Electric Fence Basics

[nao57]

So I had more questions for this thread. This thread is brilliant too by the way. I've been referencing it a lot.

If you set up the grounding, and poles whatever too close to trees will it damage them when it goes off or whatever? Like we've got this apple tree...enough said.

Also when I've been researching these fence kits, people are saying the plastic ones degrade and sag after only a few months in the sun. That's a problem.

Anyone have reccomendations on a durable kit for this stuff that will last awhile but that is still low cost?

And when I was at Cal Ranch it seemed like the kits also were sold typically in 100 foot wire setups. But if you think about it, if you are doing 4 sides to a box that's now 25 feet. And you haven't even counted if you need to route the wire several times around poles to not have breaks in it...so it seems like you'd need to have like possibly 2 to 4 sets of these 100 foot wire things (IF that's what you are using), in order to secure like a duck pen and sets of beehives etc, or if you were rural? I guess you could chain the sets of wire together right?

 

[U_Stormcrow]

@nao57 I was just at Tractor Supply buying stuff for my (AC powered) electric fence. Anything over 1J of output will be rated for big predator. Anything under 1J wasn't - so that's my guide on requirements for keeping wild hogs, wild dogs, the FL brown bear, etc out of my homestead area. Based on my readings, most critters will only test an area of the fence once - the shock is perfectly painful and perfectly safe, unless they are caught in the fence somehow (antlers, most commonly) and unable to escape. It does no damage to the trees, though you should still use insulators if you are using trees as your posts (as I am in some places). Even covered in rain, the current (which is high potential [voltage], low current [amperage]) will simply propagate down the bark of the tree in the case of a short, doing no damage to the tree's heartwood.

I bought the electric charger for $100. Bought 1/4 mile spools of wire (14ga for the hot) for $25 a piece, on special. I think I spent $38 on a half mile (17 gauge) of wire to go between the hots n my 5 wire fencing. From the ground, it will be hot, ground, hot, ground, hot. The spring assemblies for gauging wire tension were about $9 each, and the in line wire strainers about $4 ea. 2" barbed staples (a lot of them) around $20, a 200 pack of short insulating tubes was around $12, and I paid about the same for 25 packs of plastic screw in insulators, a bit less for poly insulators for the corners which did not have integral screws. More money in crimps to make loops where I start and end wire sections of the fence.

Ground bars will be 5/8" rebar, and I have some heavy insulated aluminum wire already for connecting the unit to the fence (#2 Mobile Home SE wire). All told, I'm into this for about $350, and will be fencing an area about 250x400. The gates (2 @ 12', 2@ 4') will end up costing me nearly as much, when all is said and done, and I'll have fenced about 2 1/4 acres. I'm not using any Tposts or the like, just cut the timber I need, dig a deep hole, and place it. Yesterday I set two 7 1/2' poles of at least 10" dia black oak just over 3' in the ground, each. By comparison, driving the rebar grounding rods will be downright pleasant. I have clay soils.

Hope that helps. (also, my charger is WAY larger than I need for such a small area - but will allow for future expansion, as my total property is 30+ acres, and I expect multiple subdivisions of it with electric fencing sections.

 

[Howard E]

So if its a scale of 0.1 to 1.X+...

What would be the ideal setting to ...still keep whatever it is alive, and not have them come back ever?

Think of the fence charger as being similar to the wattage of a light bulb. I can buy a 10 watt night light.....weak light....just enough to see my surroundings......or a 300 watt flame thrower that will illuminate the entire interior of a large shed.

Fencers are like light bulbs in that you buy the power level you need to get the job done. For most of us, that ought to be at least 1 joule.....or a fencer rated for 10 miles of fence. And once it is up, when tested with a voltage test meter designed for electric fences, the fence ought to have at least 7,000 volts minimum. That ought to repel all boarders.

 

[Howard E]

Stormcrow.....good info!!!

 

[humblehillsfarm]

For those considering the installation of an electric fence, or not sure of how they work, consider this to be a basic tutorial.

View attachment 2252055View attachment 2252056

So all electric fence setups will be similar to this on, differing only in scale......meaning where you put your hot wires and how large of an area you encompass. But all consist of 4 basic components. 1. Fence Charger 2. power source 3. Ground Rod 4. Hot wire runs

The fence charger powers up or activates the hot wires.....generally with as large of 5,000 to as many as 15,000 volts. This is a high voltage, low amperage shock, which is both highly painful and relatively harmless, which makes it both safe and effective. The way the fencer works is about once every second, this high voltage pulse is sent down the hot wires. The fencer is also connected to the earth ground.....literally the soil you stand upon. So the two conductors are the hot wires and soil. So when an animal standing on the soil comes into contact with the hot wires, the juice flows through them to ground, which they feel as a violent, painful shock. Painful enough they will go into avoidance mode so it doesn't happen again. So the fence becomes a boundary they are reluctant to cross, so they leave it alone.

This is an enlarged layout of the fence charger hookup....View attachment 2252056

And lastly, the hot wires must be kept isolated.......meaning insulated......from the earth ground, so are supported by some type of insulators.
View attachment 2252057
This one is new to me.....but consists of only a plain fiberglass rod, which is driven into the soil deep enough to support the fence (about 6 to 10 inches). Then two piece insulators are attached to it. With this setup, user is free to position the insulators where they want them......from nearly touching the deck to as far as needed. They can be placed as close as 2 inches apart.

This particular fence was built to prevent coons from raiding an apple tree. One day, tree had nearly 2 bushel of apples on it. Next morning.....top had been shredded and only a peck or two remained. Coons did that. Fence went up and as per game cameras, perimeter was probed all night, but the fence held. Traffic the next two nights has fallen off greatly.

Same could be done with a coop or run to keep varmints at arm's length......up to and including a larger area (yard), surrounding the coop or ranging area.

Where was this thread when I had to set up electric by myself after a bear attack!! I had no idea what I was doing and bought fiberglass rods and loved them. I bought a charger for a 30 mile fence, but only set up maybe a mile or two so far. The instructions said to use multiple ground rods, but I only did one copper rod. I figured for how short my fence is so far, one would do. However, I want to add more fence. Do all of the grounds have to be right in a cluster or just spread out??

 

[cmom]

So if its a scale of 0.1 to 1.X+...

What would be the ideal setting to ...still keep whatever it is alive, and not have them come back ever?

Fence chargers electric wires do not kill but they will let the predator know the wire is there.

 

[cmom]

So if its a scale of 0.1 to 1.X+...

What would be the ideal setting to ...still keep whatever it is alive, and not have them come back ever?

The fence charger joules determine how much of a shock a predator will get. One of the smaller chargers that have like a .1 will be more like a bee sting. A fence charger of around 1 joule will be more of a shock but not killer. For people who have bear problems would want charger will more joules. A bear has fairly thick fur. Luckily most examine first with their noses. Some people bait the wire with something like bacon or peanut butter so a bear will touch the wire with it's nose, lips and tongue. I have never seen a bear here. I do have many other predators. The ones that touch the wires don't test them again and in some cases teach their young not to.

 

[Howard E]

Where was this thread when I had to set up electric by myself after a bear attack!! I had no idea what I was doing and bought fiberglass rods and loved them. I bought a charger for a 30 mile fence, but only set up maybe a mile or two so far. The instructions said to use multiple ground rods, but I only did one copper rod. I figured for how short my fence is so far, one would do. However, I want to add more fence. Do all of the grounds have to be right in a cluster or just spread out??

Perhaps this will help?

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/electric-fence-setup-with-grounding-instructions.1347817/

Also, when buying a ground rod, the E fence people will tell you to ONLY use galvanized steel ground rods. 1/2" is enough. Copper doesn't exactly corrode, but does get that green scaly film on it that doesn't conduct all that well. And straight rebar, steel fence posts (even painted ones) eventually rust and don't conduct as well.

They talk about multiple ground rods and pounding them in 8 feet or more. My thinking is enough is enough. If fence is testing high voltage and you are getting a good shock, and if you do the ground test outlined above and don't have any voltage left in the ground (pun intended), you have a good ground system.

 

[humblehillsfarm]

Perhaps this will help?

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/electric-fence-setup-with-grounding-instructions.1347817/

Also, when buying a ground rod, the E fence people will tell you to ONLY use galvanized steel ground rods. 1/2" is enough. Copper doesn't exactly corrode, but does get that green scaly film on it that doesn't conduct all that well. And straight rebar, steel fence posts (even painted ones) eventually rust and don't conduct as well.

They talk about multiple ground rods and pounding them in 8 feet or more. My thinking is enough is enough. If fence is testing high voltage and you are getting a good shock, and if you do the ground test outlined above and don't have any voltage left in the ground (pun intended), you have a good ground system.

I could only get mine in about 3-4 feet before hitting bedrock. And I did buy copper this time around :/

 

[cmom]

I put a ground rod under a drip edge.