genetics experts -- what IS this, genetically?

[amazondoc]

And yet another puzzle for ya --

Is this guy a dark duckwing, or is he wheaten? This one is definitely from my duckwing/wheaten roo, and mom could have been any of my hens from this season's breeders (several of which are wheaten).

 

[Krys109uk]

So, you think we can assume that these guys are E? Just missing some necessary melanizers to make em solid black?

I'd have thought so. It is very difficult to get back good quality black once the melanisers have been lost.

And if so, do ya think that the blue pullets pictured below are also E?

They look, to me, like they probably are E lacking melanisers. They look rather copper on the neck.
You haven't said what the possible mothers of these birds were.

Here's the roo in question. You'll see he's got something else going on in addition to splash...

I think he's splash E with gold leakage.

Is this guy a dark duckwing, or is he wheaten? This one is definitely from my duckwing/wheaten roo, and mom could have been any of my hens from this season's breeders (several of which are wheaten).

It can be difficult to tell; he could be both??
What did he look like as a chick? What colour are the possible mothers? Does he have beige fluff in the area between the back of his legs & his vent? Does he have chestnut on his shoulders?​

 

[amazondoc]

Quote:
On the Araucana forum, the possibility has been raised that both the cockerels and pullets might be birchen with mahogany. Whaddaya think about that?

Most likely, the blue pullets are from the same breeder as the black cockerels. Unfortunately, I got blue and splash chicks from both my own birds and the other breeder, and some of them got mixed up before I banded them!

Is this guy a dark duckwing, or is he wheaten? This one is definitely from my duckwing/wheaten roo, and mom could have been any of my hens from this season's breeders (several of which are wheaten).

It can be difficult to tell; he could be both??
What did he look like as a chick? What colour are the possible mothers? Does he have beige fluff in the area between the back of his legs & his vent? Does he have chestnut on his shoulders?

Oh duh. I forgot to look. I do know what he was --> chipmunk w/brown inside chipmunk pattern, eye line, double tufted. (He hatched before I started forgetting to band!) So he can't be pure wheaten, though he just about has to be carrying it. His moms could be wheatenish or buff, obviously not the splash hens. So why is he so dark for a duckwing?​

 

[Krys109uk]

On the Araucana forum, the possibility has been raised that both the cockerels and pullets might be birchen with mahogany. Whaddaya think about that?

The colour is consistent with silver + Mahogany. I have some Marans hens of that colour.

It is pretty difficult to tell ER with melanisers from E lacking melanisers. I have this same issue with my Marans. Personally, I'd probably lean towards their being E. Is there any trace of colour on the breast?​

 

[Krys109uk]

So he can't be pure wheaten, though he just about has to be carrying it. His moms could be wheatenish or buff, obviously not the splash hens. So why is he so dark for a duckwing?

I forgot this.

Wheaten seems a tad unpredictable regarding its being dominant or recessive. Sometimes, when heterozygous, the down colour can show as one allele but the bird can feather up like the other.​

 

[amazondoc]

Quote:
Very interesting.

I wouldn't mind making more wheatens (yes, I know it isn't an accepted color). I think I'll pen him up with my wheatenish hens and see what happens.

The colour is consistent with silver + Mahogany. I have some Marans hens of that colour.

It is pretty difficult to tell ER with melanisers from E lacking melanisers. I have this same issue with my Marans. Personally, I'd probably lean towards their being E. Is there any trace of colour on the breast?

I don't remember right now. I'll check this afternoon!​

 

[Krys109uk]

I wouldn't mind making more wheatens (yes, I know it isn't an accepted color). I think I'll pen him up with my wheatenish hens and see what happens.

It isn't an accepted colour in Ameraucanas? There seem to be lots of pics of blue wheaten ameraucanas. Not that I'd know a decent one if it bit me.


If you know your adult male has at least one wheaten gene you could put him with your wheaten hens & select for the yellow chicks.....no?​

 

[amazondoc]

Quote:
It isn't an accepted colour in Ameraucanas? There seem to be lots of pics of blue wheaten ameraucanas. Not that I'd know a decent one if it bit me.

These are Araucanas, not Ameraucanas. In Araucanas, the accepted colors are:

APA -- Black, Black Breasted Red, Golden Duckwing, Silver Duckwing, and White

ABA -- Black, Black Breasted Red, Blue, Buff, Silver, and White.

Here's an ABA BBR pair:

http://www.araucana.net/Araucana_Bantam_Black_Breasted_Red.htm

and an APA BBR pair:

http://www.araucana.net/Varieties/APA_Araucana_Varieties.htm

If you know your adult male has at least one wheaten gene you could put him with your wheaten hens & select for the yellow chicks.....no?

I think that's exactly what I'll do. OTOH I've got two nice BBR pullets, and I'm also curious to see what he would make with them....​