Done with Barred Rock Roosters

[10AcreChick]

I've got a coronation sussex cockerel from breeder stock I like at the moment-he's so soft at six months none of the hens take him seriously enough to let him mate and he's got no nerve to tell them otherwise, and he's not afraid of us, but VERY respectful-and none of my bcm cocks have attacked me (also breeder stock lines). Both of those breed lines came from people who raised chickens and had kids that helped and not a hatchery situation. As far as I know, both breeders would be happy to eat out of line cockerels especially if they went after their kids. I think hatcheries unintentionally breed aggressive birds. They put several cocks and hens in a pen, the most aggressive and pushiest cock mates the most, they hatch his chicks, then select stock from that, and the cycle starts over again. My cockerels have never been aggressive or even pushy with my little kids. If you want to add new blood, I suggest maybe looking for a breeder who has no tolerance for aggressive behavior and likes to eat birds with bad attitudes and has been breeding them for a while.

Cockerels are delicious for a reason. I know it's terrible but it's true.

Yeah, mine all came from the hatchery. Well, I won't be breeding from this rooster, I just hope the BO rooster won't turn aggressive once he's top dog. And these will be the last hatchery birds I have, I will be breeding from them from now on, so hopefully any aggressiveness will be bred out over time.

Yes, the last BR cockerel was VERY delicious. This one will be almost 30 weeks instead of 23 at butcher, so it might be not quite so delicious. But soup is good!

 

[rachelsflock]

In that respect I'm a little bit envious of you. I am out of extra cockerels for this year and down to the drakes.

PS: not all hatchery males are aggressive, just all the ones I've ever had. I usually do them at the "shoe-biting" phase so no one gets hurt.

 

[Kev]

I've got a coronation sussex cockerel from breeder stock I like at the moment-he's so soft at six months none of the hens take him seriously enough to let him mate and he's got no nerve to tell them otherwise, and he's not afraid of us, but VERY respectful-and none of my bcm cocks have attacked me (also breeder stock lines). Both of those breed lines came from people who raised chickens and had kids that helped and not a hatchery situation. As far as I know, both breeders would be happy to eat out of line cockerels especially if they went after their kids. I think hatcheries unintentionally breed aggressive birds. They put several cocks and hens in a pen, the most aggressive and pushiest cock mates the most, they hatch his chicks, then select stock from that, and the cycle starts over again. My cockerels have never been aggressive or even pushy with my little kids. If you want to add new blood, I suggest maybe looking for a breeder who has no tolerance for aggressive behavior and likes to eat birds with bad attitudes and has been breeding them for a while.

Cockerels are delicious for a reason. I know it's terrible but it's true.

I so love this comment. Such a breath of fresh air to see someone else touch upon aggression having a genetic basis and can be dealt with via breeding.

My birds out of several generations here are all handleable by kids, anybody. Because it is a hobby for me(genetics fun being a big part) and mean roosters are no pleasure so they simply are not tolerated.

I cannot handle the birds much due to dander allergies so they are all raised hands off. However at the potential breeder keeper selection phase(around 12 weeks or so) I pick up every bird(both sexes) and deliberately move my hand or fist in front of their faces.... if they bite and there are already extras, those are put on cull list. Any repeat biters especially if hard/add a twisting motion with their bites are immediate culls, so are those that combine biting with a kicking motion. After several generations of this the roosters are very handleable so are the setting hens(other main reason for doing this- was using them to hatch peafowl eggs).

As I understand it for commercial production bred birds there are two common things going on- may be possible for production to be linked with aggression in some lines... the other common thing is aggression was present in the founder stock but did not have direct link to production, it simply came along for the ride with selection for production not 'personality'.

For further reading on this subject, check out the Belyaev fox experiment- in short, an attempt to make foxes on fur farms more handleable produced surprising and very interesting results but also proved aggression IS genetic.. example genetic tame fox cubs raised by wild/aggressive foxes still grew up tame and vice versa.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

I have had hatchery barred rock roosters and currently have a young one. I have had many roosters and I have found human aggressive to be not common in my birds. I believe it's due to how they are raised more than breed or source, or else why have I only had two aggressive ones in my 20 years of keeping them, and both were handled a lot. I currently also have 2 adult BO roosters, and a Barnvelder, with another 4 juveniles that are beginning to sexually mature. I also a bunch of bantam roosters as well.

I do believe children can trigger attacks sometimes due to their behaviour around chickens and they need to be taught how to calmly but confidently move through the flock so they remain dominant.

I practice a hands off approach with my roosters and mostly pretend they are not there, when they begin to sexually mature I keep an eye on them for any signs like facing me as opposed to moving away and giving me their backs, and I'm not opposed to chasing them down and catching them with a net if they are making troubles with the hens.

There are certain breeds that are more mellow and mature more slowly like the BO that gives you more time to develop a dominant relationship with them. It is near impossible to change human aggressive behaviors once they start and most attempts will cause more aggression, so it's best to make sure it doesn't develop in the first place.

Chickens fall into the category of livestock, not pets. Pets you handle and pet and you interact in a more personal manner, livestock you handle to have them tame enough so they are calm around you and you can safely handle them if necessary, but not so much that they lose all fear of you, especially the males. All male livestock has the potential to be dangerous no matter the species.

I would definitely get rid any human aggressive roosters and try again, eventually you will get a good one, and will learn how to interact with them so they don't see as a threat nor part of the flock, but as their keeper.

 

[10AcreChick]

Um...Kev...what kind of chickens are those?

 

[rachelsflock]

I so love this comment. Such a breath of fresh air to see someone else touch upon aggression having a genetic basis and can be dealt with via breeding.

My birds out of several generations here are all handleable by kids, anybody. Because it is a hobby for me(genetics fun being a big part) and mean roosters are no pleasure so they simply are not tolerated.

I cannot handle the birds much due to dander allergies so they are all raised hands off. However at the potential breeder keeper selection phase(around 12 weeks or so) I pick up every bird(both sexes) and deliberately move my hand or fist in front of their faces.... if they bite and there are already extras, those are put on cull list. Any repeat biters especially if hard/add a twisting motion with their bites are immediate culls, so are those that combine biting with a kicking motion. After several generations of this the roosters are very handleable so are the setting hens(other main reason for doing this- was using them to hatch peafowl eggs).

As I understand it for commercial production bred birds there are two common things going on- may be possible for production to be linked with aggression in some lines... the other common thing is aggression was present in the founder stock but did not have direct link to production, it simply came along for the ride with selection for production not 'personality'.

For further reading on this subject, check out the Belyaev fox experiment- in short, an attempt to make foxes on fur farms more handleable produced surprising and very interesting results but also proved aggression IS genetic.. example genetic tame fox cubs raised by wild/aggressive foxes still grew up tame and vice versa.

Thanks, yes, I really think a lot of aggression is genetic...plus, you can't always blame the owner for the cockerel's behavior! I've even had a hatchery hen randomly go people aggressive one day (a barred rock, believe it or not) and she just got worse and worse until she would walk around you pecking and making your feet and ankles bleed any time she saw flesh as she waited for you to bend over so she could jump and go for your eyes. She was given a few weeks of terrorizing people and then she was culled. OUCH. I'm less patient now. It hurts less.

Plus, if you're going to be bringing warm water to your birds several times a day in the winter they'd better at least be polite.

 

[10AcreChick]

I did teach my children how to act around the chickens. When we first got them, the kids were severely reprimanded for chasing them and never did it again. For the most part, they don't much notice the chickens are there (free range), so it was usually a huge surprise when they were chased by the roosters, they had no idea he was even around! The first year we had chickens, our RIR rooster did not even pay attention to humans, and was never aggressive, so the kids got used to not even noticing them as well. When this rooster problem started, I taught them how to move through them, paying attention but ignoring them at the same time. The roosters started with just protecting their boundaries, just chasing us away but stopping after only a few feet, and I wanted to give them every chance. As stated above, I could not just keep butchering roosters due to the kids being too "chicken". But when one chased me ALL THE WAY AROUND THE HOUSE, he was gone. And when the other chased the 8 yr old despite him clearly showing him who is the dominant one, he is going soon, too.

Bottom line, if I got a third BR rooster, my husband would probably look at my like I was crazy (have you not learned your lesson?) Can't ignore 100% results!

And we also do not handle our chickens. They are not pets at all.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

It's not so much the children chasing the chickens, but it's their erratic movements and screaming and running as kids often do in play that can trigger an attack or a desire for a young rooster to protect his hens. I wouldn't get another BR either. Hopefully your BO behaves, otherwise Barnevelder and cochins are some other less reactive breeds. Sounds like you are doing things right in raising them, both the kids and the chickens.

 

[Kev]

Um...Kev...what kind of chickens are those?

Beautiful chickens is what they are!

They have the scaleless gene which makes them naked all over- no scales on the legs/toes either(hence the name).

 

[Kev]

I should have added with aggression being genetic, it also is on a continuum/curve not an either/or thing and environment also plays a part.

For example a genetically mid range for aggression roo, if raised hands off or by experienced person probably will not show any aggression. However this very same bird, if raised hand tame/as a pet has a much higher chance of attacking. This is why so many swear by not making pets out of roosters.. they are actually talking about those mid range roosters.

Roosters with low/zero genetics for aggression are going to stay nice no matter how they are raised and handled. People with those gentle pet roosters sometimes speak up and disagree with bunch of others about roosters being mean. Not even children will incite them into attacking. They simply don't have the instincts to be triggered.

And then there are roosters with high genetics for aggression that are going to be mean no matter what. They continue to attack no matter how their attacks are handled.

As a result of this being a variable mix, all too often discussions about mean roosters end up talking over each other and every one with strong opinions when everyone all at once are wrong, right, partially wrong/right.