Do mixed ages and breeds cause stress -- or not?

[deborahca]

OK, let me try this: many of the responders have indicated that space is key in their mixed-breed/species set up. I'm looking at limited space. Right now I have materials to set up for 23 square feet of run space (part of which is under the coop) and about 7 square feet of coop plus a nestbox area sticking out from that. I figured no more than 2-3 hens to start with in that space. Since hawks are very common here, I can't see having anything but covered run area. Is this a much smaller area than most folks with diverse flocks are working with? Since winters are mostly mild, I'm assuming I can consider all of this year round living space.

 

[StruckBy]

Personally I wouldn't keep more than 2, MAYBE 3 but only if they got let out under supervision. I did keep 2 hens, a RIR & something else I can't dredge up atm, in a space that size when I lived in Denver for a few years but I still let them out to run around the entire backyard whenever we were home & awake. With that few birds there won't be a problem with them forming little sub-flocks that need to get away from each other. Unless you're planning a significant expansion it doesn't sound like you'll be integrating new birds anyway...it will be a straight replace or possibly replace one if something happens. You'll be fine with whatever combo of breeds you like best.

 

[deborahca]

I will likely expand the covered run space eventually, and I'd like a tractor-like arrangement for a day pen so they can be moved around the property. I'd like to be able to keep four eventually. I just don't think they'd last long unprotected and unsupervised. But I don't want to start by overcrowding what I realize is limited space. At least I didn't say I wanted to put 6 chickens in there!

Let me ask the question this way. Short of free-ranging HOW MUCH space, enclosed in some manner, would be necessary to keep a mixed flock of four hens happy? And would the number be any smaller if all hens were the same breed or at least very close in size and general appearance?

 

[StruckBy]

I will likely expand the covered run space eventually, and I'd like a tractor-like arrangement for a day pen so they can be moved around the property. I'd like to be able to keep four eventually. I just don't think they'd last long unprotected and unsupervised. But I don't want to start by overcrowding what I realize is limited space. At least I didn't say I wanted to put 6 chickens in there!

Let me ask the question this way. Short of free-ranging HOW MUCH space, enclosed in some manner, would be necessary to keep a mixed flock of four hens happy? And would the number be any smaller if all hens were the same breed or at least very close in size and general appearance?

I'm the wrong person to answer this because I really don't think most backyard chicken keepers are giving their birds enough space in the runs...the coops can be much tighter. For me, when I look at the space I ask myself if I would be comfortable with that amount of space for a dog or cat of comparable size to live in 24/7? Yes, I know they don't NEED that much space to survive (as demonstrated by commercial growers), but I think it's better for them. My chickens are just about as smart as my pug (who granted is an idiot next to my rottie

). Also, the less square footage per bird, the more work you absolutely must keep up with cleaning, bedding, etc to avoid illness, foot problems, parasite transmission, etc. I really don't think with that few birds the breed/type/size is going to make that much difference as long as they are raised together (obviously, don't get anything known for being aggressive but I'm sure you weren't planning on that anyway). I would suggest going over to the coop design section (if you haven't already) and look at what people have built for different #s of birds and seeing what you'd be comfortable with. Everyone needs to come up with their own answer & best way for keeping their birds.

Good luck...I'm sure you'll end up having a lot of fun with them. This hobby is expensive & a lot of work so you might as well get the breeds that you really want. I just got my first sebrights (that I've wanted for 20 years but never bought because they weren't 'practical') and wish I would have done it years ago!

 

[bobbi-j]

Short of free-ranging HOW MUCH space, enclosed in some manner, would be necessary to keep a mixed flock of four hens happy? And would the number be any smaller if all hens were the same breed or at least very close in size and general appearance?

I free range (most of the time) so I can't answer the first question, except to say that no matter how much space you think you need, give them more. Watch your birds. If they show signs of overcrowding, make their space bigger. I'm not a math person, so it's too much work for me to figure out the how-many-square-feet-per-bird thing. I just watch to make sure they're all getting along in the space they have. (They're not free ranging this winter, because they don't like to go out in the snow) Now, onto your second question - I don't think it's going to matter whether or not they're the same breed or color, and I'm not even sure about the size because I had a bantam cochin hen that wintered with my LF chickens for two years with no trouble. Chickens are chickens and will need enough space regardless of whether they're the same breed or not.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Sorry, I'm late getting back. I had computer problems.

Follow the link in my signature to see my opinions on space for chickens. That might help you see why I don't believe in magic numbers for chickens. There are so many variables in their individual personalities, in your management techniques, and your climate I can't give you a hard and fast number.

From my experience, I don't think them being the same breed or different breeds will make a bit of difference. I don't think size will make any difference. Maturity will. They need to be about the same stage of maturity. As mentioned above, bantams often get along well with full-sized fowl. It's not unusual for a bantam to be dominant over a full-sized chicken. Personality matters more than size. I've had some "full-sized" fowl that are much smaller than others full-sized chickens in the flock. It did not matter.

I have never kept the walking toilet brushes or the ones that come with blinders, so I can't speak about them from experience. It's possible some of them might be prone to more problems in a flock, but you'll fine many people on here with the Silkies or Polish in their flocks that don't have those problems.

Several of us have told you the breed and color doesn't matter but we obviously haven't been able to convince you. Fair enough. Since you're this concerned about it, stop stressing yourself. Just get them all the same breed and color. Then all this stress you obviously have about that goes away.

 

[deborahca]

I'm not stressed, I'm just trying to understand what is driving people's opinions. I got about as many answers that it may be a problem as I did that it may not, so I was seeking to get those who think it IS to elaborate a bit more on their answers. Just collecting data here!

 

[chickengeorgeto]

I'm not stressed, I'm just trying to understand what is driving people's opinions. I got about as many answers that it may be a problem as I did that it may not, so I was seeking to get those who think it IS to elaborate a bit more on their answers. Just collecting data here!

The thing that I think that is confusing everyone is the term "Breed" We humans think in racial terms when we hear the word breed, but chickens do not. The only thing that a chicken studies is its place is in the pecking order. A hen can normally only recognize about 100 of her fellow chickens by sight. These 100 or so chickens then constitute one flock. This is why commercial chicken farmers can keep thousands and thousands of hens or broilers in the same building, because they self segregate themselves into "flocks" and don't readily move around the chicken house unless acted on by an outside force like a farm worker or a poultry curtain.

If this was not so, all heck would break loose in a commercial poultry house with 15,000 to 40,000 birds vying for that one special top spot in the overall pecking order. Instead there may be 200 to 400 smaller flocks each with its own pecking order that all the birds in that flock recognizes. Therefor each and every bird understands where its flock is and where its place is in that flock.

This is also why large producers of free-range eggs can open the doors of their "free-range" hen houses every day and not have the problems back yarders do rounding up their hens in the evening. Most of these 100 bird flocks never push the boundaries of their world past the flock level and go outside the hen house because they don't know their place in the pecking order of the adjoining flocks. None of this need apply to free range broilers because they are bred (there's that word again) to be as shiftless and lazy as a bird can be. They would make the perfect prison inmate, because 3 hot's and a cot is all the ambition a broiler possesses.

But if you put a chicken with diminished abilities (Polish, silkie, bantam) in with a flock of standard "bred" chickens with few differences, then every standard bred chicken feels safe pushing around the strange diminished abilities chicken. The only exception is when a chicken has the space to self segregates its self. Every day I see posts on this forum where people mention that one or two of their hens range by themselves and that they insist on roosting alone and they resist being put in the coop at night with the other chickens. The reason is that hen knows that she is not a part of that flock. If you have or ever had hens or roosters like the above, now you know the reason way.

 

[StruckBy]

But if you put a chicken with diminished abilities (Polish, silkie, bantam) in with a flock of standard "bred" chickens with few differences, then every standard bred chicken feels safe pushing around the strange diminished abilities chicken. The only exception is when a chicken has the space to self segregates its self. Every day I see posts on this forum where people mention that one or two of their hens range by themselves and that they insist on roosting alone and they resist being put in the coop at night with the other chickens. The reason is that hen knows that she is not a part of that flock. If you have or ever had hens or roosters like the above, now you know the reason way.

I agree with most of this, but not the part about silkies & bantams being automatically on the bottom. On the occasions where I had a flock that included both, the silkie roosters reigned over the brahmaX rooster, and my little bantam hens were best friends with some of my larger hens. The queen of the coop was a bantam silkie hen who ruled it over EVERYONE. It was actually my biggest hens that were lowest on the pecking order & semi-outcast. Individual temperament has MUCH more to do with it than breed. I'll leave Polish out of it because I've never owned them & none of my silkies had enough of a topknot to impair their vision.