DE for worming?

[TN Henny Penny]

We were checking into ordering DE for our coop (we want to try the deep litter method). I saw something about using DE with feed for worms. We are feeding our chicks just straight 18% protein chick feed (they're going to be layers, not meat birds) and will progress to a layer feed when they are old enough. We're learning as we go and don't know that we need to worry much about worms (our run will have a roof). I've read some things that concern me about combining worm meds and egg production. If we have DE for the deep litter, will the chickens consume enough DE to help prevent worms and if so, will their eggs be safe for consumption?

Thanks for reading my post - we're learning so much so fast, but my brain is getting fried! Linda

 

[Mervin]

If you get food grade DE, you can mix it in feed. DE is used as an anti-caking agent in animal feed and is USDA approved for that application. Many will argue it's effectiveness as a wormer. When I sprinkle it around the coop periodically, I mix some in the feed too. It doesn't seem to harm anything and I haven't had any parasite outbreaks. Knock on wood.

 

[Bear Foot Farm]

I saw something about using DE with feed for worms.

Lots of people do it.

There is NO scientific evidence that it works at all.

Most of the places that suggest it also happen to SELL it.

I wouldn't waste my money on it for any use other than as an insecticide.

The ONLY reason it even has a "Food Grade" rating is it's used in grain to kill bugs, and can't be removed​

 

[mkearsley]

I doubt that it will do much for worms. DE is the shells tiny sea creatures that are very sharp on a microscopic level. It works by cutting the exoskeleton of crawling insects, so they basically bleed/dry out to death. Once it gets wet, though the effectiveness is drastically reduced. It might work to reduce the number of worm larvae that are in the manure (if you've already got worms), but when the birds ingest it, they're basically turning it to mush. I use it for earwigs, fleas, & the like. I have noticed little earwig bodies all over the place after I've used it, so I know it works. I've also started powdering the bird's dust-bath areas with DE so that any external parasite/bug gets hit by it when they bathe.

 

[rancher hicks]

I wasn't going to log in but I will,

I use DE in the can with my scratch to prevent moths. I use it for mites and put some in the feed on occasion. There is no scientific evidence it DOESN'T work. For a wormer I use Eprinex. It's safe and there is no egg withdrawl. I do everything to PREVENT a problem. I have not seen mites and as far as worms all seems well.

I sprinkle it in nest boxes where mites can hide. I leave a nest empty of hay rotating to give each a chance to dry out for a while.

There are many OP's on this forum so you have to decide whats best for you.

Wish you the best

Rancher

 

[Organics North]

Quote:
Why? I never understood this?
Broken glass on the floor is just as sharp as broken glass in the dishpan...

I am organic no chemicals for my birds. I have not had worms with the birds. Maybe it is just where I live...(never a puddle, fast draining ground) Maybe not..?

The stuff is cheap at the feed store. 50lbs for $12 or so. I use very little in the feed, it will not hurt. Combine it with other organic remedies would not hurt either if that is the direction you want to go.

If your birds get worms while using DE in the feed, well then it does not work for you. If you use it in your feed and do not get worms in your birds, then maybe it was the DE or maybe you just are not in an area prone to worms or your cleanliness practices are effective.

My birds have it super clean. A dry covered run, and then free range when it is not snow covered, so they are never walking around in muddy poop covered ground.

Lots of different experiences with the stuff here..

ON

 

[rancher hicks]

Quote:
Why? I never understood this?
Broken glass on the floor is just as sharp as broken glass in the dishpan...

I am organic no chemicals for my birds. I have not had worms with the birds. Maybe it is just where I live...(never a puddle, fast draining ground) Maybe not..?

The stuff is cheap at the feed store. 50lbs for $12 or so. I use very little in the feed, it will not hurt. Combine it with other organic remedies would not hurt either if that is the direction you want to go.

If your birds get worms while using DE in the feed, well then it does not work for you. If you use it in your feed and do not get worms in your birds, then maybe it was the DE or maybe you just are not in an area prone to worms or your cleanliness practices are effective.

My birds have it super clean. A dry covered run, and then free range when it is not snow covered, so they are never walking around in muddy poop covered ground.

Lots of different experiences with the stuff here..

ON

Chikckens can get worms for a number of sources from what I've read, EX. earthworms, slugs, and snails. You are right about wet areas, which i am spending thousands to rectify this spring. I wish I could find DE here for twelve dollars. I agree with the broken glass thing which is why I use it anyhow.

Some say it works, some say no. Me I say it can't hurt and it might help so no harm if I use it and it doesn't. Still it's good for mites and I haven't seen any so it must work. Plus when I had bird seed for the wild birds no matter what I did it'd get moths. So I mix it in with with the scratch. So far, so good.

I too would like organic, which is why I refuse to use anything that requires the withdrawl of eggs.

Ok I'll stop now.

Take care
Rancher

 

[Bear Foot Farm]

Why? I never understood this?
Broken glass on the floor is just as sharp as broken glass in the dishpan...

We aren't talking about broken glass, but rather a microscopic powder that clumps together when damp and floats when there is too much liquid.

The physics involved are totally different

DE kills hard shelled insects by both cutting AND DEHYDRATION.

It will not harm soft bodied organisms, and cannot dehydrate them if it's already saturated

If your birds get worms while using DE in the feed, well then it does not work for you.

It's effects don't change depending on who uses it.
It either works or it doesn't (and it doesn't) on internal parasites​

 

[ivan3]

Actually, amorphous diatomaceous earth, when fed to broilers, decreases absorption of nutrients. It will not `cut up worms'. It kills insects primarily by ADSORPTION. The more finely it is ground down the better it works (as an externally applied insecticide). It is a sorptive dust.

If you want to dig into the details: https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=294680&p=2 (post #20) https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=295586&p=2 (posts #'s 11/20/22).

 

[Organics North]

Quote:
We aren't talking about broken glass, but rather a microscopic powder that clumps together when damp and floats when there is too much liquid.

The physics involved are totally different

DE kills hard shelled insects by both cutting AND DEHYDRATION.

It will not harm soft bodied organisms, and cannot dehydrate them if it's already saturated

If your birds get worms while using DE in the feed, well then it does not work for you.

It's effects don't change depending on who uses it.
It either works or it doesn't (and it doesn't) on internal parasites​

You are correct in what you say. Yes we know it kills by dehydration, and in a moist environment it is hard to get dehydrated. Is the abrading action still not effective though?, so internal parasites are abraded and irritated... Know combine this with other natural approaches and maybe it works for some...

Therefor effects do change by who uses it... One who has healthy strong birds (healthy intestinal flora and fauna) in an environment with a low parasite load that uses DE along with OTHER organic/natural approches feel it MAY be helpful.......

I will give you that, DE is not a chemical bomb, that will purge a bird of worms in a week... Alternative minded folks realize this, it is simply one tool in the tool box of natural remidies..

ON