deleware ?

[Spangled]

Yay! Thanks for the reply and photos. Interesting.

Any other info that you may like to share on the White New Hampshires would be interesting and instructive, too. Athough, I would totally understand if you're saving it for your breeding book or your memoirs. No. Seriously. You are keeping good notes and are publishing someday, right?

 

[Chris09]

Quote:

The link. No ... well, yes, among probably 200 links, but finding it again would be much more difficult for me than one might assume. I was not paying attention to the White New Hampshires; I was researching another topic.

So, the info is out there on the interwebs, and you know how to use a search engine as well as the next guy. Finding a .pdf viewer with a good search feature will probably help, too. I'm not sure it was a .pdf, but I was looking at a bunch of .pdfs that day. It's easy to find the ads for the White New Hampshires, but the article or book is out there, too.

If I stumble across it while going over the information again, if I go over it again, I'll try to post it somewhere here and then PM you. Hopefully you'll be willing to do the same for me. If you come across a link from an old publication or .edu web site that mentions that there were no "pure" White New Hampshire chickens in the U.S., please include that link, too.

But let's remember ... just because I haven't included the link, I am not completely discredited. My questions are reasonable or worth answering. I could phrase a question like this: What if someone tried to recreate a Delaware with a White New Hampshire? Or what if someone, after hatching out 300+ chicks, did get that elusive sport (Has this sport been documented?), and then made Delawares with it? My original post was nothing but friendly, but I fear Chris may not have seen it that way. As a BYC Educator, I would hope Chris would enjoy questions from people trying to learn from others such as kathyinmo (as her time permits). But curiosity sometimes kills the cat and gets people in trouble.

How did I come off "Unfriendly" to you?
I asked you a simple question and provided you with some imformation.

As I stated in my past post by breeding for a White New Hampshire you are also breeding out the Columbian pattern that is needed for a properly marked Delaware.
Now one would be far better off breeding for a Columbian pattern New Hampshire than a White New Hampshire since you will need the the Black in the tail, hackles, and wings to recreate a proper marked Delaware.


Chris

 

[catdaddyfro]

Quote:

How did I come off "Unfriendly" to you?
I asked you a simple question and provided you with some imformation.

As I stated in my past post by breeding for a White New Hampshire you are also breeding out the Columbian pattern that is needed for a properly marked Delaware.
Now one would be far better off breeding for a Columbian pattern New Hampshire than a White New Hampshire since you will need the the Black in the tail, hackles, and wings to recreate a proper marked Delaware.


Chris

Well I'll try to do a little clearing of the air here on the above statement and don't anybody get sore here we're all just passing and re-passing info here. Chris is correct on needing the Columbian pattern from the NH (also know as red -Columbian/black-tailed red). Another reason that the white NH would not be a good choice is most white birds are either dominant white which genetically will cover all color with the exception of bleed though in some spots, or they are recessive white which could be masking any color underneath(genetically) black, red, barring, ect... in other words you really don't know whats hiding in their gene pool.

The Columbian pattern is needed in the mix to dilute the barring in the body plumage and also move the barring( which is genetically black with white barring) to the outer most areas of the plumage(ie. tail, neck, and wings). This is why the color pattern of the Delaware is refered to as barred Columbian, diluted or gradient barring.

Jeff

 

[Lacey1988]

I find genetics so fascinating because I have a cross between a Red Star Roo/Silver Laced Wyandotte Hen that looks almost the copy of a deleware except she has a rose comb of course. I put her on here before and someone pointed out to me that the roo(a red star/her father) was probably half deleware...Weird huh

 

[Chris09]

I find genetics so fascinating because I have a cross between a Red Star Roo/Silver Laced Wyandotte Hen that looks almost the copy of a deleware except she has a rose comb of course. I put her on here before and someone pointed out to me that the roo(a red star/her father) was probably half deleware...Weird huh

I would say she has Columbian Wyandotte some where in her background. I dont any see barring.

Here is a Barred Wyandotte (not my bird)

 

[Lacey1988]

I would say she has Columbian Wyandotte some where in her background. I dont any see barring.

Here is a Barred Wyandotte (not my bird)

Well she is a mutt so I doubt she would totally look like one...Do they use that breed to create a Red Star?

 

[Spangled]

How did I come off "Unfriendly" to you?

Oh, Chris. I'm going to ask you as nicely as possible to not put words in my mouth. At no time did I say (type) or imply that you were "unfriendly." Please don't say that I did.

 

[Spangled]

Chris is correct on needing the Columbian pattern from the NH (also know as red -Columbian/black-tailed red). Another reason that the white NH would not be a good choice is most white birds are either dominant white which genetically will cover all color with the exception of bleed though in some spots, or they are recessive white which could be masking any color underneath(genetically) black, red, barring, ect... in other words you really don't know whats hiding in their gene pool.

The Columbian pattern is needed in the mix to dilute the barring in the body plumage and also move the barring( which is genetically black with white barring) to the outer most areas of the plumage(ie. tail, neck, and wings). This is why the color pattern of the Delaware is refered to as barred Columbian, diluted or gradient barring.

Jeff

Okay. Thank you, Jeff. It looks to me like you and Chris are saying that it's impossible for a White New Hampshire to have been used to create Delawares in the past.

And Chris, it looks like there's obviously no point in me sharing the link if I run across is again. Thanks for your time, guys.

 

[Chris09]

Oh, Chris. I'm going to ask you as nicely as possible to not put words in my mouth. At no time did I say (type) or imply that you were "unfriendly." Please don't say that I did.

I'm sorry but when you make a post like,

Quote:
That makes me think that you think my post was unfriendly.

Chris

 

[catdaddyfro]

Okay. Thank you, Jeff. It looks to me like you and Chris are saying that it's impossible for a White New Hampshire to have been used to create Delawares in the past.

And Chris, it looks like there's obviously no point in me sharing the link if I run across is again. Thanks for your time, guys.

Well no, I didn't say that. I was just merely stating that to make a properly patterned Delaware you'll have to have some type columbian gene in the mix. If you or somebody else wants to breed A White New Hampshire to something for generations to see if they are masking columbian then more power to ya'll/them, go for it.

The plan(recipe) is already laid out there, Mrs. Kathy is proving it and I too will be hatching F2's out of the Delaware project boys and girls I received from Mrs. Kathy last year, I'm putting them into the breeder pen this weekend and will have eggs to set in approx. 2-3 weeks from then and I'm too excited/stoked

to mention (how) here on this family based forum.

Jeff