Fermenting Feed for Meat Birds

[Windy Bay Farm]

Thanks all for your comments, much appreciated.

I'm sitting in the chicken run as I type this. Been doing some work around the coop/run today in preparation for winter. Trying to get a window installed that previously was a square hole with hardware cloth over it for the summer. Also prepping to cover my run with a roof before winter strikes as well.

There's just something so peaceful about sitting here watching these guys peck around and the antics and carrying on they do . I could sit here all day if time would allow !

 

[Triple Willow]

I don't think you have a clear understanding of why your dog is killing them.  Your dog is hunting them and gets a lot of pleasure (reward) while doing it.  The dog will not associate a dead chicken with the living chicken they are hunting or just hunted.  You are dealing with two completely different motivations with the chicken on the fence scenario--one is prey drive (hunting) and the other (sniffing the dead chicken) is curiosity or just plain hunger--very different motivations.

If aversives are going to work, the punishment has to be applied as soon as the dog goes into hunting mode.  The  timing is critical.  You need to make it so bad they never want to do it again.  The most effective use of punishments is when they are really bad and used just once.  Think about a child learning not to touch a hot stove.  Certain temperaments and breeds of dogs won't care how much you punish/abuse them--they will ALWAYS follow their instincts.

LOL I know exactly why my dog attacks chickens, it is built into his bloodline and because it is EXCITING and FUN! He is definitely not hungry. He is definitely not vicious. Whether a dog gets a shock from a collar while in the act of trying to catch a chicken OR from sticking his nose to a chicken hanging on a fence, the common denominator is the chicken! I don't know but there is a real good chance that the dog is going to reason "OUCH!!! CHICKENS CAUSE PAIN!!! I THINK I BETTER LEAVE CHICKENS ALONE!!!"" Kids don't discriminate a stove eye that is on from one that is off. They associate a stove eye with pain and until they get older and wiser they will leave the stove eye alone whether it is off or on.

 

[perchie.girl]

I don't think you have a clear understanding of why your dog is killing them. Your dog is hunting them and gets a lot of pleasure (reward) while doing it. The dog will not associate a dead chicken with the living chicken they are hunting or just hunted. You are dealing with two completely different motivations with the chicken on the fence scenario--one is prey drive (hunting) and the other (sniffing the dead chicken) is curiosity or just plain hunger--very different motivations.

If aversives are going to work, the punishment has to be applied as soon as the dog goes into hunting mode. The timing is critical. You need to make it so bad they never want to do it again. The most effective use of punishments is when they are really bad and used just once. Think about a child learning not to touch a hot stove. Certain temperaments and breeds of dogs won't care how much you punish/abuse them--they will ALWAYS follow their instincts.

The only thing I have had longer than horses is Dogs. which is all my life 58 years. I have seen it all from Drop kicking the dog out the back door.... "dads solution" to wheedling and cooing at the dog to stop .... "moms solution" Neither has any effect but to make the owner feel good.

My last dog lived 19 years. A mutt from the pound with some Greyhound and Aussie mixed in. this dog had a very strong prey drive with an added bit of herding to boot. Before I got chickens I had her and I taught her a command which was essentailly .... "no Dogs" It could mean no dogs touch my plate when I leave it on the floor..... No dogs to get out of the car.... meaning I could leave the window open and she would not jump out. I would test her periodically but NEVER put her in a situation where the temptation would out weigh the conditioning. Soo not fair to the dog.

When I introduced her to chickens it was through the brooder cage. She would sit and vibrate with excitement.... as soon as I saw that I said.... "no dogs" and left her alone to figure it out. Meaning I was there but not picking at her over it. She would calm then but continue watching the chicks.

One got out and she immediately went to it but when i saw she was watching but not acting on her prey drive I told her she was a "good girl" I caught the chick and in the process was able to observe if she got excited over that.... all good. If I had known how to train it I would have loved to work with her herding skills.

To that effect enter four Goats..... Terrified of dogs as I find out. So I had the opportunity to work with her a bit.... The goats got out of the yard and were being ****holes to herd. So I Told Rosie.... Go around and pointed with an arc. I will be darned... she did it. She went out and around the goats and off they went into the safety of their pen.

I think too often people try to make a dog fit in their niche rather than choosing a dog that fits. I got lucky with Rosie and would clone her if I could. For instance I am a Greyhound person Love em to death and when I have yards that are secure I iwll have them again. I will be under no dilusions that I could train a greyhound to be chicken safe..... or cat safe.... ever. If it runs or flies their brain goes in to heat seeker mode. There are Sooo many breeds that the pray drive is very strong with.... Terriers, Hounds, Dogs with close wolf ancestry as well.

Some dogs will surprise you though. Rottweilers well bred ones and Poodles, both were used as an all purpose dog, Hunting herding retrieving.... Rotties were originally bred to work the stock yards.

There are always exceptions to any "rule" .... sigh I am rambling again.

I have to go order hay to be delivered before the wind starts up...

deb

 

[Lacy Blues]

I almost WISH that was the case. I could deal with that. But their combs have barely come in on some and the ones that do have combs, they haven't really reddened up yet. The 2 girls that laid and then stopped have lost the red coloring that they had at one time.

It was SO hot here for awhile and their coop has been in a state of flux for the past couple months. Between temps and changes, I guess they are just staging a protest.

Have you checked them for mites or lice?

This past summer, mid summer when all birds should have been laying, I decided to give them a boost as it had been several months since I'd gotten any eggs from them. Buttermilk and cornmeal to make a mush along with a lot of cayenne pepper mixed in. This is all they got for breakfast. It worked. Next day, everybody started laying again!

 

[RoseMarie1]

Hmm that's odd. I wonder what caused the loss of color in the ones that were laying. Have they always been on ff? What about acv in their water? Sounds like they need a boost of some kind. It was a HOT and HUMID summer here too! My poor chickens did a lot of panting like dogs ...and me too! lol Some say that cayenne pepper helps with the laying...?

Speaking of color, my Aussies combs and wattles are starting to get red.

Not long are the days that I will be getting more than one egg every other day.

 

[Triple Willow]

Speaking of color, my Aussies combs and wattles are starting to get red.   Not long are the days that I will be getting more than one egg every other day. 

Oh yeah, you are on your way to bunches of eggs! Exciting isn't it? Next you will be like me, wanting to know WHO layed WHAT egg. LOL There is only one of mine that I think I know, the rest I still wonder about.

 

[Triple Willow]

Have you checked them for mites or lice?

This past summer, mid summer when all birds should have been laying, I decided to give them a boost as it had been several months since I'd gotten any eggs from them.  Buttermilk and cornmeal to make a mush along with a lot of cayenne pepper mixed in.  This is all they got for breakfast.  It worked.  Next day, everybody started laying again!

Oh yeah, that is the kind of boost I was talking about. It's wild how that works.

 

[Triple Willow]

Okay-the math is lost on me. My chickens are 9 and 10 weeks and i feed them 20 cups of feed a day. Well, turns out my grower feed is pelleted and my crossbeak cant eat it. I figure fermented feed is the way to go.

So, if i fill a 5 gallon bucket using the strainer method with the pellets and a good glug of ACV, how much water do i use? Lid on or off? How often should i add to it, and does the 20 cup feed measure still apply?

This will hopefully stretch the 100lbs we have since the hubs just got laid off.

Hi KelsiNS. Here is what I do: fill a 5 gallon bucket about 2/3 full of feed. Add water and stir the feed and water really well until all the feed is wet. At that point have about an inch of water over the feed. Then I add 1-2 cups of buttermilk (NOT NECESSARY) and stir again really well. Even though the buttermilk is not necessary, it will make your feed ferment within 12 hours or so. (The only things necessary are 1. feed, 2. water, 3. stir & wait.) The water as well as fermentation will cause the feed to expand. If it soaks up too much water you may have to add a little more. You don't need water standing over the feed after it has absorbed the water. Some people like it wetter than others but I like mine like oatmeal or dough.

Once you have this first mix made and fermented you shouldn't have to make any more for a very long time. Just be sure to either add fresh feed and water back as you use feed out or at least add feed and water back to the bucket before you bucket is empty. The fermented feed already in your bucket will cause your new feed to ferment. Don't fill your bucket too full or it will overflow when the feed expands, believe me! lol I only use one bucket. I feed the birds what they will finish in about 15 minutes.

Good luck.

 

[Triple Willow]

Okay-the math is lost on me. My chickens are 9 and 10 weeks and i feed them 20 cups of feed a day. Well, turns out my grower feed is pelleted and my crossbeak cant eat it. I figure fermented feed is the way to go.

So, if i fill a 5 gallon bucket using the strainer method with the pellets and a good glug of ACV, how much water do i use? Lid on or off? How often should i add to it, and does the 20 cup feed measure still apply?

This will hopefully stretch the 100lbs we have since the hubs just got laid off.

You can set a lid on the bucket but don't seal it, leave it loose. I leave mine uncovered right now. The only thing that bothers it is gnats!

 

[wlhtx]

Have you checked them for mites or lice?

This past summer, mid summer when all birds should have been laying, I decided to give them a boost as it had been several months since I'd gotten any eggs from them.  Buttermilk and cornmeal to make a mush along with a lot of cayenne pepper mixed in.  This is all they got for breakfast.  It worked.  Next day, everybody started laying again!

Everybody's clean! Really, I have no doubt it is due to temps and the changing of the location of their coop. (They've been moved several times in their short lives.)

For fun I may just go ahead and try the cayenne pepper trick. We're just talking regular old ground cayenne pepper found in the spice isle, right?