FERMENTED FEEDS...anyone using them?

[RedneckGurl]

I am loving feeding the FF and my little flock seems to love eating it. I must admit to one thing which I would consider a major downside to FF. We really want to take a week-long vacation to Florida in November but since the chickens are now on FF, I wonder how they are going to get fed since FF can't be put in the auto-feeder like the layer mash or pellets can. We have a pet sitter who comes to check on our cats but usually comes on her own schedule. She had mentioned that she would be willing to take care of the chickens for us as well, but I worry that she won't be able to be there at 6am when the pop door opens and the kiddos expect their FF breakfast. Does anyone on here have any alternative solution or would it hurt to put them back on dry feed for the week we would be gone??? I'm conflicted.

 

[Beekissed]

I am loving feeding the FF and my little flock seems to love eating it. I must admit to one thing which I would consider a major downside to FF. We really want to take a week-long vacation to Florida in November but since the chickens are now on FF, I wonder how they are going to get fed since FF can't be put in the auto-feeder like the layer mash or pellets can. We have a pet sitter who comes to check on our cats but usually comes on her own schedule. She had mentioned that she would be willing to take care of the chickens for us as well, but I worry that she won't be able to be there at 6am when the pop door opens and the kiddos expect their FF breakfast. Does anyone on here have any alternative solution or would it hurt to put them back on dry feed for the week we would be gone??? I'm conflicted.

Just put out a feeder that will hold the amounts they would eat in a week and dish it out...and go. The feed won't "go bad" and it won't grow mold or anything on top as the birds will continually be accessing it. This is what I do when I leave for several days and it always works out just fine. Just make sure that feed is fermented well before leaving it out and the moisture in the feed will continue to keep your organisms healthy and working right along. It's no different than that feed being in the bucket fermenting all week..it's just a bigger and more open container.

You can put them back on dry feed for a week but those who have reported increased feed use, the return of stinking poop and a drop in laying. I never would have thought the difference would be that dramatic for just one week but that's what folks have been telling me.

No worries!

 

[Beekissed]

It's funny - in a recent conversation I had with someone regarding the benefits of feeding FF, their hang-up seemed to be with the fact that the FF is only fed 1-2 times a day as opposed to continuously free fed. This gentleman seemed very proud of the fact that his girls were able to eat "as much as they wanted" throughout the day. He was a much older gentleman and I wonder if he is one of those who is of the mindset that quantity equals affection. In fact, his attitude about it reminded me of something I heard once describing the generational gaps:

Today's generation asks, "Is it pretty?"
Their parents ask, "Did it taste good?"
Their grandparents ask, "Did you get enough?"

I have no clue if this has anything to do with why someone may choose to not feed FF. I'm just pondering out loud... Maybe they just think it's harder than it really is?

I think you are right...for many years now I've noticed that people keep continuous feeds out for their pets...for some reason they think this is normal nutrition for these animals? Do they feel guilty about having three meals a day and unlimited grazing abilities when their pets do not? Or is it the general equating pets with humans thing that always rears its ugly head?

When I was young a person never even bought dog food or cat food and neither one was kept in the house. Animals ate the scraps from humans and if it wasn't enough, they went hunting or scavenging. They lived healthy, long lives and never required vetting. I don't even recall giving wormers back then. Funny how times have changed...some think for the better?

They actually can do continuous feed for their chickens by putting out enough in the morning to last the birds all day long, so that's a non-issue. I think it's just laziness or the fear of trying something different from the herd.

I've been doing FF for 3 months now. I do agree that there is less waste with FF, and the girls poo is not as smelly. Basically, I add water and layer crumble to the stuff remaining in the bottom of the 1 qt container I ferment it in. (Original culture was started with ACV) By the next morning, it's pretty bubbly. I usually keep 2 qts going at a time. I have not added any whole grains. But I do have some BOSS, and some "wild bird seed" consisting of cracked corn, milo, and BOSS. If I add that to my FF mix, how much longer should I allow it to ferment, and is there really a benefit of adding the whole seeds to my current mix. My girls only get dry feed when I run out of FF. It doesn't seem that they have a particular preference. However, I read an experiment done by a fellow raising meat birds. He used FF on one group, and regular dry feed on the second group. His outcome was actually better with the second group, though the FF group was off to a slow start as they didn't initially take to the FF. Has any one done any further studies comparing the outcome of FF to dry feed? (in relation to chick growth, and expense of feed)

Many unofficial studies have been done in the backyards of flock owners on this but wouldn't exactly qualify as a "study"...just basic experimentation and weighing the results. I usually compare my chick growth and feed usage on meaties to those who are feeding dry for the same amounts of time...it always comes out favorable, though can't really be considered a "study".

The real success is in the overall experience. I fed out 54 meat birds for 1/4 the amounts of feed and expense that others did and had comparable finish weights and had even more savings because of no mortality due to health issues. Saved on bedding in the coop because of lack of moisture and smell in the feces. Saved on time with water usage as the water usage was way down. The weight on my birds was due to just lean, packed on meat, whereas much of the finishing weights on traditionally grown meaties can be attributed to a lot of fat in the skin and tissues. So the savings is showing up there as well...no one needs that much fat in their diet nowadays.

A slower and longer grow out is desirable in the meat birds if one wants healthier and more flavorful meat with a better texture, so that's a win/win also, IMO.

The benefit to adding whole grains to the layer ration, for me, is that I can cut the cost of feeding 100% layer rations in the times of year that they are not laying as much by adding a lower protein/lower cost grain to my mix so that they still get bulk and crude fiber, but not as much proteins they do not need. This saves me money and it's the only reason I do it, as my layer mash source has all the needed nutrients for poultry life and production, so adding grains to it aren't doing anything in the way of increasing nutrients.

In the fall I add some BOSS for more fats so that they can lay on some fat before winter, like most animals do. During the slow times I'll add barley to cut the ration and maybe oats if they are cheaper at the time. It's a way of feeding cheaper and improving the variety of grains consumed...if my birds were in a coop/run situation this is something I'd be doing but I'd be sprouting the grains instead so that they can actually receive greens for the winter. Mine free range all winter, so I don't need to do that.

 

[morton]

im new to raising chickens but before i got them in feb. i read a lot on this forum.
i scanned the many hundreds of pages and beekissed was a large part of it.
thank you for all the valuble info beekissed!
that being said, i started my chicks on the second day with ferment starter crumble and they went nuts over it. wouldnt touch the other dish with the dry food.
now my recipe is as follows
30# whole corn
30# whole wheat
20# rolled barley
20# oats
12.5 # boss
5# salt
that is fermented
when drained i add
1/2 cup kelp
1/2 cup meat and bone meal
sprinkle with lime

please send feedback as to where it lacks or where its excessive.

they also free range

 

[lazy gardener]

I've never tried peas and peanuts but I don't imagine there would be a problem. Also..contrary to what myths go around...corn does not heat a bird internally more than any other grain. I feed corn in the ration all year round and see no difference whatsoever in the condition of the bird, hotter or not. It doesn't keep them warm in the winter and it doesn't make them hot in the summer...no more than it does when you eat corn!

Your common sense is a ray of sunshine! I recently read that you shouldn't give chickens corn on the cob on a hot summer day because it would over heat them. Now, how many of us would turn down fresh corn on the cob... even fresh out of the pot... on a hot summer day... or any other day of the year! A calorie is a calorie is a calorie!

 

[Beekissed]

TY! I'm not so sure it is as welcomed by many who really don't like such things as common sense interrupting their thought processes and disputing what they've learned out of books.

 

[RoseMarie1]

TY! I'm not so sure it is as welcomed by many who really don't like such things as common sense interrupting their thought processes and disputing what they've learned out of books.

oh dear, you can bet this for sure, I USED to go by what the Storeys guide to raising ducks book and then bought me one for raising poultry by them. BUT since I found you...... I've not looked at the book since! You ARE my source for info and knowledge. PLEASEEEEE don't leave us or I'll be lost!!!

 

[Beekissed]

You can ask ol' Walt about Storey's guide...he can tell you the 411 on how much that gal knows about chickens. Approximately nil. She is his next door neighbor and has only had chickens a few years, doesn't do the hands on work with them. She is just a teacher and a writer, not a chicken expert. Sort of like a few blog sites I could name...very little practical experience, a few years owning chickens, and has just borrowed bits and pieces from this person or that person and wrote it all down to look like they own these experiences. It's kinda funny, really.

Rose, I'm no expert either and in chicken years, I'm just a novice compared to some of these oldsters on this forum. I just type a lot more than they do, is all.

 

[bruceh]

You can ask ol' Walt about Storey's guide...he can tell you the 411 on how much that gal knows about chickens. Approximately nil. She is his next door neighbor and has only had chickens a few years, doesn't do the hands on work with them. She is just a teacher and a writer, not a chicken expert. Sort of like a few blog sites I could name...very little practical experience, a few years owning chickens, and has just borrowed bits and pieces from this person or that person and wrote it all down to look like they own these experiences. It's kinda funny, really.

Rose, I'm no expert either and in chicken years, I'm just a novice compared to some of these oldsters on this forum. I just type a lot more than they do, is all.

bee where is good old walt. what is a book? never read a book on raising a chicken. i asked my chickens. they told me what they needed.

 

[Beekissed]

Haven't seen him...sure do miss him, though! I picked up a few chicken books at the library once and found they were the same book with a different cover and author. Same ol' stuff, no variation. One of them was the Storey book...

I found the Storey guide on sheep to be equally as useless.