Hen with a Limp, Labored Breathing, Drooping Tail, and Fatigue [Update: Worm Found]

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

@Elspeth Dinsmore

I personally would use the 23 if that is what I had. There have been times I felt I had to use a lot of hand strength to draw with the 18 gauge.

I place the needle on the hens right side ( internal organs are on her left so always drain on the right) I choose a spot at least 2 inches below the vent and off to the right as that seemed to be the location a vet demonstrated on Youtube. I insert the needle about a half to 3/4 of an inch depending again on the swelling and the size of the bird I usually draw the plunger and pull until the plunger is out and let the fluid drain through the needle and through the syringe into a container. When the flow slows down I remove the needle. Some fluid will continue to drain.

I had one hen that I drained a few times. Then she seemed OK until she started laying eggs in spring and started swelling up again. When I tried to drain her I could barely draw the plunger and I only got some hard pus in the syringe. At that point nothing helped and I had her put down. So sometimes this just makes them more comfortable and may not save her life. If there is fluid or pus antibiotics will be needed and again. If it's too far along may not work, but I always try.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/laying-hens-with-water-belly-or-ascites.68731/page-5

It is okay to use just the needle and no syringe to drain. A sterilized large sewing needle can also be used just to make a small hole to drain, in the absence of a hypodermic needle. Be sure to disinfect the skin well, if you attempt it, because there is a risk of infection. Yellow to amber fluid is ascites, while clear color-less fluid is a cystic right oviduct. Both can cause enlargement of the abdomen. I usually don’t attempt draining since ascites is a fatal disease eventually. But for one having labored breathing, I will do it to help ease the discomfort and breathing. In this thread below, post 42 has good pictures of a needle draining fluid:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/laying-hens-with-water-belly-or-ascites.68731/page-5

Thank you both so much for all of this information and help! You both are so kind! I am going to be reading these threads that are linked and saving all this information you both gave. Thank you again!

 

[CCsGarden]

I just realized, we said mealworms, but technically they are black soldier fly larvae! I didn't realize that earlier. Here is the analysis on the back:View attachment 3918083

Thanks, CC! I will scramble up an egg for her to make sure she isn't eating too many black soldier fly larvae.

Looks okay to me! Hope she take the egg

 

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

Looks okay to me! Hope she take the egg

She just ate a whole half of an egg! I cooked it up in coconut oil to help her crop. I added a pinch of homegrown Oregano, Basil, Rosemary, Thyme, and Plantain with some sugar, salt, and baking soda.
She did spit-up four different times when she was outside eating. She vigorously ate the egg and bounded after some weeds in the yard, but when she lowered her head to eat, she started spitting up. I would think that maybe she has a crop issue, but she has been pooping and a lot of water has been passing through her. Her crop has gone down some several times. I think she maybe mis-judged how much water she can take? The Speckled Sussex seem to do that a lot, but I am not used to them spitting up like this. She's definitely not feeling good, but has perked up some. Now she is resting on my lap panting and holding her wings out.

 

[CCsGarden]

She did spit-up four different times when she was outside eating. She vigorously ate the egg and bounded after some weeds in the yard, but when she lowered her head to eat, she started spitting up. I would think that maybe she has a crop issue

If she was just drinking a lot and eating ( mine do this all the time) then that's what can cause her to spit up .

How is she today?

 

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

Hello, CC! Thank you for asking about Brynn!

The good news is that she has been able to poo about 10-11 times today. One was massive, two were cecal, and several were more normal sized. It is a slightly different color than I am used to.

The one massive poo was light brown with a yellowish tinge to it, white to cream urates, and a fibrous texture. Most of the others have been the same consistency. All are very smelly with an eggy hint.

Same poo, different lighting.

Cecal poo:

The photos actually make them look smaller than they were.

The bad news is:
She had labored breathing/panting all night. Sometimes she makes tiny "honking" noises similar to the video sent yesterday.

Her foot still hurts her today. She can still walk, but it is slow and with a big limp. She still favors it and puts all her weight on her right leg. She also seems to have trouble opening her foot each time she sets it down for another step. She leaves it closed, lifts it up and down, over and over, before setting it down in the place she wants.

Even though she is pooping, Brynn did not digest all the food in her crop overnight. Some food and water were digested, but she still had a considerable amount left over.
I am wondering if maybe this is a big part of why Brynn is feeling poor.
I have noticed in the past that not all of her food is completely digested by morning. I am now trying to treat her for this crop issue. I am hoping maybe this is the main problem (aside for the leg injury) and not that it is a sign of something worse. I am trying to learn more about crop disorders.

We just gave her some things to help the crop. We also gave her Vitamin B, Vitamin E, Nutridrench, & some homegrown herbs.

I am going to keep my eye on her abdomen to see if it gets more swollen. I will continue to try to learn more about how to properly drain it if that is the issue and becomes necessary.

She is still very tired and clearly not feeling well.

 

[CCsGarden]

Hello, CC! Thank you for asking about Brynn!

The good news is that she has been able to poo about 10-11 times today. One was massive, two were cecal, and several were more normal sized. It is a slightly different color than I am used to.

The one massive poo was light brown with a yellowish tinge to it, white to cream urates, and a fibrous texture. Most of the others have been the same consistency. All are very smelly with an eggy hint.
View attachment 3918578
Same poo, different lighting.
View attachment 3918579

Cecal poo:
View attachment 3918580

View attachment 3918789
The photos actually make them look smaller than they were.

The bad news is:
She had labored breathing/panting all night. Sometimes she makes tiny "honking" noises similar to the video sent yesterday.

Her foot still hurts her today. She can still walk, but it is slow and with a big limp. She still favors it and puts all her weight on her right leg. She also seems to have trouble opening her foot each time she sets it down for another step. She leaves it closed, lifts it up and down, over and over, before setting it down in the place she wants.

Even though she is pooping, Brynn did not digest all the food in her crop overnight. Some food and water were digested, but she still had a considerable amount left over.
I am wondering if maybe this is a big part of why Brynn is feeling poor.
I have noticed in the past that not all of her food is completely digested by morning. I am now trying to treat her for this crop issue. I am hoping maybe this is the main problem (aside for the leg injury) and not that it is a sign of something worse. I am trying to learn more about crop disorders.

We just gave her some things to help the crop. We also gave her Vitamin B, Vitamin E, Nutridrench, & some homegrown herbs.

I am going to keep my eye on her abdomen to see if it gets more swollen. I will continue to try to learn more about how to properly drain it if that is the issue and becomes necessary.

She is still very, very tired and clearly not feeling well.

I really hope she gets better!
For the crop give her coconut oil it worked so well on my hen that had crop issue!

 

[Tiffany Wikk]

~ Update ~

Yesterday Brynn was feeling much better. She went back out with the other chickens for a good portion of the afternoon. I checked on her every 15-30 minutes to make sure she wasn't tiring herself out. Later, after dinner, she seemed to want to come back inside for the night. She still favors her leg but not nearly as much.

Over the night she tried to hold in her poo while sitting on the blanket in the crate. She waited to be taken outside for her potty breaks. We think she was viewing the crate like a nesting box where she didn't want to sit in her poo. Each time she tried to hold it in, she'd start to pant. Elspeth would then take her outside, she'd go potty, and her panting would decrease.

This morning Elspeth found a worm in her droppings when she took her out for a potty break. We think some of the things we gave her for her crop irritated the worm and caused it to come out. (e.g. cayenne pepper)

Spoiler: Worm

We de-wormed all of the chickens ~2 months and a week ago (June 4-8) for five days using Safe Guard Fenbendazole (0.25 ml per 1 lb.). Is it safe to repeat the dewormer this soon after? I was thinking we would wait an entire 6 months before the next treatment, but clearly she has worms now. This is probably why she is feeling so poor. I'm sure she still injured her leg some, but that's not all that's going on with her.

We did the five days in a row to kill a wide variety of worms not knowing if they even had worms prior to starting. Several of the birds went into shock from the worm overload. This was before we made it to the tenth day. They were doing so poor, we didn't think they were strong enough to handle the round worm dose we had read about that's supposed to be given on the tenth day.

I'm thinking what happened was that because we didn't give the deworming on the tenth day then some eggs may have survived. So this time, if it's safe to repeat so soon, we'll just do a deworming today and repeat 10 days later, as opposed to the whole 5 days like last time, since now we know we are definitely dealing with round worms.

Her crop did not empty over night. Most liquid seems to go through, but a good portion of the solid stuff stays in her crop. We are thinking she may have a blockage or overload of worms that's causing her crop to be slow to empty.(?)

This may mean that we need to retreat our whole flock. Perhaps these worms will explain some other issues we have with the other birds. We're afraid to treat them all at the same time again because of how hard it was last time with them being so sick from it. Is it okay to stagger things and just deworm Brynn first and make sure things won't be as bad as last time?

 

[ChicNmom]

I think enough time has passed that you can de worm again.
I use Valbazen directly into the beak of the chicken. Not in their water or food because I want each bird to get the full dose.

I take a piece of white bread (because for some stupid reason they don't like the whole grain I eat) I put the dose of Valbazen in it and offer it to them. They will eat it out of my hand. Then 10 days later they get another dose. Easy Peasy

 

[alinas2010]

~ Update ~

Yesterday Brynn was feeling much better. She went back out with the other chickens for a good portion of the afternoon. I checked on her every 15-30 minutes to make sure she wasn't tiring herself out. Later, after dinner, she seemed to want to come back inside for the night. She still favors her leg but not nearly as much.
View attachment 3919468

Over the night she tried to hold in her poo while sitting on the blanket in the crate. She waited to be taken outside for her potty breaks. We think she was viewing the crate like a nesting box where she didn't want to sit in her poo. Each time she tried to hold it in, she'd start to pant. Elspeth would then take her outside, she'd go potty, and her panting would decrease.

This morning Elspeth found a worm in her droppings when she took her out for a potty break. We think some of the things we gave her for her crop irritated the worm and caused it to come out. (e.g. cayenne pepper)

Spoiler: Worm

View attachment 3919457View attachment 3919458

We de-wormed all of the chickens ~2 months and a week ago (June 4-8) for five days using Safe Guard Fenbendazole (0.25 ml per 1 lb.). Is it safe to repeat the dewormer this soon after? I was thinking we would wait an entire 6 months before the next treatment, but clearly she has worms now. This is probably why she is feeling so poor. I'm sure she still injured her leg some, but that's not all that's going on with her.

We did the five days in a row to kill a wide variety of worms not knowing if they even had worms prior to starting. Several of the birds went into shock from the worm overload. This was before we made it to the tenth day. They were doing so poor, we didn't think they were strong enough to handle the round worm dose we had read about that's supposed to be given on the tenth day.

I'm thinking what happened was that because we didn't give the deworming on the tenth day then some eggs may have survived. So this time, if it's safe to repeat so soon, we'll just do a deworming today and repeat 10 days later, as opposed to the whole 5 days like last time, since now we know we are definitely dealing with round worms.

Her crop did not empty over night. Most liquid seems to go through, but a good portion of the solid stuff stays in her crop. We are thinking she may have a blockage or overload of worms that's causing her crop to be slow to empty.(?)

This may mean that we need to retreat our whole flock. Perhaps these worms will explain some other issues we have with the other birds. We're afraid to treat them all at the same time again because of how hard it was last time with them being so sick from it. Is it okay to stagger things and just deworm Brynn first and make sure things won't be as bad as last time?

I hope your flock will be okay with the deworm again. They certainly do seem to need it. I’ve never had to deworm my flock, I’m sorry, Tiffany, I wish I could give you some advice. What I can say is I know that you two are very prepared and have great knowledge going into this with your last experience in mind.

 

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

I think enough time has passed that you can de worm again.
I use Valbazen directly into the beak of the chicken. Not in their water or food because I want each bird to get the full dose.

I take a piece of white bread (because for some stupid reason they don't like the whole grain I eat) I put the dose of Valbazen in it and offer it to them. They will eat it out of my hand. Then 10 days later they get another dose. Easy Peasy

Thank you for this information! We really appreciate it. It is also helpful to know about putting it on bread! We had such a hard time giving them medicine when we were first learning. They wouldn't eat the treats we put the medicine in. We ended up learning how to administer it via syringe, but that is still difficult sometimes. I will have to try bread with the harder birds!

I hope your flock will be okay with the deworm again. They certainly do seem to need it. I’ve never had to deworm my flock, I’m sorry, Tiffany, I wish I could give you some advice. What I can say is I know that you two are very prepared and have great knowledge going into this with your last experience in mind.

Thank you for the encouragement, Alina!
That is so wonderful you have never needed to de-worm!
I hope we are able to get this under control and help our birds feel better soon.
Brynn was doing even better today. She actually started growing some little feathers on her bum! First I have seen in a long time! I'm excited!

Here she is sun-bathing today!