First Run of Cornish Cross Meat Birds and Super Excited!

[lazy gardener]

So, Neal, care to explain why, all other things being equal, including parentage, age, and source of feed: Why do my chicks consistently grow faster, and reach maturity faster, and start laying faster, and at a higher rate than those of my neighbors and friends, when the only difference is that my birds get fermented feed? Also, care to explain why the protein content of spent grains is measured at 25%, while the unused grains measures around 15%? One can not argue actual results.

 

[Chad Cool]

Mr. Cool,
Let's simply use logic and science to analyze the fermented feed situation as proposed by you. First know that I have spent my life as a chicken hobbyist as well as having served as a practicing curator of birds at the National Zoological Park, Smithsonian and as a general curator (all species) at an additional zoological park. Then there are my years as a classroom instructor. So I think I have earned my place to make qualified scientific statements regarding avian dietary requirements. Keep in mind that we know more about the nutritive requirements of the chicken than we do of our own species. And no, not everybody has an opinion regarding fermented feed. That is a ridiculously specious position to take since in fact, most folks have no need to have an intimate knowledge of the dietary requirements of any species much less those of the chicken. And I have personally done an array of research investigations with respect to several animal species. As for your disdain for, as you so rustically put it, "book literature" as if there were any other kind, I fail to grasp just what you might mean. And that it is a tenet among many of those unfamiliar with facts and systems that one has to try out a hypothesis in order to ascertain its validity is simply another poorly thought out fallacy. One does not swallow arsenic to determine its toxicity, i.e., its ability to do great harm and to possibly even kill the questioner. Major purposes of archived knowledge include preventing others from making unnecessary errors or repeating work already accomplished. I gave you and any who care to think about the lack of utility for using foodstuffs spent by fermentation, a rational and scientific reason based in fundamental organic chemistry to demonstrate my informed and tested position.
Neal, the Zooman

I really don't care if your a curator at any zoo. Oh and if you had used logic you would not have replied to my post. Now please let people reply that have fundamental research done.

 

[duluthralphie]

Can we please stop the argument over fermented feed.

I have seen other threads closed over arguments like this. When people feel strongly about something regardless of the validity of it or not, tempers flair and the Moderators step in and close the thread.

I for one do not want this thread closed.

We have enough trouble here convincing people CX's are real chickens and not Frankenstein's creation.


Thanks...

 

[Dandelioness]

Aaak! Ralphie is right.

While I think it's okay to maybe share results later, I don't think this back and forth is entirely germaine to the thread topic, as a few of us have raised healthy CX without fermenting.

I had no idea this was such a controversial item!

I feel a Frozen song coming on, folks!

Edited to remove potentially inflammatory remarks

 

[mountain mom]

I am going to confess stupidity here and now....

I found a nest with 3 eggs in it the other day, I took al three eggs and did not put a "nest egg" back in the nest. I took two eggs out of the nest the day after. My thought process was flawed, maybe I had been drinking Mike's lemonade.

I thought to myself " Self, the chickens well keep laying here or go back to the coop to lay".


Why did one of you not correct me? The chickens have moved the nest. God only knows where. I now have to hunt for a nest. DUMB ME!!!


And on the same front. My DW decided Ethel was sad in the pen and I had to let her and JJ out. MM has a couple Ethel eggs and I have a couple Ethel eggs. I hope they hatch as we are now at the mercy of nature on whether we get more Ethe and JJ offspring. Ethel is very grateful to be free again though. She is holding no grudges. I was watching chicken TV while sitting on the back of a trailer, when she came over and talked to me, I picked her up and held her on my lap, petting her and she cooed a few minutes and fell asleep. I also picked up JJ and petted him but he did not coo. It is harder to hold JJ and pet him. It can be done but he is just so darn big. He also finds being held to be beneath his status in life. He tolerates it from me, I doubt he would from anyone else.

I wish I had some kind of tracking device I could put on Ethel to find her nest. Do not tell my DW but I have thought about using duct tape and taping her IPhone to Ethel and using the "find my IPhone" feature to find Ethe's nest. After all, she is the one that made me set them free.

The slate Blues left in the pen are not happy, but I will at least get to collect their eggs. In a couple weeks I can be assured they are pure and not JJ's chicks. I am going to put Bert and his Dixie chicks into the pen today with the turkeys they should get along fine.

MM let us know when the eggs get there, take pictures of them I want to see there condition before you put them under the broody... and GOOD LUCK!

The little fuzz balls are adorable! That Ole is sure sneaky..

Hidden nests are a pain to locate... chicken or otherwise. I think your wife may be on to you when she uses the "find my iphone" app and locates it duct taped to Ethel. Just a hunch. And she may not see the sound reasoning you used. Wives are so weird like that.

JJ and Ethel are so cool. I am so excited!!

I will keep everyone posted on the hatching!

 

[1zooman12]

I'd have to see your set up to answer your question in full. As to the increase in protein percentage that is no mystery at all. Let's look at children's blocks as an example. Imagine a set of 9. 3 green, 3 blue and 3 red. Each set amounts to 33.33% of the total. Right? Now let's destroy all the green blocks which is absolutely analogous to destroying the carbohydrate in the infamous fermentation rigamarole. The blue nor the red for that matter no longer constitute 33.33% of the remaining mass but now each constitutes 50% of what's not been destroyed. Nothing has been created, one had to destroy the green blocks in order to achieve this result. In the fermentation scheme you had to destroy, by fermentation, a significant portion of the carbohydrate in order to give the protein and other constituents a greater role. Nothing has been created and all you have done is raid your pocketbook to pull this off. THINK people, THINK!! I'm on your side. The reason your chickens being fed the fermented glop are growing faster is that they are indeed getting a higher percentage and fat in their diet by default but you are paying a much higher price for this illusion. You can achieve the same effect by simply adding more fat and protein to your mix and nothing is destroyed, i.e., wasted. This would amount to a great savings of your resources. Get it now? And I am not arguing except in the classical sense but am reentering my role as a professor and educator for the sake of my fellow chicken nuts. Just go over everything I have told you and carefully consider each statement and the unnecessary waste and sacrifice by using the fermentation scheme. I wish you everyone wellness and happiness.
Neal, the retired professor of both Animal Science and Zoology (and YOUR ally)

 

[fouroaks]

Hi,
I am new to chickens we a raising some for meat. We bought 6 at TSC I would like to know what weight they should be at 10 days? the ones I have are between 3.85oz and 5.15 oz they are very active and do a lot of running and trying to fly. and we will be getting more from the hatchery next weekend.

 

[duluthralphie]

Hi,
I am new to chickens we a raising some for meat. We bought 6 at TSC I would like to know what weight they should be at 10 days? the ones I have are between 3.85oz and 5.15 oz they are very active and do a lot of running and trying to fly. and we will be getting more from the hatchery next weekend.

What kind of birds did you get. CX or DP?

I have no idea what weight they should be at 10 days. I forget what mine where then.

 

[fouroaks]

I am not sure they listed them as rock Cornish mix at TSC and they also were reminding people they are meat chickens not laying ones

 

[duluthralphie]

Ok.....
That is what they are..

I happen to have been a TSC today. I saw them in the TSC here. They had a sign on it saying they needed at least 24% protein.....That is bull......


If you want a good success rate with few if any deaths, you will slow the rate of growth down.. Those of us on here are all about slowing them down and making them healthier. People wil tell you they only live 6-8 weeks.

This is true if you feed them as much as they want and do not force them to walk and forage.

If you want a firmer meat, and a larger bird you will limit their feed. The rooster on my avatar picture is my CX. the same bird you bought. He is 9-10 months old now, He is trying to have babies now. He is healthy and a sweetheart.


I would buy one bag of 20% protein and then feed them 16% and allow them to free range or use a tractor. I also feed them table scraps. They love them.


I give them girt and oats as a scratch to keep them busy and fill their crops, which is hard to do.