FERMENTED FEEDS...anyone using them?

[Tikkijane]

Thanks for the input everyone. I'm going to give this thicker not covered by water FF a try. I was backslopping but not sure if over night was enough time for all the benefits of FF. Please correct me if I'm wrong, backslopping is fine if you already have a good ferment going but waiting 3 more days after backslopping would be better. Also where do you all keep your FF? I really don't want to keep mine in my kitchen. Can it be kept in the garage or shed during the winter?

It's totally fine to backslop and wait overnight and then feed in the morning. The point was to let every batch get more than 2 days before backslopping and refreshing again, so that you are only making more seconday batches every 3 ish days.

 

[Tikkijane]

By gone bad I meant the sick rotting smell, not the rich sour dough smell. Their is quite a difference.

My method is the lacto-fermentation which is anaerobic, that I learned from lots of research and experimentation, and it works for me. My birds eat very little other food besides the FF I give them every day. My batch maintains a very nice yeasty sour dough smell and ferments the food I add each day.

Everyone is free to use whatever method works for them, I wasn't implying that mine was the ON.lY method, but I've been doing it for a year and it isn't a messy, sloppy, ordeal at all.

Reference: http://naturalchickenkeeping.blogspot.com/p/fermented-feed.html

Tha blog has erroneous information; covering with water was one erroneous fact. It's also one of the reasons the FAQ was written; to counter that incorrect information and provide accurate info.

Water is, and never has been, a way to prevent mold.. Yes, as it ferments more and more, it can smell downright awful. That stlli does not mean it's gotten rotten or moldy oe gone bad.

Everyone is more than welcome to make thir feed as wet as they want it. It doesn't need to be fancy or complicated.

Most everyone on this thread has done tons and tons of research. Some of that research is linked from the FAQ. If you haven't read this whole thread, it's definitely worth it. We are not a bunch of dimwitted bumpins.

 

[BY Chicken Lady]

Most everyone on this thread has done tons and tons of research. Some of that research is linked from the FAQ. If you haven't read this whole thread, it's definitely worth it. We are not a bunch of dimwitted bumpins.

I never called you dim witted bumpkins, I was merely interjecting my point of view and apparently it's unwelcomed. Sorry to have ruffled your feathers on this open forum.

 

[Tikkijane]

"Aerobic fermentation actually is a misnomer, fermentation by definition is anaerobic. In the presence of Oxygen (aerobic) “cellular respiration,” not fermentation, occurs. The bacteria involved in fermentation actually prefer to use Oxygen, because it is more energy efficient. However, “cellular respiration” does NOTproduce lactic-acid, the goal of lacto-fermentation."






Darn it. My reply got eaten. Since I'm having a hard time seeing, this will be brief. That's the point, up there. Our fermentation takes place in an aerobic environment to gas off {yes, glass can explode from the gas pressure, as folks have shared on this thread} and to grab some wild teadts, etc but that does not mean it's aerobic fermentation. I have a link that explains a lot of this.

To further explain that my method is anaerobic (covered in liquid with very little oxygen coming in contact with the feed) and apparently yours is aerobic (with lots of oxygen) are two totally different methods, not just a choice of more or less liquid.

Please read:

http://www.pickl-it.com/faq/109/what-is-aerobic-fermentation/

http://www.pickl-it.com/faq/110/what-is-anaerobic-fermentation/

http://www.pickl-it.com/faq/148/process-microbial-lacto-fermentation/

 

[Tikkijane]

http://www.fermentacap.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=12&Itemid=131

Dispells lots of myths about aerobic vs anerobic.

"Aerobic fermentation actually is a misnomer, fermentation by definition is anaerobic. In the presence of Oxygen (aerobic) “cellular respiration,” not fermentation, occurs. The bacteria involved in fermentation actually prefer to use Oxygen, because it is more energy efficient. However, “cellular respiration” does NOTproduce lactic-acid, the goal of lacto-fermentation."






Darn it. My reply got eaten. Since I'm having a hard time seeing, this will be brief. That's the point, up there. Our fermentation takes place in an aerobic environment to gas off {yes, glass can explode from the gas pressure, as folks have shared on this thread} and to grab some wild teadts, etc but that does not mean it's aerobic fermentation. I have a link that explains a lot of this.

 

[Tikkijane]

I never called you dim witted bumpkins, I was merely interjecting my point of view and apparently it's unwelcomed. Sorry to have ruffled your feathers on this open forum.

You're not ruffling my feathers at all. . You xame onto this thread clearly without reading the whole thing, prresented yourself as someone of some sort of authority, and procceded to "efucaye"us. Had you taken the time to read the thread, you would have quickly learned that many of the folks here are INCREDIBLY knowledgeable, including BeeKissed, who gave the information {that was erroneously presented} for that natural keeping blog post that has confused so many people.

When a newcomer comes on to a thread clearly without the benefit of reading it and begins giving advice that is not quite right, it's important to correct that information.

People read stuff and think they are doing something much more sophisticated because they use big words. . Some of us like to break it down so folks can understand it. Your feed ferments the same way mine does, lol.

I don't begrudge folks who have 3 buckets for straining and use $$$$ starters and have 50 precisely measured ingredients. They are welcome to make it as complicated and as pricey as they want . Still doesn't mean "the other" way is inferior {as you implied} ir qrong or less fermented goodness.

But ya, I'm not ruffled at all. . I do apologixe for typos. I'm on my phone and can't see worth a darn right now.

 

[LindaB220]

Thanks!

Unfortunately i can't do anything about Thelma...can't make her eat or try to feed her separate from the others.. they just come running and horn in so i guess it's going to be what it's going to be...i threw some pelleted food out for her before roosting time and she ate some of it, she's just the way she is, doesn't seem unhealthy or anything.

I don't really know how much i put out, i think in the morning at least 2-3 cups and since it's moist there's always some leftover--almost always and then later in the day while they're free ranging i'll put some out and they'll eat a bit of it. I guess this is the best i can do barring also providing dry commercial pellets.

i am thinking of buying more commercial layer pellets (although IMO a HUGE step down from their organic 20% layer feed they have now, fermented) and throwing it into the FF to ferment also. Maybe i won't, maybe i'll just figure they can figure it out themselves and not worry about it anymore :\

OH..i got 2 of those acrylic thingies a month ago, all happy that it was deep enough that they wouldn't walk in their food. NOPE, they knocked those over too. So now i have to expend more energy to figure out how to stabilize them, LOL

BTW their run is concrete and they mash that crap all over the concrete, i have to hose it down every day. Thrills!

Bahahaha Been there on the tumping over. I only was able to get a thick tall 7" acrylic crisper out of a tiny fridge to work fo rme. I wedge it so they can't topple it over by putting bricks around it. It works. I wanted to do the organic thing but prices just ate my lunch and I had to make a decision of what I want. I use regular feed and wheat and crimped oats and BOSS. They are so incredibly healthy that I can't gripe. I stay away from corn and soy. That's as good as it gets.

 

[LindaB220]

My problem is i never had chickens before 4 months or so ago and am on a huge learning curve and i'm way ahead of most people in that i care about them and am buying organic feed (when i can't afford it myself) and going the extra mile to ferment and trying to learn everything i can...most would throw pelleted food out, provide water and not even care if they're free range.

Also..these birds have only known me for a few months, i can barely touch them, a couple of them will sometimes squat and let me pet them but that's about it. Only way i've kind of been able to handle them is if they're on the roost, to haul a scale out there, haul them off the roost and try to keep them still on a scale wouldn't benefit them and also there's NOTHING I CAN DO to make any of them eat the amount of food required except put it out there. i don't have time to stand and babysit and see who eats the most as they don't gobble all of it up in one block of time.

I guess things are just going to have to be what they are.... i kind of wish i didn't rescue these hens because when i get animals i give them everything i've gone, sometimes to the deteriment of myself and well being. But i do appreciate people on this forum bearing with me and patiently answering questions--some i imagine will continue (the questions). Also like i said it has been frustrating not to see them relishing every morsel like most on here have seen *SHRUG*

I also agree with you about "backslopping". It was your website that encouraged me to start FF and just recently i got a much bigger bucket so that i wouldn't have to refresh with new food and water for at least 3-4 days because i want everything to have time to ferment..also the days are certainly getting colder where i live!! I also have drier ferment than wet and i as much as i can thoroughly stir and it's getting HARD because of the amount of food but i feel i cannot be adding/backslopping every other day, to me just not enough time to really get the ferment going especially with the temps lowering.

Susie, why don't you make a small batch in the warm house with a little of the backslopping. It's ready overnight. When you make your new batch, add it in with the water and stir before adding all the feed. It permeates through the batch and gets it jump started. If you are concerned with it, make 2 buckets and keep one in the house until it's ready and swap out

 

[ReillyJ]

Bahahaha Been there on the tumping over. I only was able to get a thick tall 7" acrylic crisper out of a tiny fridge to work fo rme. I wedge it so they can't topple it over by putting bricks around it. It works. I wanted to do the organic thing but prices just ate my lunch and I had to make a decision of what I want. I use regular feed and wheat and crimped oats and BOSS. They are so incredibly healthy that I can't gripe. I stay away from corn and soy. That's as good as it gets.

Yea i'll have to figure something out cuz they're kicking it out and it's mashed solid on the concrete floor, wedging is a good idea, just another thing for me to have to wrap my brain around.

I can do organic cuz i only have 4 hens so it's ok and it's soy/corn free also. Just concerned about Thelma, i'm sure she eats but i'll put the food down and she'll walk away looking around like she's looking for something else, her crop never looks real full to me but i have my hands full w/human problems so she's just going to have to figure it out

 

[ReillyJ]

Susie, why don't you make a small batch in the warm house with a little of the backslopping. It's ready overnight. When you make your new batch, add it in with the water and stir before adding all the feed. It permeates through the batch and gets it jump started. If you are concerned with it, make 2 buckets and keep one in the house until it's ready and swap out

Oh i'm fine, i think my mix is doing pretty good!

thanks!