Hardware Cloth - How Far Up Run and Run Floor?

[DuckDuckSook]

Hello Chicken Friends!
I'm revamping my run/coop set-up this spring. I have a chainlink kennel (10x10 and 6 ft tall) that I've used for years. It's served me well. I wrapped the bottom half with coated wire fencing halfway up and I use hog panels for roofing covered with chicken wire and tarps. The wire fencing is also skirted 18 inches out with rocks all around. It's been predator proof and keeps away raccoons, foxes, hawks, etc. However, rats are a problem. So, long story short, now that I'm redoing it all, I'm going to go Fort Knox on this thing.
My questions are: Do I need to put hardware cloth all the way up to the top? Can I get away with putting it only halfway up or will the rats climb?
I want to put it along the entire bottom of the run as a floor/substrate. Do I need to dig down a little and then put wood pellets on top to keep the chickens' feet safe or can I just lay it on the surface of the ground and then do the wood pellets?
Any advice, tips, suggestions, ideas are always appreciated! Thanks in advance!

 

[Sally PB]

I would not use any kind of wire fencing on the floor of the run. The chickens will scratch down to it (mine have made craters 5-6 inches deep) and they could snag a toe nail or cut a toe on a sharp edge. A skirt is a better option.

Have you looked at using a treadle-style feeder to keep the chickens from spilling feed as a way to discourage rats? Do you know where they're coming in?

There are a lot of posts and threads about dealing with rats, so if you search, you should be able to find more ideas.

 

[DuckDuckSook]

I would not use any kind of wire fencing on the floor of the run. The chickens will scratch down to it (mine have made craters 5-6 inches deep) and they could snag a toe nail or cut a toe on a sharp edge. A skirt is a better option.

Have you looked at using a treadle-style feeder to keep the chickens from spilling feed as a way to discourage rats? Do you know where they're coming in?

There are a lot of posts and threads about dealing with rats, so if you search, you should be able to find more ideas.

I already do the skirt with 18" square pavers on top all the way around, but it's not with hardware cloth. It's with the coated wire and that has bigger slots.
The rats get in through tunnels that they have dug into the run under the skirt and under the pavers. They can also squeeze through the slats in the wire fencing - thus my desire to go with hardware cloth.
I just think that even if I do hardware cloth up the sides and skirt it and cover the skirt with rocks and pavers, they still might dig tunnels into the run.
I've looked into the treadle-style feeders. Would turkeys be able to use that? I'm going to have my 2 turkey hens in there with my chickens.
I've read a ton about rats and keeping them out seems to be key. I'm going to do my best I guess. I don't want to use poison as I'm afraid of harming my own pets (birds, dog, barn cats, sheep,) and wildlife. I've heard that things like baking soda and other natural solutions don't always work.
I guess I can just try a bunch of things and if that doesn't work try something else. I just feel like rats are tough.

 

[Sally PB]

I don't know all the particulars, but some people have used dry ice in the rats' tunnels. The idea is to find the tunnels, block off all but one entrance, put some dry ice in the tunnel, and block off the last entrance. The idea is to fill the tunnel with CO2 from the dry ice, and suffocate the rats.

I have never done this, but I've read about it a few times here on BYC.

As for treadle feeders and turkeys... I have no idea.

 

[thecatumbrella]

One absolutely miserable idea (and one I might consider doing myself) is trenching down a couple of feet around the outer perimeter, then running hardware cloth from the wall down into it. I've seen it done on at least one coop build as a way to deter digging predators. I'll come back and link if I can find it.

Also, to answer your other question, I would hardware cloth the entire way up the wall. I had pets rats, and they are very enthusiastic climbers.

 

[DuckDuckSook]

One absolutely miserable idea (and one I might consider doing myself) is trenching down a couple of feet around the outer perimeter, then running hardware cloth from the wall down into it. I've seen it done on at least one coop build as a way to deter digging predators. I'll come back and link if I can find it.

Also, to answer your other question, I would hardware cloth the entire way up the wall. I had pets rats, and they are very enthusiastic climbers.

Thanks for the reply.
I'm not really looking forward to trenching. I did that on an older coop years ago and it was a real pain. We have clay soil so it's a nightmare in terms of digging.
I figured the rats would probably climb. I was just hopeful that maybe I have some lazy ones who wouldn't try it. I'm probably going to go all the way up.
I really thought about laying hardware cloth down on the floor of the run, but I'm nervous about my birds' feet.
I really can't stand the rats.
Maybe if I make it more difficult for them to get in other ways, they won't dig super long tunnels and thwart all my efforts. ?!?!
A girl's gotta hope right?

 

[thecatumbrella]

Thanks for the reply.
I'm not really looking forward to trenching. I did that on an older coop years ago and it was a real pain. We have clay soil so it's a nightmare in terms of digging.
I figured the rats would probably climb. I was just hopeful that maybe I have some lazy ones who wouldn't try it. I'm probably going to go all the way up.
I really thought about laying hardware cloth down on the floor of the run, but I'm nervous about my birds' feet.
I really can't stand the rats.
Maybe if I make it more difficult for them to get in other ways, they won't dig super long tunnels and thwart all my efforts. ?!?!
A girl's gotta hope right?

I hear you. We trenched for electrical to the chicken run last year... I wince just thinking about it.

I agree with Sally about not putting hardware cloth directly underfoot. Mine routinely dig down 6-8" as part of their own daily trenching, and the HC would just shred their feet. Nevermind how it would limit one of their favorite activities.

Lots of other members are going through rat woes right now, so you're not alone. I'm not sure we've come up with a great way to get rid of them. Tagging @Mother of Chaos to see if she has anything new to add from her rat ordeal.

 

[DuckDuckSook]

I hear you. We trenched for electrical to the chicken run last year... I wince just thinking about it.

I agree with Sally about not putting hardware cloth directly underfoot. Mine routinely dig down 6-8" as part of their own daily trenching, and the HC would just shred their feet. Nevermind how it would limit one of their favorite activities.

Lots of other members are going through rat woes right now, so you're not alone. I'm not sure we've come up with a great way to get rid of them. Tagging @Mother of Chaos to see if she has anything new to add from her rat ordeal.

Thanks for your response.
I think I'm just going to forego the hardware cloth on the floor of the run. It would be a bit of an endeavor and I don't think it would really work.
The rats are just so persistent. I even have 3 barn cats and I still have quite a few rats. However, my barn cats aren't the fiercest hunters. They bring me more birds than anything else.
I am adding 2 more cats this spring though. Maybe that will help.
I'm also relocating the run/coop closer to the barn where the cats spend most of their time. That also might prove helpful.

 

[StinkyAcres]

Placing pavers on top of the skirt defeats the purpose of a skirt. All it does is tell the rats where to start digging their tunnels. Dirt, mulch, or fine gravel are better choices.

 

[thecatumbrella]

Placing pavers on top of the skirt defeats the purpose of a skirt. All it does is tell the rats where to start digging their tunnels. Dirt, mulch, or fine gravel are better choices.

This has got me thinking.

I have a 24" skirt that's covered on 3 sides with gravel. The front has garden box (to catch rain runoff from the roof). By this logic, the box would be a weak point for digging animals. Might need to extend my skirt another foot or two in that area!