Good size for dual purpose breeding flock?

[Shylis]

I am currently looking at a few properties, one of which my fiance and I will be buying this fall. We will start building as early next year as the weather permits, but I'm still at a loss of how large my flock needs to be (therefore the size my coop should be). We will be growing or raising 80% or more of our food, including having goats and cattle for milk and meat, chickens for eggs and meat, gardens and crops. Our favorite property has a very good established native grass hay feild, and most likely we will get this one. We will also be training and using oxen for much of the farm work in a few years, so we will no longer need tractors, etc.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand: Chickens. I need to know a good starting size for our flock. We use about a dozen to a dozen and a half eggs per week, if we have them. So I need enough hens to lay plenty of eggs that we can use, and any extras will go to family. We both like chicken very much, so may eat 1 a week, perhaps 2 a week ocassionally (at least until we get some goat or beef in the freezer!) Also, we like to share, so extra broilers would be used by family. So I need the hens to raise enough chicks for butcher. I dont want to keep a bunch a seperate coops with diferant breeds, so I have decided on having 1 or 2 dual purpose breeds in one coop (and then a second coop later on, when we have kids and need more room!) I don't plan on showing, so I don't mind crossbred chickens. And I am planning on building the coop TWICE as large as my starting flock needs, so I have plenty of room to grow, and the chickens have plenty of room to roam.

What size flock do you think would be a good start for us? Obviously, the size of flock will change to suit our needs once we actually have them, but I would like a good number to plan on for now.

 

[Fred's Hens]

I'd recommend building up at a reasonable pace. I'd say you'll need X number of birds, but the simple reality is that it is far better to build it up. Start with a flock of 25 birds and take it from there. If you're ordering from a hatchery, 25 birds usually gets you a minimum order size at a good price. If getting more started birds from a reputable breeder or raiser, perhaps start with a dozen to get you started. It really isn't hard to get and/or grow the flock to 100 birds. But it just seems that with all the other chores, animals, LIFE, house, canning, growing, building, repairing, etc that homestead life entails, it is good to keep things in balance and avoid that feeling of being overwhelmed.

Once things are settled in and facilities are set, experience is gained, then having 75-100 birds, with the right mix of laying hens, DP cockerels for meat, roosters, chicks etc is about right. Eat a chicken a week and you'll need 50 for the year. A dozen good layers will keep you in eggs, but such birds need rotation so you're laying flock isn't suddenly all old or in moult at the same time. Things like that. It will be some of the best learning experiences ever. Enjoy them, don't let set back get you down, and keep going. Have fun.

 

[Shylis]

I wont be getting birds from a hatchery, to much uncertainty there for me. Once I decide exactly what breed or two I want, I will be getting them good breeders, preferably someone who actually uses them how I will be (eggs and meat, not shows). In my research on homesteading, I have found numbers like 50 to 100 for flock sizes, but those numbers were for larger families with established flocks. With just the two of us, I don't want to be overrun with tons of chickens. While extra eggs and meat will be given to family and sold, I'd rather not have a huge flock right up front. I want the flock to grow with my family. The whole homestead will be growing slowly, first we will have gardens and chickens, the other livestock will be added a few at a time. Eventually we will wean ourselves off (almost) all the store bought processed preservative stuff we eat now. Our chores will grow slowly as well, so we wont be overwelhmed right away with so many things that must be done.

 

[MOChickenShoes]

i have exactly zero input as to your question since i'm new to chickens myself, but just wanted to wish you the best of luck on your new life! i admire people such as yourself that just up and "go for it" when they decide to buy a new property to homestead. my wife and i have been dreaming of that lifestyle lately ourselves, but i've been a "city boy" all my life (we're in the KCMO suburbs) and have a hard time seeing myself taking that kind of plunge for fear that i'd leave behind the decent job i have and pull the kids out of their school and friends that they love only to find that i get overwhelmed and/or just not care for the homesteading lifestyle as much as i thought i would. therefore i like to live vicariously through the stories of people such as yourself on these forums until the time seems right (if it ever does) for us to try our hand at it.

 

[Mrs. K]

For eggs, a flock of 5-10 will provide all of your needs and then some for 2 people. So if you also want to eat chicken, then I think the first poster's idea of 25, would be a great flock to start with. Get those in the spring, they start laying early fall, butcher back to say 8 head to lay over the winter. That would give you 15- 17 birds for the freezer (give or take) so you could have chicken once a week for several months.

The following year, pray for a couple of broody hens, set 8-12 eggs under each. (Plan about a 50% success rate of live chicken, there was a study here a year ago, and it turned out, over a large amount of data, the average was about 50%) But of course this can be better or worse. So if you have 3 hens, each raise 6 chicks, 1/2 of those are roos. So you add 9 head of hens to your layers, (8 + 9 = 17 layers) 9 head of roos to butcher, + any older hen not producing well. So that you go back into the fall with a laying flock that is again about 8 head.

In my opinion, the ideal laying flock should have a few 3 year old hens, a few more 2 year old hens, and mostly pullets by say October 31. The pullets will lay through the dark days of winter, and the older gals will lay occasionally through the winter, and then in the spring, very well, nice large eggs. You want your flock size reduced as you head into winter, as they take more feed in the winter, and they do not put on weight in the winter cheaply. You want to get your meat chickens big on the cheapest feed which is during the summer.

Now to the third year, you will have a great deal of experience, always valuable, you will have found and taken care of your predators, your weak parts of the coop/run set up, where predators can get in. Then increasing the size of your flock, should match your family.

It is quite difficult to succeed in what you are planning to do. I have tried for years. Some years, I come closer than others, some years nowhere near as close as I would like. There are many things out of your control, weather, insects, sickness and accidents. I have found that if I look at everything I do eat from my own production as a bonus, then I do not feel a failure, even when it is not all that I eat.

I try hard to have one thing every day, come from my garden, my cattle, my chickens. In the summer, it is much easier and often most of the meal is my own, and with careful preservation, I can get way down into the winter, but to eat entirely from my own efforts has not been possible for me, but I enjoy the life and the work. You are young, and highly energetic, so this will probably fall on deaf ears, but over time, I did find that a smaller well taken care of flock or garden, was much more efficient (as in return food for expenses to produce that food) than a larger flock or garden, poorly taken care of.

best wishes, MrsK

 

[Shylis]

MOChickenShoes: I currently live just outside KCMO (near Lee's Summit). Its nice to "see" someone from nearby in a big forum like this. Thank you for the well wishes, and I'll be sure to share my stories.

Mrs K: Thank you for all that lovely information. I already know I am going to avoid a huge flock, huge garden, etc. I know how much work large scale farming is, even with lots of help. I am used to 1000+ acres with hundreds of cattle, dozens of horses, acres and acres of crops, huge veggie gardens my grandmother drove around on a cart because they were too big to walk! There have always been big farms in my family, be it my grandparents or aunts and uncles, and I've gone to spend summers with them all my life to help. Oddly enough, I don't remember anyone having chickens, other than my dad's dad, who we only saw a couple times.
I'm a "stay at home" (soon to be) wife, so I have plenty of time and I have experience in farm work (except chickens). My husband to be has a good job that he will be keeping, but he is always off by 5, so he will be able to help with any of the big chores (like repairs I cant do), and I often times have my nephews, so I can send them out to get eggs, help feed, etc. Even tho I will have "free labor" for some duties, I will not get more livestock than I can care for. I have seen to many times what can happen to animals when people get more than they can handle. Even tho some of the animals we raise will be eaten, I still want them to have a good quality of life.

I know our homestead will always be a work in progress and maybe my goals are a little lofty, but I know that if I dont have a longterm goal, I wont strife to improve. Any little success will be great, because I will know that we've saved that much money and that we've grown/raised what is feeding our family.


On a side note, I am so excited to say that even with this crazy hot weather and drought in our area, the property mentioned above that we are looking at, is still in good grass and not all burnt up and dry! It has two creeks that kind of border the two long sides, and a small pond at the bottem of the hill on the other side. So all that water has kept it from drying out to much. I think this is going to be an excellent place. We have a meeting tomorrow and after that we will know weither we are getting that one, or if we are still looking. (Oh, its a little over 16 acres native prarie grass and 5+/- trees, so about 21 1/2 acres, if anyone was intrested)

 

[MOChickenShoes]

MOChickenShoes: I currently live just outside KCMO (near Lee's Summit). Its nice to "see" someone from nearby in a big forum like this. Thank you for the well wishes, and I'll be sure to share my stories.

sure is a small world sometimes lol. i was born and raised in blue springs, and my wife and i have lived here in liberty for the last 10 years. i'm gonna hold you to what you said about sharing your stories hope your meeting goes well!

 

[Life is Good!]

For quantity of eggs needed - start recording on paper how many eggs you use each day. Seriously. Have fiance do the same. You might be surprised, as our minds tend to not account for things like the 1 egg needed in the meatloaf, and only remember the 4 egg double omlete!

I kept records of how many our family of 4 was using - kept it for six months before getting our flock - so that's one cold season, one cool season and the start of one warm season - and found in the cooler weather I used a LOT more eggs than in the warmer season. Although that's because my sons decided they preferred tuna salad to egg salad sandwiches!

This record will allow you specifics. I figured on freezing eggs during the seasons I'm not using so much, or hard boiling/pickling them (yum!), and the seasons I am using more, they will be available to me (baked goods can use frozen eggs just fine....mixed 1/2 and 1/2 with fresh and they're ok for scrambled and great for quiches). And for some reason pickled eggs are REALLY tasty after shoveling snow - perhaps the salts?

Best wishes on the homestead plans! I too would start with a flock of 25 and see where it goes. (Our flock is now at 18 and doing well in suburbia. Too many cockerals hatched out, so we'll be reducing the flock soon - if you crow, you gotta go! We only keep one roo.)

 

[Shylis]

Life Is Good: Great tip on counting how many eggs we use. I'm going off of how long the eggs we buy last, so I think it's fairly accurate. It includes all the cakes, breads and brownies we make, and those things most people wouldn't think off right away. A dozen eggs usually lasts a week unless I am making breads, then we need closer to two dozen. I usually make breads once a month, so I estimate that we use about 5 dozen eggs a month. We are very eggy people I suppose.

MOChickenShoes: I was born in Blue Springs but raised close to Warrensburg and Sedalia, always in the country. I moved up here to be with my fiance. Its nice, but to much concrete for me! We got the property. I have to go out later today to see how well it drains after the rain, so we have a better idea where to put things. Then next weekend we are inspecting and repairing fences! My fiance loves that idea, lol. I'm going to turn this St Louis boy into a country boy.

 

[MOChickenShoes]

Life Is Good: Great tip on counting how many eggs we use. I'm going off of how long the eggs we buy last, so I think it's fairly accurate. It includes all the cakes, breads and brownies we make, and those things most people wouldn't think off right away. A dozen eggs usually lasts a week unless I am making breads, then we need closer to two dozen. I usually make breads once a month, so I estimate that we use about 5 dozen eggs a month. We are very eggy people I suppose.

MOChickenShoes: I was born in Blue Springs but raised close to Warrensburg and Sedalia, always in the country. I moved up here to be with my fiance. Its nice, but to much concrete for me! We got the property. I have to go out later today to see how well it drains after the rain, so we have a better idea where to put things. Then next weekend we are inspecting and repairing fences! My fiance loves that idea, lol. I'm going to turn this St Louis boy into a country boy.