HELP PLEASE: Internal Pip- when to assist

[whitneymoon]

I am at the end of day 21, and all of my other eggs hatched between day 19-20, and two hatched today. Two are left. One has no movement and no internal pip. The other has an internal pip and is cheeping. I am wondering how long one should wait before making an external pip near the beak (I read Sally Sunshine's article about assisted hatching). I can't seem to find a clear cut answer to the following questions:

How long is too long for the chick to be internally pipped with no external pip?
If you create an external pip, does this create more danger for the chick? 
Is there a time limit for it to stay externally pipped safely?
What is the benefit of externally pipping manually... Does it just help the chick breathe, or am I potentially doing more harm than good?

Any advice would be much appreciated. I am just concerned because the rest of the eggs had at least pipped 24 hours ago at the latest. I am fairly certain the other egg has a dead chick in it, even though it was rocking and rolling yesterday. I don't want this internally pipped chick to meet the same fate. Not sure how long it has been internally pipped.

 

[work0222]

Im right there as well.. I have a miracle chick that has internally but not externally pipped.
I say miracle because on day 8 the incubator got unplugged. By the time I noticed, the eggs were at 56 degrees. I decided to give them a week and candle to see if they had grown..some had, some hadnt. I couldn't bring myself to throw them out with only 9 days left so I just let them go. With 5 days left, I noticed the temp had gotten to 105 degrees. I pretty much knew they were gone but still let them go due to guilt. The chicks should've hatched day before yesterday but I forgot about them. I took them and candled this afternoon but only two had mass..but as I was hauling the incubator outside I heard peeping!! The egg has been rocking and rolling all evening and peeping like crazy. I swear the other egg with mass wiggled but it could be me REALLY wanting it to be alive. I've done this before but usually if I help, they have externally pipped prior.. when or do I help?
I really don't want to loose the ONE (possibly two) of 21 eggs that defeated all odds to make it this far..

 

[whitneymoon]

This morning I shot up out of bed at 5:30 am with no explanation. I couldn't go back to sleep and decided maybe my intuition was telling me something was up with the egg. I checked and found that it was completely zipped, but not making progress. The membranes looked dry and old despite the humidity being high. I woke my husband who told me that when he went to bed 6 hours earlier, the egg had looked just like that, totally zipped. So it had been zipped with no progress for 6 hours! At this point I watched the chick struggle for 30 minutes before deciding to pull off the air cell shell. Found that it was trapped in a tough membrane (no blood) and cheeping really loudly. I slowly peeled it off and freed the baby, who looks totally healthy, but had a thin string attaching it to the egg still at the "belly button". I put it back in the incubator and it was dragging the eggshell around, which made me worry about it pulling too hard and wounding its belly. So I carefully broke the string (it was clear, no blood) and the chick was free. Put a warm towel down on the mesh of the incubator since the belly button was still protruding a little. Will this little belly nub just resolve on its own?

Work0222, How is your miracle chick?

 

[work0222]

The belly nub definitely resolves itself in a few hours..
Miracle chick is actually exactly as you described. Pipped through by 6am but no real progress. Then the shell started basically chipping off leaving a dry tough membrane. I've helped only by moistening the membrane but it's killing me. Seems like it should be able to stretch out and shrug it all off. Makes me wonder about its legs being weak due to its tumultuous incubation :-\

 

[work0222]

 

[midget_farms]

What you guys are describing is called shrink wrap. If the incubation was too dry or the incubator is opened during the hatch the membrane will dry out quickly. It needs to be wet & slippery for a chick to escape the egg.

 

[work0222]

I believe that.. I didnt think it was a viable hatch at all and failed to add humidity until well past lock down time.. what now? I hate for it to just lay there peeping and stuck..

 

[midget_farms]

Now it's time to save it. You need steam & hot water & q-tips.

I was not able to keep mine alive very long.

You want to remove the shell & membrane. & wash off the feathers of any sticky goo. That stuff is hard to get off.

& you need to do all of that without getting the chick cold. You need 100 degree water & lots of humidity. Maybe do it in the bathroom with the shower going on full blast.

Good luck! Let us know how it goes

 

[whitneymoon]

Thanks for the advice. I think this one was shrink wrapped because she was working with an open shell for so long. The humidity was 75% and the incubator was never opened. Strange- she was the only on of the eggs to have this issue.

I am glad miracle chick is okay!!

 

[work0222]

Thanks midget farms, so far so good..the shower trick worked, LOTS OF humidity.. I left the shell on at the bottom fo fear of pulling on the umbilicus(?) ..its wiggling and chirping but how should inplace it in the incubator? On its side? Back? Belly?