Dog barking and separation anxiety at night

[ShrekDawg]

Ugh he just fixated on a dog. Thankfully we were in our woods on the hill so probably like 1000 feet from the road but you can see the road. He fixated almost pulled but I got him to sit. He stood up a few times but got him to sit. But he was so fixated. Pulling with the choker didn't work. Thankfully I had the zap collar too in case he got loose again (last night i tried to make him run and his collar slipped off cause he slowed down lol) so i zapped him, both nick and continous with zero reaction. Tried tightening it. Zero reaction. Still 100% fixated. Even tried the Cesar tsh bite thing. Some of this stuff worked for a few seconds but then after he looked away he fixated. The cesar thing he looked away but not at me but the dog was also starting to leave. I even lifted him up for just a couple seconds. I know some say that's cruel and yeah probably is and I will not do it again but he was getting into deeper fixation and hair raised so I was desperate to prevent anything. Eventually we kept walking. Maybe it was my freaking out and all the correction over stimulating him that caused him to fixate? Maybe he sensed the change to nervousness? Or maybe I should have just kept walking and never let him sit and fixate to begin with? Then in the yard on the way back he kept lookong over there but a few tss stopped him. But thenwe got home, he ate food then got back on the bed and started barking. So I hit the continuous button for a second and told him no and he seems to have shut up. So the collar is useful for something at least. I want to work on teaching no barking at inappropriate things. And it seems to have worked so far the one time I tried it.

But why would he fixate on a dog on the road below like that? I don't like that. Barking is one thing. But the Pyr fixate and stare thing I do not like and it's scary on such a big dog.

 

[dainerra]

the problem with the other dog is, once he because focused, you were already too late. The only thing you can do is catch him BEFORE he is concentrating on the other dog.
Using the zap collar at the wrong time can actually make those type of situations much worse.
He actually did very well and your corrections were over the top for the situation. Once he was focused, you had already lost that battle. So, in training terms, you were correcting him for things that he didn't even understand.

Cesar Milan is a menace and absolutely useless for dog training. His methods, at best, are a last ditch effort for dogs that are facing death because of their behavior problems. Even then, they are often a short term fix before the dog relapses into even worse behavior.


For the barking, teach an "enough" command. He starts barking, you look to see the cause. Tell him "good boy. ENOUGH" and if he doesn't stop barking, take him in. Dogs are able to quickly learn what you want to be alerted to by your response. Also, it's best that they learn that their job is the alert and then you take over. He will also learn that barking at deer, squirrels, inappropriate items, will result in him being taken inside or otherwise removed from the situation.
Barking is a self-rewarding behavior so it takes work to teach them appropriate times to alert and when to ignore

 

[ShrekDawg]

Yeah, I figured that was the problem but I didn't notice the dog until he was fixating. Maybe I should have just kept walking though? But then he would never learn not to do that. I might get some treats next time and maybe work some more on look at me LAT. I did a year or so ago but stopped training. I heard some people use CAT too or a combo and there's a third, I think BAT?, not really sure which is best but they supposedly all worm really well for reactivity so I'm going to try it. Although I wonder if that's even a good idea? Maybe just walking past the dogs or turning around is best?

But yeah, I suppose I really overreacted but he has lunged at other dogs before so I thought he might and in my mind he was being really bad. Now that you say he wasn't though and I think about, I suppose you're right that he wasn't. I mean, if he wanted to, he COULD have ignored and overpowered me anyways and lunged or barked. He did try to get past me towards the end when his hair was standing up but I stopped him in time. But I guess he easily could have been a lot worse. Either way, I won't do that again.

And yeah I know, when I was on a dog blog there was tons of stuff on it which is why i told my parents not to do that anymore, but i was desperate aha that said, some of the stuff he says is just common sense or stuff every dog trainer says. Like more exercise and teaching a place command for SA. although even in that he was trying to nudge junior onto the bed... he was scared and shut down cause he didnt know what he wanted. wouldve gone much better with treats.

That's a good idea, I never thought of bringing him inside as a punishment but I suppose it is and kinder and more effective than the collar. Thanks. But what if he's inside? He barks out the window too. Can't exactly bring him inside from inside.... but WAIT. Could I make him get off the bed and block access to that room? Does that count?

 

[dainerra]

You can keep walking. Remove him from the situation. otherwise, you are simply allowing him to feed into his fixation. And, if he does act up and the other dog leaves, he's been rewarded - "I'm such a big bad dog. I made the intruder go away"

Even if you have to drag him away, keep walking.

When you have a reactive dog, it takes a lot of work to keep on top of things. Always keep a close eye on him and his body language as well as the surroundings. If you see his attention turn in a certain direction, intercept him THEN. Before he even has a chance to see what is over there. "Bob, let's go" and keep on walking. Even better, turn and go another way.
Get his brain focused on what YOU are doing instead of what else is out there. Once you are in a better spot, have a little "good dog" celebration and reward him for paying attention. Simply allowing him to go back to focusing on the smells in the woods is a good reward

 

[ShrekDawg]

That makes a lot of sense! Thanks

I'm going to try all that! I think just turning around is probably better. Curious on your thoughts on some of that stuff where they sit and look at the owner? Seems to me by being there instead of moving it allows them to fixate but at the same time, I guess it does work on the behavior. But actually, I think that's what the other two above are. One is when the dog is displaying calm behavior the other dog leaves and the other I think is the reactive dog gets to leave. Which I guess is similar to what you suggested. Or maybe I could do the other one first then when he's in a better place he can sit still? And do you think him following will help?

Yeah, I gotta get better about watching his body language I suppose. But normally if I see another dog even start to approach down the road I run back to the driveway. Thankfully we're usually just at the mailbox and he usually doesn't even notice yet. But I'm so paranoid I just ditch haha but it's gotten to where I don't even walk him anymore or if I do we go late at night. But he's actually not even really that reactive, he used to be perfect with dogs, and I think he started getting more leash frustration, he wants to say hi. He's only lunged a couple times. However one dog he HATES and the other dog hates him and he lunged and barked and did some mean noises. We went home after that and I didn't walk him much after. It was by the mailbox and I heard them tell the neighbor who was outside "he's not a very nice boy, is he?" "no, he's not" and I admit I cried when I got home hahaha I'm a huge baby :/ but it hurt me because they don't even know him and he's a huge cuddle bug. Plus their dog, a Lab, was being mean too.. but since then I have realized that if a huge 130+ pound black dog was lunging at the end of his leash at me or my dog, I would be scared too and call him a bad dog especially if I didn't know him. So I don't blame them anymore and it was irresponsible. But at the time it hurt me. But he hasn't really been walked since. This was maybe the summer before last.

Another time when he was younger he growled at a dog and they said he wasn't as nice as our old dogs and x never would have growled. I mean, that's true to a point cause he used to resource guard with us too. But this wasn't his fault and the growl was barely audible. He was swimming and was getting out the pond but his legs had gotten wrapped up in the rope so we were trying to untangle him, the other dog came up behind him, so all poor Gator did was let out a barely audible quick growl to just say hey, I'm in pain/trouble/stuck and plus I don't know you, back off. After that he was fine with him. Well, they backed up actually aha

But yeah, he's really not that reactive but he has probably gotten a lot worse with not being walked and his hips are worse.

But with my brother he doesn't really react. Though he does in the car.

But that brings up another question: he IS reactive/protective in the car. He drives by a dog or person he doesn't like he goes ballistic. Just recently he was in the car and we were at a red light, this truck and guy were next to us, out of nowhee he barks and growls. I was in the back so he couldn't get to the window but I'm sure he would have lunged. I grabbed his leash and gave a quick correction and had to keep holding the leash tight and verbally talking to be sure he didn't go after him again. It was weird. I guess he didn't like his looks? And if we're parked somewhere and someone gets too close, he freaks out.

 

[HeavensHens88]

Does he have an noticeable irritation/grudge against men in general??? Or only certain trucks/men?

 

[ShrekDawg]

Nah not really. He loves everybody once they are in the house or on walks. On walks where he doesn't have to protect territory, his inner Lab comes out and he wants to greet everyone. At home he freaks at anyone outside, male or female, but once they are inside he is fine. But he has to be leashed or put in another room to get them through the door. But my brother has had tons of friends over before and even had sort of a mini party once when we were gone and he loved them. Wasn't really a party but like 6 of his friends, idk. He just hung with the guys and loved it. He doesn't like one of them though haha but he does fine. So yesh, no aversion towards anyone. Just overprotective in general. But this was the first time he's freaked at a random car. And a car at all really. Usually it's someone walking by

 

[HeavensHens88]

Nah not really. He loves everybody once they are in the house or on walks. On walks where he doesn't have to protect territory, his inner Lab comes out and he wants to greet everyone. At home he freaks at anyone outside, male or female, but once they are inside he is fine. But he has to be leashed or put in another room to get them through the door. But my brother has had tons of friends over before and even had sort of a mini party once when we were gone and he loved them. Wasn't really a party but like 6 of his friends, idk. He just hung with the guys and loved it. He doesn't like one of them though haha but he does fine. So yesh, no aversion towards anyone. Just overprotective in general. But this was the first time he's freaked at a random car. And a car at all really. Usually it's someone walking by

Some people say dogs have a sixth sense. Really, they just have a deeper perception than us-
I wouldn't be concerned about that one incident. All dogs are bound to have an inexplicable maniacal attack at some random person at some time or another- maybe there was something unnatural about the truck or the driver to your dog...
Again, don't be unnerved by one or two unexplained "freak-outs". After all, he's only canine.

 

[ShrekDawg]

Some people say dogs have a sixth sense. Really, they just have a deeper perception than us-
I wouldn't be concerned about that one incident. All dogs are bound to have an inexplicable maniacal attack at some random person at some time or another- maybe there was something unnatural about the truck or the driver to your dog...
Again, don't be unnerved by one or two unexplained "freak-outs". After all, he's only canine.

Thanks! That does make me feel a little better haha

 

[ShrekDawg]

He's barking at a dog right now. I already looked, determined that, then said enough, didn't stop, so tapped the bed till he turned/fell over and wanted love lol and i kept saying good boy enough over again. But now he started barking again. I had to look at this thread to remember what you suggested when he doesn't stop but turns out it's bringing him inside... well what do I do when he's already inside?