Deadly chicken behavior

[drumstick diva]

Do you think pinless peepers would disarm Cadbury, or annoy her just enough to distract her from Buffy? I've gotten hooked on this thread, it reads like a fine mystery.

I think this is a case made for MONK. Maybe he would come out of retirement just for this. Just feels like a piece of the puzzle is missing.

 

[amortonchick]

At this point we are willing to try anything although now that Cadbury is back to laying I'm afraid to rock the boat with added stress. Maybe she would resort to using her feet/claws if her beak wasn't an option. Buffy is so terrified of her even from afar, I just wish she would fight back even just a little. She seems healthy and back on track so she needs to break out with that typical RIR mannerism. Happy to hear this thread is like a mystery, we feel very challenged and would love to have an ending to it soon.

 

[blondiebee181]

I am curious where your birds would even contract E. Coli......doesn't seem like a very common disease for backyard chickens....I'm curious about that and need to do a little reading I guess...I work at a feed store here in Boise and I am affectionately known as "The Chicken Lady" in our company

So I like things like learning new things like this...Sour crop is when food does not pass through the crop and rots there, unless I am mistaken....Impacted crop is where food simply gets stuck, Internal laying is like EYP. It's where an egg does not fully form but the hens system continues to try to pass it through. If it gets stuck anywhere, and starts to fester, you get a bacterial infection that can be deadly...EYP.

 

[blondiebee181]

I was lucky enough to have SpeckledHen walk me through my issue with Daisy when she was feeling icky...reproductive problems in hatchery stock are not uncommon unfortunately....but luckily enough for me, an oral antibiotic cleared whatever it was up....but they don't always help...from the look of that gooey, cheesy mass that Buffy laid, that is probably what was making her ill and if you gave her antibiotics along the way and she has recovered, it sounds like she got off lucky. Very hard to say what happened to Andi unless you noticed any symptoms or send for a necropsy.

Buffy may never get along with Cadbury. Humans and chickens aren't so different in this respect. You can try isolating and re-introduction, but in the end they just may not get along...it happened and is not uncommon...

 

[blondiebee181]

BTW, most vets will do a fecal and I doubt it will cost much.

 

[amortonchick]

I am curious where your birds would even contract E. Coli......doesn't seem like a very common disease for backyard chickens....I'm curious about that and need to do a little reading I guess...I work at a feed store here in Boise and I am affectionately known as "The Chicken Lady" in our company

So I like things like learning new things like this...Sour crop is when food does not pass through the crop and rots there, unless I am mistaken....Impacted crop is where food simply gets stuck, Internal laying is like EYP. It's where an egg does not fully form but the hens system continues to try to pass it through. If it gets stuck anywhere, and starts to fester, you get a bacterial infection that can be deadly...EYP.

Forgive me if I sound redundant, can a bird have EYP without having first had E Coli? I am very curious about the E Coli now too if that is what we are even dealing with. We have a deep bedding in the run and I clean the coop once if not twice per week. All kinds of questions are going through my mind, like if when they eat from the floor of the run when I throw in scratch could they have contracted E Coli that way. I replace the water most days however I am guilty of not scrubbing down and cleaning their feeder every week.

I have read somewhere along the line that EYP is a genetic/hormone based malfunction having to do with the breeder where the chicks came from. We may never know what exactly happened to poor Andi and I do wish I could take her for a necropsy. Just to have the poop tested I was quoted $46 from our vet. I may give a call to an Avian vet and see if there is any price difference.

 

[amortonchick]

I was lucky enough to have SpeckledHen walk me through my issue with Daisy when she was feeling icky...reproductive problems in hatchery stock are not uncommon unfortunately....but luckily enough for me, an oral antibiotic cleared whatever it was up....but they don't always help...from the look of that gooey, cheesy mass that Buffy laid, that is probably what was making her ill and if you gave her antibiotics along the way and she has recovered, it sounds like she got off lucky. Very hard to say what happened to Andi unless you noticed any symptoms or send for a necropsy.

Buffy may never get along with Cadbury. Humans and chickens aren't so different in this respect. You can try isolating and re-introduction, but in the end they just may not get along...it happened and is not uncommon...

My favorite girl was a Speckled Sussex, also name Daisy. Such a sweet breed, I sure miss her. She was our first and only predator death. I was devastated. I think it may be safe to say Buffy has gotten off easy, she currently lives like a princess carried to and from her day and night places. She has become a different hen through all of this and would be happier hanging out with us (in the house even) then with the flock. As for the recent picture of the cheesy mass, that is what Andi laid the day before she died. Early in Buffy's illness she did leave some egg like matter (more runny) nothing like Andi's big wad, so again maybe Buffy fought it off better than Andi. I'm going to call an Avian vet today and get some pricing, but we are up to our ears in spending as we are building a much larger double coop with multiple runs for when we integrate the 10 new chicks and 2 ducks with the mature girls. I will be out painting today and plan to "force" Buffy to be outside with me and the three other hens. I'm sure it will result in her running and hiding from Cad but my husband says they need to figure it out. Buffy has been isolated since early March with visits to the run which don't end well and a couple nights in the coop in hopes that reintroducing in the night would be better. Come morning, Cadbury always turned on her. I was out at sun up to observe and watch it happen. I think your last statement "in the end they just may not get along" may be our reality. We will see how it goes today and as hard as it is to watch I may let it happen and see if Cora, my top girl gets bossy with Cadbury....wishful thinking.

 

[blondiebee181]

Yes, chickens can get EYP without E. Coli present...as far as I have understood in my brief reading...E.Coli is an ever-present bacteria that is perfectly harmless unless it migrates to a part of the body it isn't supposed to be (like with an already sick bird) then it starts to cause problems. From what you have said about Andi, it sounds like she had EYP and even though she managed to pass the mass it could just have been too late and the infection go the best of her....was she showing symptoms prior?

I'm pretty good at keeping my bedding and run clean (and always more so after reading the disease/injury thread

) But I typically only do a vinegar scrub of the feeder and waterer once a year.

 

[justplainbatty]

Yes, chickens can get EYP without E. Coli present...as far as I have understood in my brief reading...E.Coli is an ever-present bacteria that is perfectly harmless unless it migrates to a part of the body it isn't supposed to be (like with an already sick bird) then it starts to cause problems. From what you have said about Andi, it sounds like she had EYP and even though she managed to pass the mass it could just have been too late and the infection go the best of her....was she showing symptoms prior?

I'm pretty good at keeping my bedding and run clean (and always more so after reading the disease/injury thread

) But I typically only do a vinegar scrub of the feeder and waterer once a year.

You are exactly right. E.coli is everywhere. If the bacteria enters the body in a mass of egg follicles or where ever, it's the perfect medium for the bacteria to grow. So, a good antibiotic is best to combat it . It is best to get a fecal done to determine the strain and then the right antibiotic.
Some hens will have internal laying and are able to reabsorb everything and eventually return to laying. I just had this problem with one of my EE's. She had the penguin stance, quit laying and had a firm but spongy abdomen. Over the past couple months, her abdomen got smaller and then, wow, eggs from her! She recovered on her own much to my surprise, I thought she may have had ascites too but apparently not! She doesn't stand like a penguin anymore either. I clean my coop once a week (between 7-9 days) bc the general life cycle of worms is 10 days. Cleaning the coop before new worm eggs can hatch, saves my chickens and me much grief. I clean their waterer every other day with dish soap and bleach. The galvanized feeders get cleaned a few times a year or whenever they seem cruddy. I put wet treats in stainless containers or on paper plates so that there is no wet gunk in the main feeders ever.
ETA: it is also true about the two birds maybe never getting along, maybe cadbury and Buffy just need to be in separate flocks.

what else can you do....

 

[blondiebee181]

I would not clean anything they eat or drink out of with bleach......