Flock feed

[Chris2018]

Feeding a high protein feed alone will most likely never cause gout unless the bird has a preexisting kidney problem and even then you would have to be feeding a very high protein feed at or exceeding 30 percent protein. In fact your more in likely induce gout by over feeding calcium to nonlaying birds.

Causes of gout
A multitude of factors are involved in the etiology of gout. They can be broadly categorised as:

• Nutritional
• Infectious
• Managemental
• Others

Nutritional causes

Minerals

• Calcium: Phosphorus ratio - Excess dietary calcium with low available phosphorus results in precipitation of calcium-sodium-urate crystals. Phosphorus acts as urine acidifier and low phosphorus aggravates the urate crystal formation.
• Sodium – Sodium intoxication puts extra stress on kidneys. Excessive use of sodium bicarbonate increases alkalinity of urine leading to kidney stone formation. Hard water with higher salt content is also a load on kidneys.
• Sulphates – Decreased calcium resorption causing excessive calcium secretion through urine favours gout.

Vitamins

• High levels of vitamin D3 increases calcium absorption from the gut which can favour further formation and deposition of urate crystals.
• Prolonged vitamin A deficiency causes sloughing of tubular epithelium and subsequent blockade resulting in accumulation of urates in the kidney.

However, the incidence of gout due to vitamins is not all that likely under field conditions.

Protein

• Healthy kidneys are not affected by high dietary protein levels. Nevertheless, in case of pre-existing kidney damage, feed containing more than 30 per cent of crude protein can be dangerous. This leads to excessive uric acid production which further worsens the kidney function.
• Adulteration of protein supplements with urea increases the nitrogenous component, further enhancing the uric acid production. This coupled with kidney damage can lead to gout.

 

[sirrobyn0]

Everyone seems to have an opinion on feed and so do I so I'm going to give it. And my advice keep it simple. I have Chickens, Turkeys, and Guinea fowl that live in one area, Ducks and Geese in another. They all get fed the same stuff. It's called Snohomish layer pellet, it's the store brand for the co-op I'm a member of. I don't recall the protein % off hand, but if I had to guess I think it's 18%. Yes I understand that ducks and geese have different dietary requirements than chickens, and I know the guinea fowl have different dietary requirements than chickens. But the layer pellet seems to strike a balance for me at least. And then of course they have access to oyster shell.

Baby feed: So I use to buy medicated chick starter for the baby chicks, and non-medicated for everyone else, but that has stopped. Now I have non-medicated starter that I give when they are really small. Like as in first few days, then they get switched to layer crumble, until they are big enough to handle the pellets like everyone else.

All of my birds, except when they are very young get out to free range each day, which I think helps them to get what they need.

Bottom line, JP57, if it were me, at 13 weeks old the young ones would already be on layer pellet, as would the older ones. If the older ones are currently laying they should have access to oyster shell, it does not matter if the younger ones can access the oyster shell. If they don't need it they won't eat it. If they do need it they will. I'd be feeding all the birds a basic layer pellet. I'm sure the flock raiser would be fine, but a layer pellet would probably be cheaper.

 

[Chris2018]

@jp57
The easiest way to feed your birds would be to feed all your birds a good 'all flock' feed that is 20% protein and offer oyster shells in a separate bowl for the laying birds that need the extra calcium. This way of feeding is simple, foolproof and can be healthier for your birds because there not overdosing on calcium when they don't need it. Also with a 20% protein feed you can add some treats now and then without depleting there protein intake to low.

 

[Kiki]

FWIW you may want to compare labels within the brand name you purchase.
All flock and starter/grower feeds are extremely similar.

 

[sirrobyn0]

FWIW you may want to compare labels within the brand name you purchase.
All flock and starter/grower feeds are extremely similar.

Yes, I meant to mention this in my post. It is surprising to me how similar different feeds can be even though certain feeds can cost much more.

 

[Kiki]

Yes, I meant to mention this in my post. It is surprising to me how similar different feeds can be even though certain feeds can cost much more.

I randomly selected two major brand name feeds.
Here they are side by side...their starter/grower feed next to their all flock feed:

 

[Kiki]

Now here is the same info above with their layer feed added in for comparison:

 

[GC-Raptor]

Now here is the same info above with their layer feed added in for comparison:
View attachment 1411789 View attachment 1411790

Interesting how Nutrina layers has double calcium but less phosphorus. GC

 

[Kiki]

Interesting how Nutrina layers has double calcium but less phosphorus. GC

I stare at my google sheet daily trying to see how close/similar feeds really are to each other.

 

[micstrachan]

@lazy gardener , can you elaborate a bit on this?

I would not feed more than 22% protein. While folks get upset about non laying birds consuming calcium, everyone seems to be on the band wagon: "More protein is better". High protein levels are implicated as a cause of gout.

I’ve been feeding my laying flock a 22% grower feed (treating it like a flock raiser with OS on the side), and one of my girls isn’t feeling well. I am trying to determine if diet is the cause or at least a factor. Thank you!