Dark(er) Egg Laying Breed: Welsummer or Maran?

[dheltzel]

I want a “rainbow” basket and I’m looking for a dark egg layer. I’m considering between Welsummers and BCMs. I know BCMs have darker eggs but I’ve heard Welsummers are better tempered. And no, the answer is not “get both”. I’m looking into getting black/blue/splash Amerucana’s for colored eggs and black/blue/splash LF Cochins for broodiness.

I’m ordering the Amerucana chicks or hatching eggs from http://deerrunfarmmd.com/. The have Wellies and BCM as well.

I have this farm's Delawares and am pleased with their vigor and size (not so pleased with how bossy and pushy they are). I also like that they feed their chickens all organic feed.

They breed their Marans to the French standard and the keep both black and blue copper varieties. Although their Welsummers lay terracotta colored eggs instead of "chocolate" I am considering them because they are an autosexing breed and the breeders admit their Marans don’t lay as well as their 3 other breeds.

I have had both breeds from the strains you are getting (when it was Whitmore Farm). The Welsummers were clearly better layers than the BCM, and I was not able to tell any difference in egg color or size. That varied a lot between hens, and even in a single hen over time. The BCM were abysmal layers, in a flock of 6 hens, I was ecstatic to get more than 5 eggs in a week's time -- from the entire flock.

Get the Welsummers, you will be happier with them.

 

[Redhead Rae]

I have had both breeds from the strains you are getting (when it was Whitmore Farm). The Welsummers were clearly better layers than the BCM, and I was not able to tell any difference in egg color or size. That varied a lot between hens, and even in a single hen over time. The BCM were abysmal layers, in a flock of 6 hens, I was ecstatic to get more than 5 eggs in a week's time -- from the entire flock.

Get the Welsummers, you will be happier with them.

Thanks for the info!

I've been thinking about it and was almost 100% decided on the Welsummers so I could have some spotted eggs when I mix them with the Amerucanas for Olive Eggers. This review of the lines I'm looking at, clinched it for me.

 

[dheltzel]

I think you will like the chicks you get from them. I have had their Ameraucanas also. I no longer have any of their Ameraucanas or BCM's. I found a great strain of show type Black Ameraucanas and they grow and lay better than the Whitmore line also. The Welsummers were used to create Welbars (an autosexing Welsummer) and I only have those now.

 

[Redhead Rae]

I think you will like the chicks you get from them. I have had their Ameraucanas also. I no longer have any of their Ameraucanas or BCM's. I found a great strain of show type Black Ameraucanas and they grow and lay better than the Whitmore line also. The Welsummers were used to create Welbars (an autosexing Welsummer) and I only have those now.

Where did you get your Amerucanas from?

 

[Redhead Rae]

The Welsummers were used to create Welbars (an autosexing Welsummer) and I only have those now.

How did you do this? I thought that Whitmore/Deer Run selected for autosexing.

 

[dheltzel]

Where did you get your Amerucanas from?

My current line is from John Blehm in Michigan, one of the creators of many of the colors of Ameraucanas. He sells chicks and I was so impressed with them as they grew out that I gave away all my other Ams. I have blacks, lavenders, and silvers from his lines. The lavenders are not are productive as the other colors, but in high demand around here. I like the blacks the best of all of them, but the silvers are very nice too, and sex out at a much younger age.
It is not easy to get chicks from John, I suspect he is already sold out for 2018. His website is fowlstuff.com. I should have chicks available from all these colors, but I don't ship chicks (just sell locally).

 

[dheltzel]

How did you do this? I thought that Whitmore/Deer Run selected for autosexing.

"Autosexing" is a specific genetic designation of a wild-type chicks down (chipmunk stripes, like Welsummers) with the addition of the sex-linked barring gene (from a production barred rock in my case). Sexing Welsummer chicks is only somewhat accurate, the difference can be subtle, and there are many that you just can't be sure of as chicks. When I was selling Welsummer chicks, I had to keep back a fair number of them to grow out for a few weeks to be sure of the sexes. I created my Welbar line using the same recipe that was used to create the original line back in the 1940's in the UK (it took me 4 years of intensive selection to get them to truly autosex). They UK lines are not available here in the US (and quite hard to find in the UK, I've heard). Greenfire imported them, but last I heard could not get the autosexing right. My line autosexes 100% and I'm quite proud of that. They are much easier to sex than Cream Legbars (where the cream gene interferes with the chick patterning, you have to trust the head spots).
There are a few other people in the US that did what I did, but it is nearly impossible to find Welbars in most parts of the US. A few people have my line and are producing small quantities of them. One local friend is NPIP and hopes to be shipping Welbar chicks in the spring. Anyone local to SE PA can buy chicks directly from me.

 

[Redhead Rae]

I routinely make trips to the Lancaster and Quarryville areas, could you PM me details?

 

[FlomatonsFlocks]

What are welbars

"Autosexing" is a specific genetic designation of a wild-type chicks down (chipmunk stripes, like Welsummers) with the addition of the sex-linked barring gene (from a production barred rock in my case). Sexing Welsummer chicks is only somewhat accurate, the difference can be subtle, and there are many that you just can't be sure of as chicks. When I was selling Welsummer chicks, I had to keep back a fair number of them to grow out for a few weeks to be sure of the sexes. I created my Welbar line using the same recipe that was used to create the original line back in the 1940's in the UK (it took me 4 years of intensive selection to get them to truly autosex). They UK lines are not available here in the US (and quite hard to find in the UK, I've heard). Greenfire imported them, but last I heard could not get the autosexing right. My line autosexes 100% and I'm quite proud of that. They are much easier to sex than Cream Legbars (where the cream gene interferes with the chick patterning, you have to trust the head spots).
There are a few other people in the US that did what I did, but it is nearly impossible to find Welbars in most parts of the US. A few people have my line and are producing small quantities of them. One local friend is NPIP and hopes to be shipping Welbar chicks in the spring. Anyone local to SE PA can buy chicks directly from me.

What are welbars? More info please

 

[sealer39]

I am also raising chicken for a variety of colored eggs. I have 3 Hatchery FBCMs and they are very friendly birds. They lay well but the eggs are about 4 on the color scale. From what I can determine researching, the better they lay the lighter colored the egg. I just bought 6 Welsummer chicks because if I’m not going to get the extreme dark brown eggs from my FBCM then I might as well get some speckled eggs also. Welsummers are supposed to be better layers that FBCM also and production is important to me too. I’m no expert at this, I’m just describing the path I find myself on right now.