Fermenting Feed for Meat Birds

[RoseMarie1]

Just an update - We butchered our meat birds this last weekend. Started out with 51, lost 3 at the very beginning, so had 48. We culled the roosters a couple of weeks ago, so had 33 hens to butcher at this time. (Had 3 grown children, their spouses, and 3 of 5 grandchildren helping- all in varying degrees) Grandkids helped catch birds and bring to the killing cones. (3 orange plastic traffic cones bought at Home Depot). I slit their throats and let them bleed out and oversaw the overall process. Son-in-law scalded and manned the chicken plucker. Others took turns with cleaning and gutting the birds. This was the first time for everyone but myself and my husband - and we had a blast.

We set everything up under a big oak tree in the yard. Killing cones out in the sunshine, next to that the scalding pot, and over a little ways the chicken plucker (whizbang plucker my husband built from the kit). On the other side of the tree we had a long table set up with a large trash can for the offal, and 4 buckets with ice for the necks and extra fat, chicken feet, gizzards, livers and hearts. At the end of the table were a couple of ice chests with ice for packing the cleaned birds. A water hose was also available for those gutting the birds to clean the carcass with fresh clean water.

The biggest concern for everyone had been the odor of the butchering process. Two of the boys had worked at a bird farm as teens, feeding and tending animals and still remember and hate that chicken smell. They had been impressed when the birds were growing because the FF birds did not stink. Well the same consensus was given on Saturday. FF birds DO NOT have that sick poultry odor when processing. My daughter told me that the main thing she was worried about was the smell while butchering the birds. Once she realized these birds did not stink, and she was shown how to gut the birds, she got busy and did great. She said that since the odor was not a problem, then the process was not that bad. My son-in-law, who had never done anything like this and I could tell was there because he is just a sweet guy and did not want to be the only one who refused, did the scalding and manned the chicken plucker. He told me later, that he thought it was going to be something really gory, and that it was actually a very clean process and not bad at all. He definitely won't mind doing it again.

The cleaned birds averaged 4 to 4-1/2 pounds. I left them to rest in the icebox overnight then used shrink wrap bags to freeze them.

The main thing is everyone is thrilled to get the fresh chicken. Since we had culled roosters from this batch several weeks ago, they had already had a taste of the meat and loved the fact that it has a real chicken flavor and also texture to the meat. The meat is not tough, but does have more texture than what you normally get in the store. They are already asking when we will start the next batch, and everyone is game for helping with the butchering again. They are also asking for ducks, so we may try a batch of ducks as well.

I can't tell you how much I appreciate the info on this thread. I stumbled across this and have followed it for the whole 115 pages and counting. Before we started using the FF, when these birds were about 3 weeks old, the smell of the chickens was horrible, even though the chicken tractor was moved every day. These birds just STUNK. Within days of changing the feed to Fermented feed, the smell was gone. These birds were healthy and very active. I could not have asked for a better outcome. I am sure that had we not used FF, this would have been our first and last family butchering day. As it is, I believe we have started a new family tradition!

I noticed this myself on the stinking birds! I have noticed though since I have started the FF they don't stink. I have picked up like 3-4 of them and held them close to my chest to keep them calm and they don't stink at all. Believe me I have a nose to, I can smell what others in my family can't.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Nice! I made my own trough style feeders out of plastic gutter with end caps. I made 3 of them out of 1 ten foot piece of it.

I made mine out of gutter to. It's vinyl not metal but only have the one and it's NOT big enough since they have grown so much. So I'm in town today getting the end caps for the other piece of gutter so I can make them another feeder out of it. THEN we should have PLENTY of room for them all to feed.
They sure are liking this FF. I walk out there with my bucket and here they come like wild animals that hasn't eaten in days.

I always get a chuckle because I have to run to the gates to keep them in the area I need for them to be in so they wont be trying to feed as I am trying to load the trough and their pans. IF it is just a few that's ok, BUT 38 chickens is another thing. They even want to eat out of the spoon when I am trying to put the food in the trough. I have got to figure out an easier way though to do mine since I can't put it out in their pen, I have the bucket inside fermenting. As long as the smell doesn't get any worse it will be OK inside but if it gets worse I will have to take it out to the carport. My strainer bucket is the 4 pound lard bucket and I have to let two of those drain so it takes me some time as well as some thought ahead of time so I can get their food out to them each morning and evening.

 

[Beekissed]

Bee - at what age do you start to restrict their FF intake?

My intent with my last batch of broilers was to allow them to forage for more of their food. They turned out lazier than any previous batch despite being able to forage earlier (about 18 days). I could not ween them off their FF. Maybe I'm just too soft when I go out there and see them so hungry.

It will probably work better this time as I have a broody hen to foster them.

Day 1...that's the day I start restricting the feed. I feed them much like I feed DP birds...two meals a day as chicks, one meal a day when they are out on free range and able to rustle up their own grub.

 

[RoseMarie1]

One thing I've noticed about everyone's results in using the FF is that they all note the lack of bad smells in the coop/bedding. That is a great side effect of using the FF, but I think it's important to mention that it is merely a side effect and the physiology behind why it is happening is a much more important and desirable goal.

This means that there is better bowel health due to more villi being present in the bowel. More villi means more blood supply, which means better nutrient absorption from the available feeds passing through the small intestine. The fermentation of the feed before consumption also changes some of the feed ingredients, allowing it to be digested and absorbed by a monogastric animal such as a chicken. This means that the food is being used instead of passing through the bowel underutilized. This means the bird is getting more from the feed and this results in less overall feed being fed or needed. This translates into saving pennies that grow into dollars over the long haul.

The introduction of good cultures also helps inhibit the overgrowth of more harmful pathogens such as salmonella, coccidia, e.coli, etc. This means your chickens have better health overall.

Another good side effect of having this healthier bowel structure, blood supply, and good bacteria is a decrease in parasite infestation. The more digestive enzymes and better digestive action is prohibitive to the growth and production of intestinal parasites. They thrive better in an unhealthy bird with an unhealthy bowel.

This is important to know when you are thinking of de-worming your chickens: One has to ask themselves, how did my chicken's health get to such a state that it has an infestation? Take care of that problem and the other problem~visible worms being shed in the feces~will right itself. All mammals have a parasite present in their bodies/bowels, but you will rarely see evidence of it in the fecal matter unless there is an overgrowth. When is the last time you looked in your toilet and saw long, white worms in the poop? This does not mean you have no worms, it merely means you have them but you are not infested with a large population of them.

Same with chickens. It's expected that chickens will have some level of intestinal parasites, but never enough to affect their health or production. All animals have them and they thrive anyway. The key is not to try to get all the worms out of your chickens~if the conditions are that lovely, they'll just be back. Rather, the goal should be to create such a healthy chicken that the worms can not get a foothold inside them and colonize enough to cause problems.

FF has so many benefits that I can really see no down side to it and I know that the decreased smell of the feces is the most obvious, but that lack of smell is just a sign of the many other benefits of this method of feeding.

Thank you Bee for explaining that! I was wondering the WHY behind it. ALSO wondering why some of mine still have a runny stool when they're all eating the ff. I am giving them zucchini, cucumbers, and gave them some blueberries that was too ripe hubby picked. Oh and BOSS as well. Most of the time I am sprouting it. Trying to let them free range as much as I can but can't let them when I am not here. Tomorrow will be their 4th day I believe it is for being on the ff. My chicks are around 10 weeks old.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Nope I can not see it either

thanx for letting me know.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Mother just refers to a collection of bacteria/yeasts and one can have it on the fermented feed, no matter what method was used to establish cultures. The ACV mother isn't a large presence for long as it is soon outnumbered by the increasing lactobacilli...it's still present but in lesser numbers. That film you see is just a mixture of both and is no bad thing...it can be stirred back into the mix without any harmful effects.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=548807978511429

Wanted you to see this video Bee of mine feeding the 1st day on their fermented food.
Thank you Bee for explaining that. Now I know I have some good stuff going already! I was wondering if it was good for them yet since it's only been like 4 days of me feeding them this. Mine started bubbling before the day was out because it's hot here.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Hi All,
For those using a 5 gallon bucket or any container with a lid you might consider using a beer brewing airlock. The airlock lets gases out while keeping flies and gnats out.

http://morebeer.com/view_product/16598/103702/Airlock_-_3_Piece

Joe

UGH I have some of these I used for my food ferments for us and haven't even thought about using them! THANX for the idea! I was wondering if you drilled small holes in the 5 gallon bucket lid and then also tied the stocking around the lid, that would keep out any teeny tiny bugs. But one could use 3-4 or 5 of the airlocks and that should work since it lets the gases out.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Air needs to go in, too, for the beneficial bacteria and yeasts so an air lock wouldn't work in this case.

that's good to know. sure glad I didn't try them since I'd mess mine up! Will do the holes in the lid and cover with a stocking to.

 

[RoseMarie1]

Hi Everyone..... So cool this thread is still active.. I thought I d pop back in and update everyone on my FF progress with my Cornish X

They are 5 weeks old now and I have a very healthy bunch of chickens. I am feeding a blend of Oats, BOSS, Scratch, alfalfa blocks and pellets at 20 % protien. They get a large feeding of FF at night when I put them in. Then in the morning when I turn them into the run I set out another dish with FF. This time I have to keep them in a run so i cant let them on green grass. So what I do is add cut grass and hay that is left over from our cattle to the run each day.. then I scatter Game Bird Chow around. to encourage them to move around the run.

Problems I had:

1. The crumble and pellet feed breaks down so much that alot of it just washes out of the strainer bucket or just clogs the whole system up. So I made a second seperate bucket just for pellets. I use less water and just pretty much let the pellets soak up the mix.

Thats my only problem so far. I love the rest.

Now I have never had Meat birds before so I cant say they are growing better or faster. I can say they are Healthy looking critters . For the most part thier feathers are in great shape. No leg issues. They are definatly active birds. More than I thought they would be based on all I read prior to trying this. They run around and play fight with each other and dig all over the run. Again since I havent raised them before I cant be sure but I do not think they will be ready to process at 8 weeks. However if they keep going at this rate Im thinking 9 or 10 weeks top. ( Maybe I should post Pics and see what you all think

Positives:

Everyone told me they were gonna be nasty stinky birds and I d be sorry.. So far I havent had to many issues with that. I dont consider them that much worse than raising my laying flock. I use the DLM for the most part and have had to change the coop out 2 times in the 5 weeks.. Simply because they birds knocked over the waterer and flooded it out. A better watering system is on my list for next time Ive kinda been making notes on what I think a good pen for fall meaties would be. Im leaning towords a tractor set up for next time.


So I also have been feeding the fermented grains to my laying flock.. So far they LOVE IT. In the 5 weeks Ive been doing this I have seen much nicer looking feathers. Harder egg shells for sure. I had some hens that had been picked at so much they have lost most of their tail feathers.. I was surprised at how much faster they are growing the feather s back AND not sure if it has anything to do with the FF but the other girls are leaving them alone. They are just happy birds

Now for a SURPRISING benefit.... W e have a 3 year old Heifer that has been giving us a trouble for 2 years.. Twice she has just stopped eating and drinking and lost tons of weight. The first time I hand fed her grains, special feeds, hays etc and it took me a Year to get her back to looking healthy. We put her back with the herd this spring and she was great until August. She went down again refusing food or water. So again I seperated her and tried all I had done before. She just wasnt having it.. Nothing. Call the Vet.... he explained that it was ( VERY LONG NAME) I cant remember or attempt to spell it correctly. Basically her stomachs and gut dont work properly. there is a twisting in the intestines causes her pain and she doesnt absorb nutrients.. thats the gist. He told me to continue feeding her small meals several times a day and gave me a medicine to add to her water. Well it wasnt working and we had basically decided to put her down. Now mind you I have been spending alot of time with this critter and even though its not like me I have gotten attached to her. She follows me all over the barnyard and leans over my shoulders when Im working with the chickens.. She even chases the nasty Rooster I have away from me when he decides to attack...
Sooooo about 3 weeks ago she snuck into the barn where I keep the feeds. She got into the bucket of FF.... AND ate almost half of it and drank the mix.. before I caught her... I had no idea what this was gonna do to her but just waited and watched.. Well geuss what SHE IS FINALLY ON THE MEND!!!! She is gaining weight.. Eating FF grains each day. She has Normal looking cow poop. She is drinking water on her own.. I do add a bit of ACV or Apple juice to it still. I ferment Oats, Corn, and Alfalfa for her and I am thinking of adding Barley tot he mix. She still wont touch dry feeds or Hay.. But is eating green grass and a really good sign.. Chewing her Cudd each night. Its been a very surprising result.

Now if she keeps doing well.. my biggest problem will be getting from the barn to the chicken coops each day with out her knocking me down for the FF

SORRY THIS IS SO LONG BUT I AM SO TICKLED OVER ALL THESE RESULTS I JUST WANTED TO SHARE!!!

YEA!!!!!! That is awesome and I am so excited for you! I know how you can get attached to critters! This is soooo cool! So happy she found your food!!!

 

[Beekissed]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=548807978511429

Wanted you to see this video Bee of mine feeding the 1st day on their fermented food.
Thank you Bee for explaining that. Now I know I have some good stuff going already! I was wondering if it was good for them yet since it's only been like 4 days of me feeding them this. Mine started bubbling before the day was out because it's hot here.

Thanks for the vid! You are on the right track! Now...I'll give you another tip you might enjoy.....deep litter in the run!

Start a deep litter in there to eliminate the barren, hard packed soil and the slimy, muddiness that comes with the rain on a barren run. You'll be glad you did and the chooks will too. It's a big run so just start adding any ol' yard debris like weed cuttings, sawdust/shavings, leaves, leaves, leaves, twigs, pine needles, lawn clippings, straw, etc. Keep adding until they have 6-8 in of carbonaceous material underfoot at all times. You can't go wrong with it...it will grow the beneficial bacteria that your birds need underfoot and the predatory bugs that will prey on lice and mite larvae will find a home there. It will also give your birds something to do every day, moving that bedding from one end of the run to another.

It will smell nicer, be healthier and will make your birds happier in a more natural environment of forest floor type footing underground.

PS: I'm so tickled you are reading through this thread and mining out the good info to be found there....shows a dedication to learning about your animals and I commend you for it! Not many take the time to really learn and love the learning like you seem to do. Blessings upon you, girl!