Diary & Notes ~ Air Cell Detatched SHIPPED Chicken Eggs for incubation and hatching

[my4ladies]

Can someone read through my post and tell me if this is the definition of a "detached air cell"? ...please?

This was me... and now I'm here

Thank you, Sally, for your help.

So, I'm thinking now that I made a mistake...I don't think it's actually liquid INSIDE the air cell.. Maybe some of you more seasoned shipped-egg hatchers see this regularly. Is this just a typical "detached air cell"?

I'll describe it and maybe someone can tell me:

I think the membrane got separated from the shell a little bit...so it's still intact, but the membrane separating the air cell from the egg contacts is not tight. (Is this what "detached" is referring to?). I was able to mark the air cell if I set it horizontally and marked at the top of the egg, rotating it around. Once marked, if I held it with the large end up and tipped it horizontally, I could see what looked like liquid moving inside the marked areas. It think it was actually just the contents of the egg moving back into place (where it would've been if the air cell never got separated). It looked "watery" then, at day 11. Here are a couple pictures at day 13 with it less "watery" when moved...more like "jiggly" :



the solid line is where the air cell is attached to the shell. The dotted line is where the contents moved to when tipped set horizontally. So, if I set the egg upright (big end up), this line would slide down and be about level with the solid line. I noticed that the air space when the egg is horizontal is about the correct size for an air cell at this day...right? This is making sense to me now that I'm writing it all out.

 

[Sally Sunshine]

I use feed with amprolium. Think about it from an immunology aspect. If the amprolium weakens the coccidia, its like giving a live, attenuated vaccine. It weakens the coccidia so that the chicks own immune system can fight it off and gain an immunity. It doesn't weaken the chick and its a lot easier on the organ system than sulfa drugs can be.

However, when the coccidia becomes really bad, I keep a bottle of Albon on hand and I gavage them with it so that I know that they're getting an exact dosage.

ACV probably helps because it has live cultures in it (the good stuff does, anyway). This is like giving them probiotics. I top-dress my chicks and chickens feed (for adults with crop issues) with a supplement called G.U.T. Its made for horses, but it works really well for chickens.

When they have coccidia, the lining of their intestines starts sloughing and hemorrhaging. G.U.T. not only has probiotics in it, it also has something called L. glutamine which is an essential amino acid that aids in the repair of mucous membranes (Its also really good for people with ulcers, collitis and crohns disease), an antacid and a number of other nutrients which will give the immune system a boost. My horse had a perforated stomach, gas from her stomach was leaking into her thoracic cavity and retracting her lungs, the ulcers were so bad. I treated her with omeprazole and then gut and she has made a full recovery.

I recently had an outbreak of coccidia in one of my brooders and I gavaged with Albon and gut dissolved in water and they all went from varying degrees of diarrhea and partially digested bloody poop to solid poop in, literally a day.

I also had a hen with a really bad, chronic sour crop. I started her on this and she has the best feeling crop out of all of my birds now. She has started laying reliably again. Things are going well. I highly recommend this supplement. (Its highly palatable too, if I'm hungry when I'm feeding, I just want to gobble it).

interesting!

I have my word file medicine cabinet, sometime I will get it in order.
I think everyone needs an med cabinet for chickens! and not "as you go adding to it" stuff that. you will probably need, for worms, crop and intestinal issues old and young, sniffles sneezes, bumblefoot and on and on....

 

[Sally Sunshine]

Maybe y'all should just make FF!!! ANOTHER good reason for FF!!

Mich awwwww do you have them on corid?

I always use a dash in waterers because it keeps them from stinking too!

 

[Sally Sunshine]

Can someone read through my post and tell me if this is the definition of a "detached air cell"? ...please?
Quote: I had a link in the pm, and there is a video there too and I suggested leaving it air cell up, but you have it under a broody, I wouldn't handle it too much, looks like the hen knows what she is doing with it. I would love to see a candle video so we can see it. and yes it sure looks like a broken air cell. YOUR SURE YOU SEE VEINS AND GROWTH? and not just yolk (have to ask some believe the yolk is the baby!) https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/hatching-eggs-101

Shipped Eggs = Change Of Plans!
Shipped eggs have a MUCH lower hatch rate, even with experienced hatchers!
The following Word File can be used when ordering shipped eggs,
it is our suggestion that you copy/paste/edit to help you get the best eggs possible.​

An open letter to egg shippers.doc 27k .doc file



It’s always best to get local eggs to get the best hatch rate. Sources for eggs are to search the BYC buy sell trade section, Craigslist and eBay. Your local thread on BYC may be the best bet for local eggs! Look for your local site in the “Social section” “Where am I? Where are You!” on BYC.

BELOW ROLLING AIR CELL OF A SHIPPED EGG
Rolls like a Carpenters Level


Important Links to AIR CELL DAMAGE...​

UNDERSTANDING what goes WRONG with SHIPPED EGGS
The yolk of an egg is held in place on each end by what is called Chalaza. These are delicate cords that keep the yolk centered in the egg. When you crack open an egg, you notice a white stringy thing on the yolk, this is the Chalaza. When eggs are shipped they encounter postal handlers that toss the packages, sorting machinery, bumpy vehicle rides, temperature changes and possibly X-ray Machines! So by the time the eggs get to you they are pretty much scrambled inside. So if you are going to buy eggs and have them shipped to you, be aware that the viability drops TREMENDOUSLY. There are rare instances when they ALL arrive safely but it is always a gamble. See Egg anatomy here http://www.geauga4h.org/poultry/egg_parts.htm



CONCLUSION ~ Shipped eggs
For rolling, detached or disrupted air cells (cells no longer at fat end of the egg but like a bubble level on the long side, rolling or saddle shaped cells), you’ll need to change your hatch plan. They need to sit 24 hours NO TURNING, pointy end down in a Styrofoam Egg Carton with the bottoms cut out for ventilation to possibly reattach air cells. Allow eggs to sit in a moderately cool, somewhat humid place for 12-24 hours before you begin to incubate them. Basements are great. Moderately cool means 65-75 degrees with the fat end UP. After settle period SET Shipped eggs in the incubator in the carton with bottoms cut out as pictured below, do not turn for 36-48 hours to help air cell re-attach. I personally have found that any shipped egg that survives to day 18 lockdown has an awkward but re-attached air cell so I lay my eggs down for hatch. Please refer to day 18 lockdown for more information on why laying eggs for hatching after day 18 is the best way to go. After 36-48 hours begin turning or hand turn by laying the eggs side to side 3 times a day, as in the image below. REMINDER~ Never Set COLD eggs in the incubator.


Below image are Eggs in A Carton with Bottoms cut out for Ventilation



Below image of Turning Shipped Eggs, just lean to opposite side.



SHIPPED EGGS & Malpositions!
BELOW ARE "SADDLE" SHAPED AIR CELLS

SADDLE SHAPED AIR CELLS are very COMMON with shipped eggs!​

Saddle shaped is when one or both sides have a large "dip" in the air cell. A lot of times with saddle shaped cells the chick doesn’t position correct for hatching and their feet can easily get stuck behind their head and “smoosh” the chick so they can’t move, it can also force the yolk sack and everything more north in the shell.... Keep a close eye on these eggs and its VERY important to pencil mark Air cells!​

 

[Sally Sunshine]

I will add, by day 18 it will be more jello jiggly like consistency. Being under a hen there isn't much we can tell you to do, but keep an eye on it when the others hatch


and if that solid line is the air cell line, it sure lost ALOT of fluid, from its leaking issues, your positive its a good egg? this is just weird!

 

[NestingHillsSC]

Thank God you didnt. Ive been buying the ones with the dark colors to them. They are real pretty.
Thats what I hear. My garden died from the last cold spell. Im going to put out some tomato plants when it warms back up and should have my pen ready for all those chicks. Ive gotta get them out of the garage because round two is going to start happening next week and I need the Brooders emptied.

I already have tons of strawberries. Everything here in SC growing good. Beans have there 3rd set of leaves starting.

 

[Sally Sunshine]

you know something keeps nagging the back of my mind! Do you know that Infectious bronchitis in chickens can lead to watery eggs in the hen.
These eggs are shipped and not yours correct? I think I read that in the BYC health learning sections because I have a copy paste in my word file!

Table 1

Infectious Bronchitis

Synonyms: IB, bronchitis, cold

Species affected: Infectious bronchitis is a disease of chickens only. A similar disease occurs in bobwhite quail (quail bronchitis), but it is caused by a different virus.

Clinical signs: The severity of infectious bronchitis infection is influenced by the age and immune status of the flock, by environmental conditions, and by the presence of other diseases. Feed and water consumption declines. Affected chickens will be chirping, with a watery discharge from the eyes and nostrils, and labored breathing with some gasping in young chickens. Breathing noises are more noticeable at night while the birds rest. Egg production drops dramatically. Production will recover in 5 or 6 weeks, but at a lower rate. The infectious bronchitis virus infects many tissues of the body, including the reproductive tract (see Table 1 ). Eggshells become rough and the egg white becomes watery. (See publication PS-24, Egg Quality, for other causes of poor egg quality.)

Transmission: Infectious bronchitis is a very contagious poultry disease. It is spread by air, feed bags, infected dead birds, infected houses, and rodents. The virus can be egg-transmitted, however, affected embryos usually will not hatch.

Treatment: There is no specific treatment for infectious bronchitis. Antibiotics for 3-5 days may aid in combating secondary bacterial infections. Raise the room temperature 5°F for brooding-age chickens until symptoms subside. Baby chicks can be encouraged to eat by using a warm, moist mash.

Prevention: Establish and enforce a biosecurity program. Vaccinations are available.

 

[PrnzsButtrcluck]

Sigh. People are such idiots sometimes. My daughter went through serious speach therapy, & will only be going once a week next year due to her hard work & incredible milestones. However, my other 2 are blue-eyed blondes, fair-skinned. She has a bit more olive, brown eyes, tans well, and has an "accent". (She does sound Cuban) Everyone thinks she's adopted. I always wonder why it even matters so much to people? All children are beautiful, & love just happens and we get what we get. When is it that we learn to judge & criticize? Children certainly don't see those differences. We live in the boonies now, too, but even in the city, everyone was divided. My girls will say "there is a beautiful girl on Tv", and I'll go look, and she'll be black, Latino, Asian. The kids don't specify race. All they see is beauty. Atleast my kids do.

 

[NestingHillsSC]

you know something keeps nagging the back of my mind! Do you know that Infectious bronchitis in chickens can lead to watery eggs in the hen.
These eggs are shipped and not yours correct? I think I read that in the BYC health learning sections because I have a copy paste in my word file!

Table 1

Infectious Bronchitis

Synonyms: IB, bronchitis, cold

Species affected: Infectious bronchitis is a disease of chickens only. A similar disease occurs in bobwhite quail (quail bronchitis), but it is caused by a different virus.

Clinical signs: The severity of infectious bronchitis infection is influenced by the age and immune status of the flock, by environmental conditions, and by the presence of other diseases. Feed and water consumption declines. Affected chickens will be chirping, with a watery discharge from the eyes and nostrils, and labored breathing with some gasping in young chickens. Breathing noises are more noticeable at night while the birds rest. Egg production drops dramatically. Production will recover in 5 or 6 weeks, but at a lower rate. The infectious bronchitis virus infects many tissues of the body, including the reproductive tract (see Table 1 ). Eggshells become rough and the egg white becomes watery. (See publication PS-24, Egg Quality, for other causes of poor egg quality.)

Transmission: Infectious bronchitis is a very contagious poultry disease. It is spread by air, feed bags, infected dead birds, infected houses, and rodents. The virus can be egg-transmitted, however, affected embryos usually will not hatch.

Treatment: There is no specific treatment for infectious bronchitis. Antibiotics for 3-5 days may aid in combating secondary bacterial infections. Raise the room temperature 5°F for brooding-age chickens until symptoms subside. Baby chicks can be encouraged to eat by using a warm, moist mash.

Prevention: Establish and enforce a biosecurity program. Vaccinations are available.

WHO??

 

[rbaker0345]

Sally! don't give corrid continuously! When you are administering an antibiotic, you are killing off MOST of the bacteria. When you give a little bit of antibiotics every day, you are killing the bacteria that are sensitive to the antibiotic and growing, nay, cultivating the bacteria that have a resistance to it. Antibiotics that work, work because they kill off the vast majority of bacteria (and, yes I know coccidia are not really bacteria, but they're close to it). There will still be a few individual bacteria that have a resistance to the antibiotic, but a few bacteria is few enough for your immune system to get rid of. When you cultivate resistant bacteria, they eventually outnumber the ones that are not resistant.

The good news is that single-celled organisms multiply so quickly that it only takes six weeks for the resistance to disappear in the majority of the population once the antibiotic is taken away.