Egg stopped peeping and no pipping...dead?

[Kjirstyn]

We have a mama broody on some eggs. Five hatched yesterday (day 20) and are doing awesome, the cutey little things. But she has two eggs left, which seem more hesitant. One egg was alive as late as yesterday, because it was peeping, but it has since stopped (last night) and I'm getting concerned. No pipping yet. The shell is a thick Maran shell, so I'm wondering if it's even possible for an egg shell to be too thick for a chick to handle?

Since we had a mama broody (not an incubator), I've been in her business nonstop checking the eggs and such, but as I read about incubators being on lockdown, I'm wondering if I messed things up by checking the eggs in their last days before hatching...? Most of them hatched just fine but now I'm questioning myself since the others aren't.

Egg 2 has never peeped, but as of the day 7 candling it looked alive. I'm afraid it might just be a lost cause. :-( How long should I wait before removing it? I certainly don't want to kill it if it's just a late bloomer. Can you even tell by candling if it's dead, or would a well developed dead egg look the same as a live one?

 

[PunkinPeep]

From your description, i think that you're saying that neither chick has managed to break through the outer shell yet, but you heard one of them cheeping from inside, yesterday. Is that right?

If that's right, then i think that you've been picking them up and listening to them, and so you already know that there's no more cheeping in either egg.

I'm just clarifying, so that i don't give you suggestions you've already done.

In my experience, (and some will argue with me about this), especially with a broody hen, there isn't more than 24 hours difference between the first and the last hatched chick. And if you aren't hearing any cheeping, and the neither chicken has broken through, for the sake of the chicks who have hatched, i wouldn't try to keep mama on the nest any longer than she wants to stay there. And once she abandons those last two eggs, i would just discard them. (You can try an egg-topsy if you have the stomach for it. They have instructions in the learning center, i think.)

Usually, the mama hen is pretty eager to get to showing her babies how to scratch and eat pretty quickly, as soon as she knows she's done hatching. My nests are up high, so i usually move mama and babies down as soon as everyone is dry - or as soon as mama abandons the nest for food or what (assuming with her chicken brain that the babies can handle the heights and will follow her), i move the babies down to the floor, and then they're like magnets to each other, the babies and the mamas. Just make sure that there is food and water at chick access height.

I know what you mean about wanting to investigate the egg situation under a broody hen. I'm pretty bad about that. In the future, i would try to follow the model we use when incubating, don't bother them after about day 18...or once you see the first pip, just leave them all alone. It's just safer that way.

Congratulations on your 5 new babies! Broody hatching and watching them grow is one of my favorite things. It never gets old.

 

[Kjirstyn]

Okay, yes, I have listened a few times for peeping and/or movement-- nothing has happened on any checks since last night. :-( And yes, your first assessment of what I said is accurate.

So in light of your info I have another question-- these chicks (5) are actually split between two broodies. One broody has 3 chicks and 2 eggs left, and the other broody has 2 chicks and no eggs left. Based on your comments it sounds like they should be up and moving around, or at least the one with no eggs left should be. Neither one has shown the slightest inclination to get up! They're just hanging out in brood mode, still. The only difference I've noticed is that they're eating much more enthusiastically when I bring them food than when they did while brooding.

Anyway, since neither mama is trying to leave, the unhatched eggs could just hang out for awhile. Now I have to decide when to pull the eggs and tell them to get on with their henny lives. Would tomorrow (day 22) be too soon? The fertile eggs were NOT from my hens, so I have no idea if that would affect their hatching times differently.

 

[Egghead_Jr]

She'll get off the eggs all on her own. Both hens will be walking about with the chicks before too long. When that happens you can toss the unhatched eggs.

 

[PunkinPeep]

Part of the reason they're not getting up is because you're bringing them food, which is great.

Just in case, don't let them sit there more than 3 days from the first hatch, just because the babies only have that much nutrition stored up.

I agree, they will probably pop out of there sometime this evening or tomorrow morning, on their own.

 

[hildar]

Last year when our broody miss Brownie hatched out eggs, she hatched out 1 egg, 2 days later another one hatched and 5 days later 2 other ones hatched. After the last 2 hatched you would see her looking at the last few eggs, and she would turn them look, and then do it again. then all of a sudden she got up and took all 4 babies with her. leaving the eggs. She could tell they were bad eggs. A mother hen will go when they know all of the last of the eggs are bad. We took them down by the fence and broke them and 2 had babies in them that had died and 3 were just duds.

 

[Kjirstyn]

Well, the babies are eating right next to the mamas from their make-shift dishes (I included baby grit), so no worries about baby health. It is odd that the one mama is still hanging out on her nest even though all her eggs are hatched.

IS there such a thing as an egg that's too hard for a chick to break through?

Thanks for the input, hildar...I hope that's the case for us, too! I'll give it another day at least. We were hoping to move them to new quarters tomorrow, but don't want to break the brood if the eggs are still viable.

 

[hildar]

Well, the babies are eating right next to the mamas from their make-shift dishes (I included baby grit), so no worries about baby health. It is odd that the one mama is still hanging out on her nest even though all her eggs are hatched.

IS there such a thing as an egg that's too hard for a chick to break through?

Thanks for the input, hildar...I hope that's the case for us, too! I'll give it another day at least. We were hoping to move them to new quarters tomorrow, but don't want to break the brood if the eggs are still viable.

Your best bet is give it a few days, if they haven't moved you can move mom away from the nest a few feet and that way the babies will follow her. If the eggs are still good she will go back and sit. If they are bad she will not go back. Mamas know best. However I never put food within reach of the mama after 3 days. I sat the food about 2 feet from her, so she would have to get up to eat. This way she could spend some time stretching. when she was ready to leave she did. we even gave brownie a break after the first babies were born so that she could take a break we brought the babies in the house for 20 minutes, she loved that. She got up stretched her legs a bit, and had a dirt bath. She then went looking for Smarty, she didn't realize Smarty had passed away 2 days earlier ( before she went broody they were together daily). But she also was happy to get back to her babies when she saw us bringing them back to the nest.

 

[Farmer Viola]

IS there such a thing as an egg that's too hard for a chick to break through?

yes in my opinion...
I had set shipped eggs with extremely hard shells I discovered in eggtopsy. I will eggtopsy every egg I incubate, so I've busted open a lot of shells and my technique is pretty good. I open a tiny hole at the top of the air cell and chip away at the air cell until I can see the chick still in the membrane.

anyway, I have had shells SO HARD I could literally not break them open as I normally do. they were incredibly strong, bent the metal tools I was working with. I discovered dead chicks who had internally pipped with their beaks against the shell, unable to get out... I wish I had somehow known to open them earlier, but I didn't =\

anyway I think this is a special case, but it is possible. it is hard when you do not know the diet of the parents.

 

[subhanalah]

I believe a hen will peck an egg when she hears a signal from the baby that it can't get out. Anyone know?