Fermenting Feed for Meat Birds

[Costa Rica Art]

Costa Rica Art - what kind of grains do they grow locally. Wheat and oats may not be the best choice for you. I would see what are grown fairly locally and try those.

Something is going on with my getting the notices of post, just got a different one today. Anyway, there aren't many grains grown in CR, most are imported. One of the big complaints by the local farmers is grain can be imported cheaper than they can be raised here. So I'm looking for what seems to work best for others in the states for a starting point then if I find something else to try I have something to compare too. The only thing they grow lots of is rice, not going to try that.
BTW, something I've noticed that is happening with the eggs the yokes are getting redder and redder, they look awesome. I've always had good eggs as the chickens can range the backyard all day but now they can snack on FF at their leisure. Their droppings are much more solid plus it seems like they are getting a little more weight on them. As I've never weighed them it is hard to tell exactly but to me they look better. Something I've noticed that may be a results of FF but they have normally been out in the yard during light rain but now they head for the coop and stay dry.

 

[Achickenwrangler#1]

Art - you aren't going to be trying to feed sake are you? as I guess my grain should produce beer!? I wish I could check my yokes, but all my eggs went into chicks this spring/summer and the young pullets are just now pol but an interesting thing to note. How do they taste?

 

[Lacy Blues]

Wow! I finally got all 82 pages read!

I still have to figure out my bucket system. It sure would be nice if you guys that have been doing it for a while would post pics of your fermentation set up. I'm just having the hardest time wrapping my brain around this. I have laying/breeder flocks, meat birds (heritage) and lots of little babies growing up. I figure the meat birds and babies can eat the same thing and the layers/breeders can have the lay pellets and grains. I don't think mine has fermented yet. Hasn't had a chance. I mixed up their feed like normal and then added water, vinegar and yogurt and let it sit all night.

I suppose if I added more grains... maybe it might actually bubble? But with the lay pellets in their it just turns to mush, do I still keep the water above the mush level? I also need to get some buckets. I have 3 big bowls on the kitchen counter and two ice cream buckets all with mush in them. I have 100+ birds to feed. Stirring that food is incredibly hard on my shoulder (bad rotator cuff, I think) and elbow (tendonitis?).

I fed my breeder flock and all the babies today with what I mixed up last night and boy did they gobble it down!

I'm looking forward to how the meaties will taste. I need to find a bigger feeder pan for them, there are 27 of them and the barrel feeder doesn't work well for this application.

I'm looking forward to seeing some pictures from you guys. Help me out please?

 

[Achickenwrangler#1]

It will bubble more if its warm
I use scratch only right now. But did you drill holes in the inner sleeve bucket so you can drain it?
Some have used 3 inch PVC pipe, cut in half length wise. I have that too, but for scratch I just fling it on the ground ( there are pics of the feeder) also you can use a gutter with wire cover.
I use ice cream tubs inside nail buckets, but some use five gallon buckets. Don't have any pics yet. I think if you made daily small batches you wouldn't have to stir it much, just make sure it's all wet the initial time. Hope that helps some.

 

[Kassaundra]

Wow! I finally got all 82 pages read!

I still have to figure out my bucket system. It sure would be nice if you guys that have been doing it for a while would post pics of your fermentation set up. I'm just having the hardest time wrapping my brain around this. I have laying/breeder flocks, meat birds (heritage) and lots of little babies growing up. I figure the meat birds and babies can eat the same thing and the layers/breeders can have the lay pellets and grains. I don't think mine has fermented yet. Hasn't had a chance. I mixed up their feed like normal and then added water, vinegar and yogurt and let it sit all night.

I suppose if I added more grains... maybe it might actually bubble? But with the lay pellets in their it just turns to mush, do I still keep the water above the mush level? I also need to get some buckets. I have 3 big bowls on the kitchen counter and two ice cream buckets all with mush in them. I have 100+ birds to feed. Stirring that food is incredibly hard on my shoulder (bad rotator cuff, I think) and elbow (tendonitis?).

I fed my breeder flock and all the babies today with what I mixed up last night and boy did they gobble it down!

I'm looking forward to how the meaties will taste. I need to find a bigger feeder pan for them, there are 27 of them and the barrel feeder doesn't work well for this application.

I'm looking forward to seeing some pictures from you guys. Help me out please?

My suggestion would be to simplify your feed. Everyone could eat fermented grower /developer and just have calcium on the side free choice for your layers.

Feeding 100 birds I would ferment on a bigger scale not one bucket every day, I would do a minimum of a week at a time.

Yes if you keep the ferment going longer then overnight you need to keep all ferment covered in water whether grains or mush, as long as the ferment is covered in ferment water there is no risk of botulism, but there is a substantial risk if not covered in layer of liquid ferment.

 

[Costa Rica Art]

Art - you aren't going to be trying to feed sake are you? as I guess my grain should produce beer!? I wish I could check my yokes, but all my eggs went into chicks this spring/summer and the young pullets are just now pol but an interesting thing to note. How do they taste?

Any time you ferment anything with any kind of natural sugar you will produce CO2 and alcohol which either evaporates if you have no cover over your fermenting feed or it can collect on the lid if you keep your mash covered. Lacy Blue would like photos of different ways of fermenting FF so I will take photos today and post them. Now as to my feeding sake, yup, if that is what I produce (what everyone produces) the chickens get it. Being that I have my containers setting on top of my fridge now the alcohol evaporates from the mash, I suppose some of it remains so the gang may get a little "sake" with their meal, gourmet dinning at its finest don't you think.

BTW all grain has some type of sugar so you will produce "beer" or booze, which every way you want to call it. I'm guessing that a chicken would have to ingest a lot of the grain the way we ferment it to get tipsy.

As to the taste of the eggs, they are great, much richer than eggs from hens just fed the normal feed. The whites are less runny, the over all egg, shell and all seems to have improved. The more I do with this FF the better things seem to be getting. I will be able to see if the one ponedora chick (that survived) is an improvement over the ones that were fed regular feed, I'll see if she is heaver and how big she gets. Just no end to the benefits of FF. . . .

 

[Costa Rica Art]

Yes if you keep the ferment going longer then overnight you need to keep all ferment covered in water whether grains or mush, as long as the ferment is covered in ferment water there is no risk of botulism, but there is a substantial risk if not covered in layer of liquid ferment.

Please explain the possibility of botulism. I would think that the alcohol produced in the fermentation process would prevent any types of problems with any bacteria I.E. botulism etc. whether the grain is under water or not. I do keep my grain under water so all of it can absorb all the moisture it can, the chickens like it better and of course it is easier for them to digest (in my opinion).

 

[Kassaundra]

Please explain the possibility of botulism. I would think that the alcohol produced in the fermentation process would prevent any types of problems with any bacteria I.E. botulism etc. whether the grain is under water or not. I do keep my grain under water so all of it can absorb all the moisture it can, the chickens like it better and of course it is easier for them to digest (in my opinion).

I was passing on info from the person that first introduced me to fermenting grains for chickens, I was told to always make sure there is a liquid layer over the grain and I wouldn't have to worry about botulism. I have always practiced this since I keep my grains fermenting for weeks to a month at a time. I am not sure where they got their info, but they have been fermenting grains for their chickens for MANY years so didn't question thier experience w/ it, and while I was not able to find any co-oberating (sp) evidence (not much info directly related to fermenting grains for feed and botulism in animals) I didn't want to risk it by experimenting.

 

[Kassaundra]

I'm not sure the ph level but anything 4 and under is safe, it would be impossible for botulism to grow at all.

 

[Costa Rica Art]

I'm not sure the ph level but anything 4 and under is safe, it would be impossible for botulism to grow at all.

Ah, thanks for the info, I agree to the ol' saying "if it works don't mess with it". I'll check my PH levels just to see what they are. I have a friend who is a chemistry professor and has also done so bio research, perhaps he can shed some light on this subject.

Never hurts to make sure of what we are doing and always looking for the better, safer way.