Factory Feed Free meat & laying birds

[U_Stormcrow]

One might have thought this would be the case but what I found with free rangers was they tended not to stay close to the coop and the ground around the coops remained relatively untouched.

Mine too - yes, they have little pits they've dug - favored dustbathing spots under particular bushes, and next to a building, but in the main, the run and surrounds are recovering - I even have grass growing in the run again, and had to start pulling weeds!

Admittedly, my stocking density is quite low - but the only really barren areas are the paths I walk, and which my animals (chickens, ducks, goats) tend to follow.

 

[Shadrach]

I am curious if anyone has experimented with pure free range chickens, esp meat birds such as the cornish cross (yes I know about the freedom rangers as well), but also just with regular laying hens? I am wanting to try to start moving my chickens to less factory food dependency and more into only foraging. So I am wondering if there are those that never give factory feed (winter excluded) or just a very minor amount and what your experience has been? What you have learned and some of the breeds you found that work the best at doing this.

On my uncles farm where I worked when I was young there were 4 or 5 tribes of free rangers as well as Battery chickens. The free rangers didn't get commercial feed. I was told that it took my Uncle about eight years of breeding within the free range tribes to produce chickens that could survive and thrive without additonal commercial feed. But, the free rangers did get fed food waste, crop waste and meat considered uneconomic to process from the other livestock.

On the free range chicken farm I worked at later in life where egg production was a major part of the financing the breeds there always required some additional feed to the forage. The chickens there were also managed by breeding from the existing stock with the occasional introduction of a same breed rooster from another farm.

It took about six years with the chickens in Catalonia, also closed flock, for the chickens to make good use of the available forage. They still needed commercial feed.

My conclusion is it takes some years and at least three generations before the chickens start to physically and mentally adjust to full free ranging, with or without commercial feed supplement.

I'm currently watching a group of Ex Battery hens adjust to the hours they get out of their coop and run. I can see them learning, some faster than others, how to dust bath, what is and what isn't good to eat and more recently, how to escape onto the allotments for a bit of a feast. First it was one, now it's five who will fly over the fence.
I would be very surprised if so called meat birds ever managed to survive on forage only and still produce enough weight to be still considered as meat birds.
I don't think it's a realistic proposition.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

As this thread shows, Shadrach and I disagree on much of the details, but the broad overview above is consistent with my beliefs (and experience thus far, albeit shorter - I'm only two years into my effort). Trying create a "better" flock - "better" defined as improved suitability to free ranging in my environment *AND* a "better" ground for them to forage on. "Better" defined as a self sustaining polyculture needing limited human maintenance, no annual reseeding, and no heavy equipment to manage which nevertheless provides for some substantial minority of their feed needs on a [somewhat balanced] basis.

 

[3KillerBs]

In re: stocking density,

Has there been any attempt to study the feral chicken populations in places where they exist in order to determine how much room they need?

 

[U_Stormcrow]

In re: stocking density,

Has there been any attempt to study the feral chicken populations in places where they exist in order to determine how much room they need?

Not that I've read. I hadn't thought to look. I'm sure that there are.

This is from 2014, claiming the ferals in the FL Keys have not yet been counted.

The Keys are about 135 sq miles. That's about 86,400 acres. We have no idea how much support the feral population gets from the presence of humans - no doubt its some. The person posting claimed there are "thousands" of feral chickens in the keys. Lets call it 10,000. Now we imagine they are off by an order of magnitude. 100,000 or even 200,000. That's still a density of roughly 1-3 chickens per acre.

Subject, of course, to the fact that we are using admittedly bad data.

Plenty of news articles about the feral chicken problem on the Hawaiian islands, too - there's even a bill in their legislature right now to criminalize feeding them - but I didn't quickly find a population estimate.

 

[3KillerBs]

Not that I've read. I hadn't thought to look. I'm sure that there are.

This is from 2014, claiming the ferals in the FL Keys have not yet been counted.

The Keys are about 135 sq miles. That's about 86,400 acres. We have no idea how much support the feral population gets from the presence of humans - no doubt its some. The person posting claimed there are "thousands" of feral chickens in the keys. Lets call it 10,000. Now we imagine they are off by an order of magnitude. 100,000 or even 200,000. That's still a density of roughly 1-3 chickens per acre.

Subject, of course, to the fact that we are using admittedly bad data.

Plenty of news articles about the feral chicken problem on the Hawaiian islands, too - there's even a bill in their legislature right now to criminalize feeding them - but I didn't quickly find a population estimate.

More or less what I thought.

I also wonder how much feral chickens in densely-populated areas foraging from human garbage and compost piles, pet food bowls, people's gardens, etc. can be equated to the way "Grandma's" chickens on the small, diversified farms of the long-vanished past (probably great-great-grandma at this point), utilized spilled animal feed, manure piles, etc.?

That is, how much are they still dependent on humans feeding them -- albeit indirectly?

Even in rich environments, are there feral chicken populations outside of areas with a fair amount of humans also present?

 

[U_Stormcrow]

More or less what I thought.

I also wonder how much feral chickens in densely-populated areas foraging from human garbage and compost piles, pet food bowls, people's gardens, etc. can be equated to the way "Grandma's" chickens on the small, diversified farms of the long-vanished past (probably great-great-grandma at this point), utilized spilled animal feed, manure piles, etc.?

That is, how much are they still dependent on humans feeding them -- albeit indirectly?

Even in rich environments, are there feral chicken populations outside of areas with a fair amount of humans also present?

NO.
If its a rich environment, humans are there.

No reflection on the suitability of chickens, entirely a reflection of the plague of humanity upon the earth.

OK. I'm overstating a bit, but likely not much.
I wonder if SpaceX plans to ship live chickens to Mars??? (and now I'm hijacking. Sorry!)

 

[Ridgerunner]

I think shade and shelter has a lot to do with where they wipe out or alter vegetation in a free range situation. A lot of that may be that the shade inhibits growth so any damage is magnified. If you are not feeding them the only thing keeping them in the coop area is that they sleep there and the hens lay there. They will go back to the coop from a pretty good distance for that. Water may be an attraction but I didn't see them hanging around the farm pond. They didn't drink that often and would travel a distance for water. They will be spread out enough that poop should not build up enough to kill vegetation.

If you let them free range and feed themselves, other than protecting them in a coop at night they are pretty much a feral flock. They are probably not going to leave a lot of clues to predators that a flock of chickens live here so it is a good place to hunt.

I also wonder how much feral chickens in densely-populated areas foraging from human garbage and compost piles, pet food bowls, people's gardens, etc. can be equated to the way "Grandma's" chickens on the small, diversified farms of the long-vanished past (probably great-great-grandma at this point), utilized spilled animal feed, manure piles, etc.?

I got a giggle out of this. I grew up this way. True that was a while back for me but plenty of people around the world still live this way and it's not all in third world countries. The "long vanished past" starts when you were born for you but that's only where you are. Some people may still be living it.

In the situations I'm thinking about they aren't worried about how cute a certain breed is. They are not keeping pets. They are not trying to raise huge chickens or get Grade A Large eggs for the market. They are not dumb and a lot do understand the importance of good stock, but mainly what I think most are after is a chicken that takes care of itself that produces some eggs and you can eat some of the scrawny Game type chickens that get raised that way.

 

[Molpet]

My chickens stay near cover and it's bare or weeds. There's sections that are in the open that have shoulder high grass. They do go in there to get grass seeds but I do provide feed.

 

[Shadrach]

In re: stocking density,

Has there been any attempt to study the feral chicken populations in places where they exist in order to determine how much room they need?

I don't know about studies as such but apparently the Chinese know something about this topic as do many who live in what used to be the Persian Empire.