even though the books say they should be on a cup.
Are your chickens laying yet? I am thinking they are juveniles still. I know mine did a big personality change when they hit sexual maturity.
The ones that are getting along so well right now may be the ones trying to rip each others faces off when that change happens.

A side note about adding heat... When I was living in the country a while back we had a huge storm that took out power to a very large area. I am talking power lines in the road for miles and miles. The day time high was -4 F. I had 28 laying hens and a few bantam cochins. The coop was built in the barn with no top on it. NO ONE DIED. Not even the Japanese Blacktail. Even if I had been adding heat it would have served no purpose since the roof of the barn was WAY above the roosts and that is where the heat would have gone.
How on earth are you going to add heat when the chicken would be actually touching the heat lamp when roosting???

 

[supercoops]

Quote:
Is the water inside or outside the coop. If it is freezing inside the coop then you have some really cold chickens.

Quote: Yes, I have a BS degree and I'm a registered mechanical engineer.

Quote: In engineering we call that "process variation." The less control you have over the process the more it varies. Do continue.
Quote: In engineering we call that "mode". The mode you described is irreversible.

Quote: Now that IS some kind of cold! Horses and cows can sleep in it too. Amazing! My point is about relative humidity. Obviously there is no humidity around when it is -4F outside. On the other hand when it is 33F outside and it is raining and your chickens are in a 33F barn -- it's going to be quite damp in there as they respirate moisture that has no where to go just like the rain has no where to go but fall on the ground. That's why it's raining to start with. Therefore the moisture can easily collect inside the barn. Why would it go outside where it's already raining with too much water already in the air, and it's escaping the only way it can? Add just a little heat and everything changes. The moisture has a warm and cosy place to stay (in the air) and it gets a free pass to go outside like the humidity from your dryer. Once it's outside it will start to cool down and then it will precipitate.

Quote:
I wondered that too. I might use a water pipe heating strip. Here's one for $7 and it's self-regulating. That means it comes on around the freezing point:

http://www.omega.com/pptst/SRF3_SRF5_SRF8.html?pn=SRF5-2C

 

[21hens-incharge]

All I can say as an Electromechanical assembler of 20 years is that I have seen things engineered to death.
You cannot take the variable out that each chicken is an individual and WILL have individual wants and needs. That variable is natures choosing.
Now if someone could kindly explain that a chicken hatched 2 weeks AFTER another smaller breed could not possibly be its mother to my very overbearing and broody Buff Orpington. Poor Itty Bitty would like to leave the nest sometime this week without my assistance.

I cannot fix stubborn.

The water is inside and outside the coop. I keep water in the run and the house. Cold? yup. To cold for the fluffy butts? They don't think so. When I go out there there are some eating and some wandering around scratching at things I cannot see and some looking out the window at the stupid dog across the alley.

When I mentioned the power outage in an previous post I neglected to mention my area was without power for 9 days. NINE of the coldest days we had while I had that property.

Don't forget humans make coats filled with fluffy feathers for a reason. They are warm.