Farming and Homesteading Heritage Poultry

[Arielle]

THought this read might be of interest to this group-- it was a link on another thread, and I just had time to finally read it this morning.

IT is a book review of RObert Plandegon's book on raising chicks, and I found it an amusing read as I am not that far from my beginnings with poultry. Meaning I started with a box of 25 sexed layers( 3 cckls) and the rest is history!! I learned there was more to chickens than hatchery: (hanks to Robert BLosl who I kept running into all over BYC; I realized another level of chicken genetics/management perservered: the world of SOP and heritage lines of chickens.

So in this reveiw that critizes this book, I value the book because it is the first step to introducing chickens to the noobie, and I value the book review because it pulls the reader to the next step like robert blosl did for me and others. THe next rung is here on this thread, using heritage breeds for their utility traits.

Some interesting tidbits that I am too much of a noob to know if even the book critic got it right.
http://www.sustainablepoultrynetwork.com/book-review-success-with-baby-chicks/

 

[Arielle]

http://extension.usu.edu/files/publications/publication/AG_Poultry_2009-01pr.pdf

Here is another article that has me confused. Primariy it is regard to the condition of the laying hens. Perhaps extremes in condition were purposly used to convey the idea, but boy I would be concerned my hens were not getting enough quality feed if they looked like the girls in lay for a long time. Or maybe I need to reaccess who is laying and who needs to be culled . . . . .

 

[Beekissed]

http://extension.usu.edu/files/publications/publication/AG_Poultry_2009-01pr.pdf

Here is another article that has me confused. Primariy it is regard to the condition of the laying hens. Perhaps extremes in condition were purposly used to convey the idea, but boy I would be concerned my hens were not getting enough quality feed if they looked like the girls in lay for a long time. Or maybe I need to reaccess who is laying and who needs to be culled . . . . .

Your very best layers always look a little hard worn...and my granny used to tell me that too. Anytime I see a hen that someone says is a good layer and she is fat and sleek, colored to the max, all I can think is "she ain't a daily layer, so the word "good" is a relative thing". They may look shiny, fat and sleek going INTO lay but by the second week or so I expect to see some loss of that overall fat layer, a little more prominent crop when it is full, a little less orange to the feet, legs and beak, etc. The feathers will lose a little of that gloss and even look a little raggedy around the edges from so much time in the nests.

They get as much feeds as the pretty hens but are just using it for a better purpose, so I don't worry about it...I can either have lovely birds drifting over the grass or I can have lovely eggs in the basket, but at this time of year and in the next few months, I can't have both and have what I call "good" egg production.

 

[gjensen]

Your very best layers always look a little hard worn...and my granny used to tell me that too. Anytime I see a hen that someone says is a good layer and she is fat and sleek, colored to the max, all I can think is "she ain't a daily layer, so the word "good" is a relative thing". They may look shiny, fat and sleek going INTO lay but by the second week or so I expect to see some loss of that overall fat layer, a little more prominent crop when it is full, a little less orange to the feet, legs and beak, etc. The feathers will lose a little of that gloss and even look a little raggedy around the edges from so much time in the nests.

They get as much feeds as the pretty hens but are just using it for a better purpose, so I don't worry about it...I can either have lovely birds drifting over the grass or I can have lovely eggs in the basket, but at this time of year and in the next few months, I can't have both and have what I call "good" egg production.

There is a lot of wisdom in that.

I am not saying a fine looking bird isn't also a good layer, because I have had just that. On the other hand, I second guess what I am hearing, when I hear the advice that the perfect hen in her second year is the keeper. Too often she is the poorest layer. I have seen it more than once.

An example is a single hen that troubled me to cull. She was sharp, even into her third year. The thing is that she rarely laid any eggs. She kept her condition because there was no wear n tear. I never bred her, and eventually got rid of her. Though she might had done well in the show room, really she was a poser. I did not need her.

I have learned to make my assessments as they come into lay, and then I eye how they molt out. If they molt out sharp, and they are good layers, then you have something good. I have learned to watch her and see what she was producing though.

I have no interest in shallow.

It always boils down to knowing your birds.

 

[Beekissed]

There is a lot of wisdom in that.

I am not saying a fine looking bird isn't also a good layer, because I have had just that. On the other hand, I second guess what I am hearing, when I hear the advice that the perfect hen in her second year is the keeper. Too often she is the poorest layer. I have seen it more than once.

An example is a single hen that troubled me to cull. She was sharp, even into her third year. The thing is that she rarely laid any eggs. She kept her condition because there was no wear n tear. I never bred her, and eventually got rid of her. Though she might had done well in the show room, really she was a poser. I did not need her.

I have learned to make my assessments as they come into lay, and then I eye how they molt out. If they molt out sharp, and they are good layers, then you have something good. I have learned to watch her and see what she was producing though.

I have no interest in shallow.

It always boils down to knowing your birds.

Exactly! And that can't be done in one season or several unless one has some experience with chicken life beforehand, even if it's with utility, hatchery style birds. The only breeds I've seen over the years that have that still good feather quality, though somewhat less sheeny and perfect, still have some~not full~ color to feet/beaks, and a quick molt recovery are the WRs and BAs in my flocks, that I would still call "good" layers. My NHs are good layers as well but have less quality in their feathering and recovery time, stay dull looking throughout laying season, but still fair compared to others.

Pretty birds are nice and they can be a great hobby if that's what a person wants...pretty birds on the green grass~I love to see them!...but I'll make no apologies for that slightly dull, and a little dirty on the back, hen with the drip strip down her bottom come this time of year....she is my mainstay. She's getting regular action by the rooster, she is wearing her tail feathers a little with her settling into the nest each day and she is loose in the back end from her constant laying.

 

[gjensen]

I think like that to Bee. I want my birds right, I want them to look sharp, but I do not want any pretenders either. Just not my style.

I guess that I want it all. That may put me at a disadvantage along the way, but I raise them for me. No one else.

I also know what I have. No one else does.

I have tried both sides, and like neither. I neither like the birds bred solely for exhibition, nor do I like some of the hatchery birds. What I mean solely for exhibition is the fine looking birds that are unable to perform, and there is some like that. Then I do not like hatchery Barred Rocks, that are not Rocks at all. A name means nothing.

I am not saying that there is something wrong with either one, in fact I see both as a genetic collection of traits. Both have good things about them.

I just want the whole bird. I do not know if that makes sense or not.

I do not see what is wrong with having good typed and colored birds that are able to do what they were supposed to be able to do.

 

[Beekissed]

It makes perfect sense to me and that is what I want too. I agree..the BRs from hatchery are nothing like they were in my granny's day and if I ever had them again I'd want them to have those qualities. The hatchery WRs I had were just a stroke of luck, I'm thinking....they have been superlative if not SOP..they are everything I'd want in a chicken except that they could have a little more....grace/beauty, I don't know what one would call it..in their style and shape, and they lack good broody tendencies.

If a person is going to invest time and intense effort into anything they should shoot for what they want, IMO...if not for that, why invest yourself? I want that tough ol' landrace style bird surviving on instinct and forage, with the large body, the excellent lay, the natural hardiness and work brickle-ness but with the ability to brood their own genetics in a big way, without assistance and much intervention on my part. And then they should look good too.

Don't want much, do I?

 

[Arielle]

I'm still trying to understand all I just read between the two of you, lol. Again I feel like I am climbing a mountain of knowledge, but the mtn keeps getting taller. lol

 

[gjensen]

It makes perfect sense to me and that is what I want too. I agree..the BRs from hatchery are nothing like they were in my granny's day and if I ever had them again I'd want them to have those qualities. The hatchery WRs I had were just a stroke of luck, I'm thinking....they have been superlative if not SOP..they are everything I'd want in a chicken except that they could have a little more....grace/beauty, I don't know what one would call it..in their style and shape, and they lack good broody tendencies.

If a person is going to invest time and intense effort into anything they should shoot for what they want, IMO...if not for that, why invest yourself? I want that tough ol' landrace style bird surviving on instinct and forage, with the large body, the excellent lay, the natural hardiness and work brickle-ness but with the ability to brood their own genetics in a big way, without assistance and much intervention on my part. And then they should look good too.

Don't want much, do I?

No, you don't. LOL. I get you though.

Where did you get the White Rocks from? Not every hatchery breed from every hatchery is complete junk. There are still some usefulness hidden here and there.

I think for some breeds, crossing the two and going back to one side could be an answer. Get us off the extreme ends so to speak.

 

[gjensen]

I'm still trying to understand all I just read between the two of you, lol. Again I feel like I am climbing a mountain of knowledge, but the mtn keeps getting taller. lol

To summarize my ramble is to say that I want it all. I want good functional birds with good type an color. I do not care for strictly ornamental, and I do not care for poor representatives. I want good farm birds that are historically accurate.

I want them to look the part and play the part.