"free range"--let's get rid of this nonsense term

[Brooks_]

https://www.ams.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media/USDA Grademarked Product Label Submission Checklist.pdf


No space requirement specified for "outdoor area".



Again, no space requirement specified.

I agree that grocery store eggs don't really have a standard, but we or I do. Mine are not free range. A guy I work with does free range, they're out from dawn to dusk.

 

[CrazyChicken Lady]

every time i hear it i instantly know the person i am dealing with just bought their first chickens.

Just gonna point out............ I have raised chickens for 9 years and I still call it free ranging so..........

 

[Brooks_]

None of us are disputing that the USDA definitions of the marketing terms are potentially misleading to consumers buying eggs off of a grocery market shelf - but your counter proposal, that a fence, no matter how far distant from the hen house, is definitionally not "free range" is equally absurd. Your definition is synonymous, effectively, with "at large", with the attendant legal consequences that follow such a definition. Joe and Jane consumer are not exactly the definition of well informed, and probably shouldn't be a standard we look up to, in a country whose average IQ is below 100 (a point on the scale supposed to be defined as the average).

As a term of Art, used by hobbyists and backyard enthusiasts, while it lacks specificity, it does still serve a use in communicating some (very vague and generalized) sense of the the speaker's poultry management practices. For that purpose, I'm perfectly wiling to continue its use - understanding that is as descriptive as, for instance, "blue".

Aqua? Midnight? Sapphire? Azure? Cobalt? Navy? Ultramarine? Lapis? Indigo? Cornflower? Baby? ...

Well said.

Now, I'll be thinking about blue all day.

 

[aart]

I agree that grocery store eggs don't really have a standard

Well, they do.......the marketing terms they use are misleading.
Almost all marketing is misleading....gotta watch the wiggle words or do some research.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Well said.

Now, I'll be thinking about blue all day.

"Cerulean" Now you can think of the X-Files Episode.

 

[Krugerrand]

None of us are disputing that the USDA definitions of the marketing terms are potentially misleading to consumers buying eggs off of a grocery market shelf - but your counter proposal, that a fence, no matter how far distant from the hen house, is definitionally not "free range" is equally absurd. Your definition is synonymous, effectively, with "at large", with the attendant legal consequences that follow such a definition. Joe and Jane consumer are not exactly the definition of well informed, and probably shouldn't be a standard we look up to, in a country whose average IQ is below 100 (a point on the scale supposed to be defined as the average).

As a term of Art, used by hobbyists and backyard enthusiasts, while it lacks specificity, it does still serve a use in communicating some (very vague and generalized) sense of the the speaker's poultry management practices. For that purpose, I'm perfectly wiling to continue its use - understanding that is as descriptive as, for instance, "blue".

Aqua? Midnight? Sapphire? Azure? Cobalt? Navy? Ultramarine? Lapis? Indigo? Cornflower? Baby? ...

I guess I wasn't clear ... @PippinTheChicken and @KingB were posting form the UK about free range meaning "lots of room to roam and run around" I was trying to make clear to those that may not realize that the terms have specific legal meaning in the US and that legal meaning is pretty much ... meaningless.

I'm afraid I don't have a "counter proposal." This was my first post on the thread.

​

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I guess I wasn't clear ... @PippinTheChicken and @KingB were posting form the UK about free range meaning "lots of room to roam and run around" I was trying to make clear to those that may not realize that the terms have specific legal meaning in the US and that legal meaning is pretty much ... meaningless.

I'm afraid I don't have a "counter proposal." This was first post on the thread.

​

My error, and my apologies @Krugerrand .

I thought I was responding to this, "not "free range"---you have any defined area whether it be 1 acre or 1000 acres of space with fences to keep your chickens from "free ranging"...that's basically a chicken "run." from the original poster, @Carson213 when I hit reply.

Yes, the meanings of terms, legally, differ across jurisdictions - our friends across the pond have a differing regulatory framework than do we. Shell eggs are a better example of that, in that those shell eggs legally prepared for human consumption here couldn't be sold for that purpose there - and vice versa - since the USDA wants us to wash off the bloom, sanitize, air dry, and promptly refrigerate - while they have chosen to wipe clean with a dry cloth and set on the counter for weeks at a time.

and I won't start taking apart what the FDA defines as "Fresh" where shell eggs are concerned...

 

[Brooks_]

I guess I wasn't clear ... @PippinTheChicken and @KingB were posting form the UK about free range meaning "lots of room to roam and run around" I was trying to make clear to those that may not realize that the terms have specific legal meaning in the US and that legal meaning is pretty much ... meaningless.

I'm afraid I don't have a "counter proposal." This was first post on the thread.

​

I took it pointing out grocery eggs in the US that say free (insert) doesn't really mean anything. I think to us here at BYC, free (insert) does mean something. Though, still not clearly defined.

 

[Brooks_]

and I won't start taking apart what the FDA defines as "Fresh" where shell eggs are concerned...

Please do.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Please do.

This may be useful. and here is the legal authority. This is about irradiating fresh eggs, not for the home hobbyist.

Short form, "Fresh" does not mean recent, its not a measure of time, it means they haven't been stored below 26 degrees F, just like "never frozen" means below 0 F. I know, I know, the physics of reality says otherwise, but why would we expect the law to abide by reality???

Eggs can be stored, not climate or humidity controlled, up to two weeks before washing, sanitizing, air drying and packaging and still get the best grading. 30 days and still be fit, according to the USDA, for human consumption. There is no standard for "best by", "sell by", or "expired" after packaging - that's all voluntary and set by the packager or the supplier. Our system is sort of a mix of Europe's, and what we think of the US system, in that you can leave the eggs on the counter for weeks, as they do in the EU, then wash, sanitize, package to make the USDA happy and sell them as "fresh", so long as they didn't get stored below 26 degrees...

What can I say? Gov't is good at legally defining words to mean things they are not normally understood to convey.