German Shepard Breeding Program!

[gapeach717]

i just want to say that I have a GSD from a breeder....however....IMO his linage was not worth anything to to pass down, since his sire was passing the linage down on his own just fine, and even though my own family gave me hell about it, Clover was neutered last year...never to be a daddy.

I also know MANY good breeders all over the US and even in other countries who breed only to keep lineage what it should be. I am 100% against breeding your dog unless you have a reason to. (like the breeders i know) I have spent almost 3 years doing rescue and fostering of dogs...and yes...even purebred pups are in shelters and PTS on a daily basis in America. It is sad to know how many millions of pets are killed every year only to see just as many BYBs filling up muddy pens in their yards bc they think they have a pretty dog who *needs* to have puppies.

PLEASE consider adopting a gsd pup before breeding. and if you DO go with a bred GSD, PLEASE only buy from breeders with outstanding back ground and dams and sires on sites likehttp://www.pedigreedatabase.com/ . I am happy to provide GSD rescue info for almost every state in the U.S to anyone interested.

https://www.facebook.com/TheGSDC

 

[Redyre Rotties]

What she describes is known as "farming out" bitches. The reason they will pay for everything is that they take 2 entire litters from her to sell. This is common practice with huge volume breeders such as Kimbertal. This way they can breed hundreds upon hundreds of puppies for sale, and they only have the bitches in when they are ready to whelp, and they are gone back home as soon as they can wean the puppies.

 

[TexasLady]

I have raised purebred dogs for 20+ years.

I understand someone misspelling my breed, but when they do, I know that they probably have not researched enough to be a good prospect to get one of my dogs. A person has to know enough about the breed, have enough contacts about it, and have a reasonable understanding of it to understand what they need to do as an owner.

I am reluctant to sell to a person who hasn't done enough research to spell the name right. That being said, I have co-owned animals, and it seldom works well. The "owner" or person who thinks they are, doesn't want to give time to the breeder on a dog. This creates a problem for both, and I've seen lawsuits over it. One woman got a dog and didn't think it was good enough to breed (according to one of the breeder's competitors) though the agreement was that the breeder could use the dog. They fought and fought over the dog for YEARS. The one keeping the dog finally went and spayed her, and the breeder sued. It was ugly, mean and resulted in a lot of bad feelings. Of course, the contact came into play, and the "owner" ended up losing a lot of money.

Unless you're really willing to allow your animal to be taken from you for a week (for a dog) and 2 months for a female (I won't use the proper term here as it offends the untrained), then do not agree. And with a male, you will have to be sure he doesn't breed any neighbor females. With a female, you could have a lot of callers, and she could get bred. It is a bad experience then, and the breeder will be rightly angry at you.

I would never, never recommend a person who wants a purebred to get a shelter dog. I took that recommendation, and the shelter dog killed all my chickens and then proceeded to chew up the inside of my house, tear up things outside, and taught my other dogs to jump the fence. He slept in my son's bedroom (I got him for my son), and while my son was asleep, the dog ripped the carpet up. The carpet was glued down on the concrete floor, but he managed to rip up a large strip in the few hours from when my son went to bed (about midnight) until I was up at 6 a.m. He also refused to be house trained, and when my son fell asleep one night, I got up to about eight piles of poop in the family room.

Also, having raised GSDs, I would highly recommend that you check them out before you get one. You see this ideal, beautiful animal (and they are), but two of mine chewed up my goat (she didn't die, they were just playing). She didn't think it was fun, and within six months, she was nearly white from the stress of what happened. They are the breed that is cited for most dog bites. They are active, and although they want to herd, they are seldom good herders if they are not trained. They are not great dogs if you don't spend a lot of time with them in the first two years. If you do spend a lot of them with them in the first two years (i.e. have them at your side like the Monks of New Skete), then you will have a dog that is worth its weight in gold but only if you buy from a quality breeder who certifies and makes sure temperament is good.

Also, I would also never purchase a dog that I could not meet and see the mother (and probaby the father). I would never purchase a large breed dog that didn't have parents with hips certified and probably elbows (that's another story). I would also check into the breed to see what other problems that conscientious breeders are testing for, and if you pay a lot (for me, that's more than $500), I would want the parents to be certified. And you need to actually "see" the certifications because some people are liars.

My friend who raises GSDs charges $5,000 for a quality puppy. They are top quality dogs, and he is very careful about what he breeds and keeps. Yes, he does sell them. The lesser quality puppies go for about $1500, and a few for less than a thousand.

Dogs are a huge investment in money, then time, and everything else. I do not consider myself snooty about my breed, but I will tell you that I would never, never, never again get a dog from the shelter. If you have only that dog and you have enough time to train it (i.e. you dont' work away from home and have time during the day), you could be fine. But I was not, and it was a WIDE eye opening experience for me. You do not know the parentage (could have been an accident), and the shelters lie about parentage to people so they can place the dogs. I don't blame them (because they are trying to save a life), but I took this same dog I mentioned above back to the shelter after he wouldn't let my neighbors out of their house (I lived on a farm and they were two football fields away), because I realized he wasn't for me. When this dog had killed ALL of my cats, the shelter people wrote "Doesnt' like cats." I told her that the dog KILLED all my cats. She said he'd be placed better if she didn't say that. This was a very, very sweet dog, but he was extremely needy, and he could never be left alone, he could not be kenneled, and he could not be tied or fenced in either. Great disposition.

Yes, I do discriminate when a person can't spell the name of the breed they want. I know a person like this has very likely done no research. If they have done some research, they likely don't pay attention--after contacting several breeders and writing back to them, they should notice that the breed's spelling is a certain way. A person that doesn't pay attention to details is likely not going to be a good person to sell a breeder to, and they are also not going to be a good person to allow to have my line i.e. use my dog with their female.

Would I breed one of my males to a female that didn't have hips or elbows certified? No I don't. I also want eyes, heart and health certified. If a person were to come to me to ask me to use my dog, I would tell them that they could not if they did not have certifications. And if they came to me with a marginal female that they got from "someone" who breeds, I would not consider it. I don't need my male to produce defects that make people think he is the result of the defects. A marginal quality female is going to do nothing for my male's reputation, and she might hurt him a lot by the poor quality of her offspring. I would never consider letting someone use my dog to "breed up" the quality of their female. They needed to pay for a quality female in the first place. Too many dogs in the world to breed marginal quality.

I have known many quality breeders in my life. I have known many more that would sell you anything just to get your money and get rid of a dog. Be wise.

Don't breed marginal quality animals even if they have papers. Papers mean nothing except that the parentage is purebred (if the breeder was not a liar--and there are a LOT of those in the dog world). Purebred means nothing more than what the hatcheries tell you--they could represent the breed, but it is more than commonly "papered" dogs are not quality any more than hatchery chicks are show quality. If you didn't pay a lot of money for a dog (minimum of $1000), you should probably not breed it. If you paid more than $1,000 for it, it still needs to be certified and tested to see if it will reproduce good or bad in its offspring.

 

[NancyWicker]

 

[NancyWicker]

Sometimes people go to shelters or rescue to get a purebred dog cheaply. I did once. I went through rescue and obtained a beautiful, mature dog. A few weeks later this dog had BIT me, bit my husband, and lunged/snapped at my young son. I had him put down. Now, doing that I was violating the contract I had signed with rescue; I was, of course, supposed to have given him back if for any reason I couldn't keep him. Several months later I happened to get in touch with his original owner (I forget if she found me or if I found her, it was years ago) and when she asked how he was I told her. She admitted that she had given the dog up to rescue in the first place because she was afraid of him! Turns out that "rescue" hadn't had the dog long before passing him on to me.
People who want to breed really need to understand the responsibility of becoming a Breeder, and anyone looking to buy a puppy really should go to a respectable Breeder!

 

[dainerra]

or with a respectable rescue. A GOOD rescue will keep the dog in a foster home and determine how the dog is with other dogs, kids, cats, etc etc. A lot of owners will lie about their dogs to get them into rescue too. They will hide the fact that the dog bit the neighbor, kills cats, etc etc
With a bite history, the rescue would have put the dog to sleep - again assuming that they are responsible. Unfortunately, anyone can call themselves a rescue so you need to do the same research that you would use to find a breeder.
Ask them how long they have had the dog. What type of foster home it is in. etc etc
Rescues, especially breed specific rescues, are an excellent way to add a dog to the family. Do you know the most common reason that dogs end up in rescue? Someone bought a cute puppy with no research. Now, "puppy" is a teenager with no manners and is out of control.

 

[Oregon Blues]

The OP's first post is now missing and I didn't see it. But I am going to give some advice to anyone who thinks they want a litter of puppies.

It is hard work to sell a litter of puppies. You don't just put an ad into the paper and sell all the pups in one weekend. Buyers are far and few between. Good homes are even further and fewer. Good homes almost always already have dogs. They are rarely looking for puppies. There are lots of puppies out there and not many good homes wanting puppies.

Really good homes very often buy from someone they know, or someone who is highly recommended. They don't buy from beginners.

I love them and have owned over 50 German Shepherds in my lifetime, so I know the breed. If I wanted to buy a German Shepherd puppy, I would want to see hip and elbow scores on every dog in the pedigree. I want to see eye certifications and heart certifications and (for the German Shepherd )Von Willdebrand's testing and thyroid testing.

I want to see pedigrees, although they mean something to me and often don't mean much to pet homes. I want to see performance titles which indicate good temperament and trainability.

I want to meet both parents to see how they react to strangers. I want a proven steady friendly nature. I want to see hip scores on siblings of the parents.

I am not any more fussy than anyone else buying a good puppy. You would be surprised how sophisticated the good homes are. They do their research. They know what they want and they know whether the puppy is a good purchase. They will not buy a puppy without seeing hip scores for both parents.

This is no exaggeration: I keep meticulous records and every puppy I have ever bred has cost me between $1200 and $1600 to get to weaning and time to send them to new homes. THERE IS NO MONEY TO BE MADE IN BREEDING DOGS!!!!! It is a very expensive hobby. I never bred a litter unless i wanted a puppy for myself because it is so expensive to do.

 

[AinaWGSD]

Sometimes people go to shelters or rescue to get a purebred dog cheaply. I did once. I went through rescue and obtained a beautiful, mature dog. A few weeks later this dog had BIT me, bit my husband, and lunged/snapped at my young son. I had him put down. Now, doing that I was violating the contract I had signed with rescue; I was, of course, supposed to have given him back if for any reason I couldn't keep him. Several months later I happened to get in touch with his original owner (I forget if she found me or if I found her, it was years ago) and when she asked how he was I told her. She admitted that she had given the dog up to rescue in the first place because she was afraid of him! Turns out that "rescue" hadn't had the dog long before passing him on to me.
People who want to breed really need to understand the responsibility of becoming a Breeder, and anyone looking to buy a puppy really should go to a respectable Breeder!

Just like anyone looking to get a dog or puppy from a breeder, people looking to adopt a dog from a shelter or rescue need to do some research on the source of the dog as well as the breed of dog. There are good rescues out there whom I would trust just as much as any responsible breeder to help me find a dog that was an appropriate match for my family. And there are rescues out there that are essentially animal hoarders who do so legally with the excuse that they occasionally send animals to new homes. There are rescues who's goal it is to find their dogs a permanent home, and those who's goal is simply to move as many animals as they can.

I adopted both of my purebred dogs (GSD's) from rescue. They both turned out to be excellent dogs for my family. No, they weren't great examples of the breed. Yes, they had/have their health problems that I probably could have avoided if I had bought from a reputable breeder, but both have been fairly healthy. Yes, they both had some training issues when they came to me (my first was adopted as an adult, the second as a puppy and came with the "behavior problems" typical of any puppy) but they were worth the effort to work with them and everyone we meet has always been impressed with how "well behaved" my dogs are.

There are lots of good reasons to go to a responsible breeder for a dog, and I applaud anyone who does their research to choose a breed and find a great breeder before bringing a puppy home. It is a lot of hard work if you do it right and it will pay off. But there are also a lot of really good dogs out there in shelters/rescues waiting for homes too, and there are a lot of wonderful rescues that work just as hard as any breeder to find appropriate homes for the dogs in their care. You can't paint all shelters/rescues with the same brush, just like you can't lump the truly responsible breeders with the mediocre breeders and the puppy millers and backyard breeders.