Dove or Racer?

Discussion in 'Pigeons and Doves' started by jak2002003, Jan 15, 2013.

  1. jak2002003

    jak2002003 Overrun With Chickens

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    Apart from homing and racing abilities what are the actual differences between a normal white homing pigeon and a normal white garden dove (not fantail doves)

    If I had one of each together what would their differences be?

    I am wanting to get some white 'doves' for my garden again. I used to keep them many years ago and I don't know what type they were.

    I can remember they had pink beaks and legs, and solid black eyes. Any photos would be great. The birds offered to me recently had yellow eyes and thick crusty looking beaks and red legs - and did not look nice to me! Where they homers?

    Thanks for any information and sorry if this is a strange question.
     
  2. Hokum Coco

    Hokum Coco Overrun With Chickens

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    I have one white homing pigeon that can fly 300 miles when released in any direction (not sure about open water) and find it's way back to its loft. He resembles a King pigeon at first glance he is so large. He is condition good blood lines and an athlete in every respect.

    I also have one white homing pigeons who is only slightly larger than a ring neck dove. She is a younger bird and can be tossed in any direction 60 miles from her loft and is capable of 2 twice that distance from my observations.

    Some normal white garden doves would be lucky to find their way home from around the corner and do not have the genetics, endurance and instinct to return home and would die trying.

    Do not get me wrong all pigeons posses some homing instinct the question is how much.

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    If you had them both together they may look exactly the same (depending on the bird and the breeder) or they could be a weight difference. The only proof is in the pudding when it comes to performance. Some breeders want speed and perfomance only and do not take eye candy into consideration.

    Others like myself take eye candy, endurance not speed into the equation if my white homer makes it home that is my reward not the time.

    Some expert fanciers could probably tell the difference but to the average Joe I doubt it. If I were to give you Lozolo and let you handle and feel his breast and wing muscles and point of some of his characteristics and then let you handle we say an ornamental pigeon you would definitely know the difference between Mahammid Ali for example and Alfred Hitchcock.

    I just realized I do not have a picture of Lozolo my best bird. He would be about 1/3 bigger than all of the birds I have down loaded.

    I am always a bit afraid when I toss Lozolo so I think I will retire him and use him for short dove releases and breeding only eventually.

    It all boils down to who you buy your birds from. Even then you can get a reputable breeder and have good genetics. If your mother, father, and nearly all your relatives are doctors most likely you will be a doctor too. However there is no guarantee.

    If you are thinking of white homers it is best to buy young birds. If you buy older white homing pigeons be prepared to keep them prisoner the rest of their lives or to loose them entirely.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2013
  3. larrylofts

    larrylofts Chillin' With My Peeps

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    WHITE HOMERS ARE PIGEONS . WHITE DOVES ARE DOVES TO START THEY ARE ABOUT ONE THIRD THE SIZE OF A HOMER. SMALLER HAVE NO HOMEING ABILITY CAN NOT BE TAKEN OUT AND RELEASED MILES FROM HOME AND EXPECT THEM TO RETURN . WOULD NOT EVEN LET THEM OUT OF THE LOFT WITHOUT EXPECTING LOSES THEY ARE NOT AS DOMESICATED HAS PIGEONS
     
  4. Hokum Coco

    Hokum Coco Overrun With Chickens

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    Pigeons and Doves can interbreed but the product are mules that are sterile. You have to expect losses anytime you let your birds free fly no matter what the breed.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2013
  5. laughingdog

    laughingdog Chillin' With My Peeps

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    ive had both, and big differances whether you fly them or not are health/vigor, behavoir, as well hardiness. first, handling.. you really shouldnt grab hold or handle the actual white doves, as they are extreamily fragile and stress immensely easier than white homers or any pigeon ive encountured, and you can crack or crush an egg in a female very easily, as do the feathers come out and off every were very easily, and they can hurt themselvs worse if struggle due to not being used to being handled, and their skin even is very fragile as are tiny bones. watching them you will notice they make differant sounds, act totally differant, doves very picky and can require much more specific enriched smaller feed as they can choke or starve on feeds pigeons could thrive on. doves need grit, were pigeons all dont utilize but better to offer. doves usually white ringnecks will have a very fragile and light tiny boned and hardly if at all muscled body, make much more dust, and are highly allergenic because of this, as had when had doves four doves, and dozens of pigeons, and the smell, poop, dust, and constant feathers from the doves were much worse than all my pigeons put together. they were slow to get the idea of free flying and slow to find way back home, not predator savy at all, and had no idea how at all to survive at all, and constantly bashed into things at first, were the pigeons raised for show got the idea in days to weeks and reverted enough to be able to be left out alone, were doves took months. im not saying i didnt love my doves, but theyre very stupid and weak in that even as suseptable to poultry or wild bird illnesses as pigeons are, ringnecks are totally unable seeming to avoid coping, its just that theyre inbred mostly, and cant perch with much variation at first well, and have most of instinct removed, maybe to help with tameness or just laziness on part of breeders who just breed and sell bro sis together as pairs as they are great at pairing and raise squab so quick, im guessing no one cares as to losing dozen to hundred even or more for a white dove release, kept soley as small caged birds for only apperance, and mine were show birds. pigeons can be taught your area pretty quick and easy in a large open wire rabbit cage to stretch and watch, were doves need an aviary to build muscle, balance stamina, ability to grab variety of surfaces, ect and acclimation to weather. were homer breeders and keepers usually have more respect for their birds as far as athleticism and beauty of flying. ive heard of ringnecks dying in to large of a greenhouse or planted aviary from not being able to remember were the food and water was. lol i tried doing experiments of moving around dishes and the doves were not to keen or couldnt find them at all in even more than tiel cage at first.

    the white turtle/ringneck doves though i found were supierier parents and fosters though, so that instinct is still there and in over drive, as seen them feeding babies of other species through bars of cages even when they cried for food, and would often foster baby finches and baby hookbills even to them.

    the differances for a poultry person would be between bobwhite quail as pigeons, and courtnix quail as ringneck/ white turtle dove. though i had a flook guessing were had one line or courturnix quial that had as good of instincts as bobwhite and reared own babies as good as my bantams, for some reason, and i populated morristown with them. so anything is possible.

    cages whole live when id gotten homers, and even show homers bred same way im guessing as ringnecks, are even hardier and naturally more heavily muscled and easier to acclimate to other conditions than just small display or show cages were used to when got.
     
  6. laughingdog

    laughingdog Chillin' With My Peeps

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    you were probably offered recently homers as you described eyes, cere, ect.
     
  7. jak2002003

    jak2002003 Overrun With Chickens

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    Thank you all for you replies. And thank you laughingdog for the very detailed response - I read it with much interest.

    Well now I know the difference! Thanks again. I think I will go for the racing homers or some fantail doves - as I want to let them fly free in my garden.
     
  8. laughingdog

    laughingdog Chillin' With My Peeps

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    fantail doves are probably pigeons also, but very pretty, though think there are rare morphs of ringnecks out there some one posted on one of these. most would think a waste, but garden fantails are those that are fantail mixed with ther pigeons, so maybe get a pair or white racers, and a pair of white fantails. or any color of each.. then you can decide to either breed the pair you want seperate, and/or mix together to get fantails that can fly and home better, but still be pretty with the fantail, and crest and feathered feet if you get indian fantails or fantasies (just like an indian fantail but with more feather footing and more crown like crest). i have a "garden fantail" and she is an awsome flier and mother, and not to bad a tumbler, and has the pretty feathered legs (from oriental roller parent) and indian fantail type tail (from american fantail parent). she is also from my first group of pigeons ever bought down here (i was a homer and feral pigeon guy up north only as pretty new to everything else), and has never oddly been nabbed by a BOP (seen her hit and lose handful of feathers after, but mostly she rolled out when they try to grab at her). so you may get best of both worlds if lucky like i was! keep us updated.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2013
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