Heritage Large Fowl - Phase II

[Zanna]

I seem to be having a bit of a problem that I could use some help with. I keep my spare roosters in a 4x4 foot pen, also 4 foot tall. It has good ventilation and the free range hens walk by them all day long. I give them fresh water all the time and mostly layer pellets with a little bit of scratch. It seems that if they are in there very long say a month or six weeks they start going down hill, loosing weight, feathers do not look so good and might even loose some feathers. Does anybody have any ideas what I could do different?

Thank you
Scott

What is the protein in your layer pellets and is it vegetable protein or animal? I would be suspect that they need more protein and a good quality animal one.

 

[hellbender]

Most birds that I have seen are always carrying some sort of parasite load, due to parasites being carried by wild birds and earthworms.Parasite numbers multiply very fast on overgrazed range, or in deep litter, especially if there is crowding.I run my own fecals, so I know what I'[m dealing with. Hopefully this cold winter has knocked the parasites down a bit.



Here is my feeding program for my Orps.

All babies get Purina Medicated Chick Starter from day one, until 4 1/2
months old. The little babies also get Quaker Rolled Oats once a day, soaked
in hot
water at 3 days old.
At 4 weeks, the babies go on my grain mix for the big birds, in addition to
their
Med. Starter free choice.

I feed whole grains, in addition to their regular ration, to increase
internal organ size.The grains are fed once a day in the evening.

The grain mix is:

1 Part rolled oats
1 part Scratch or Wild Bird seed
1 parts Boss in cool weather. Hulled sunflower seeds in very hot weather.
1 part Calf Manna


All adults have free choice Flockraiser, and oyster shell. I also give them
meat scraps a few times a week. I feed the grains in pans.

All birds are out for at least 4-5 hours a day on good grass.

Worming.......MOST IMPORTANT

All babies are wormed with Wazine in their water at 2 + 3 weeks. Wazine is
never used again .

Safeguard 10 % Goat wormer, alternating with Valbazan at 4 weeks, 6,8,10,
12, 14 weeks
1/4 cc at 4,6,8 weeks
1/2 cc at 10,12,14 weeks.

5 mos on...... I check fecals, and worm about 4 times a year with the
Safeguard, or with Valbazan. 1 CC per Big bird over 8 lbs., repeating in
10-14 days.

Coops are sprayed with liquid PERMETHRIN about 4 times a year. Birds are
sprayed, 4 times a year with diluted Permethrin for lice and mites.

If you follow this program, you will raise big, healthy birds. Please
remember that the imported birds have not developed immunity to US bugs, or
parasites.

I think you have, in part, copied my protocol! jajaja

 

[MagicChicken]

I seem to be having a bit of a problem that I could use some help with. I keep my spare roosters in a 4x4 foot pen, also 4 foot tall. It has good ventilation and the free range hens walk by them all day long. I give them fresh water all the time and mostly layer pellets with a little bit of scratch. It seems that if they are in there very long say a month or six weeks they start going down hill, loosing weight, feathers do not look so good and might even loose some feathers. Does anybody have any ideas what I could do different?

Thank you
Scott

Could be stress from the small space. Could be nutrition. Or both.

I nearly ruined one of my best cocks by keeping him in a 4' x 6' breeding pen several weeks longer than I had originally planned. He was not happy in that pen. Never used the roost, just sulked in the corner. Didn't sit with any of the hens I put him with, although he did mount them and he sired several chicks. Prior to being put in the breeding pen he had been in a large coop/run. He had some attitude but was not mean. After he had been in that 4'x 6' pen for a few weeks he started to get aggressive. I started changing his feed and water at night because he would try to flog me whenever I set foot in the pen in the daytime. I am convinced a big part of his aggression came from having been in that small pen for too long.

Flogging is unacceptable, but so is unnecessarily stressing a bird. Watching his behavior shift was a lesson for me. My birds need space. He is now back in the large coop/run, with free range time every couple of days. After I moved him back into the large coop/run he still fixated on me, hunting me down and flogging me at every opportunity. There were some epic battles in the yard because neither of us would back down. Matching aggression with aggression was not working, so I tried a different approach. I had a long talk with him and apologized for keeping him in that small space. Told him what a handsome, brave and strong rooster he is and that he did not deserve to be confined like that. Thanked him for taking care of the flock. Now when he starts to move in on me I just give him the stink eye and remind him that he has no more chances left. The new approach seems to be working. We have developed something of a truce. He has begun backing down. And he has no more chances left. The next time he decides to meet me feet-first he will find himself upside down in a tree, being introduced to Mr. Knife. It's his choice. Hope he chooses to keep the truce because he is one gorgeous bird.

It sounds crazy. Maybe it is crazy. If it works I will be very happy. If it doesn't work I will be well fed. It's a win-win for me.

Sarah

 

[chickadoodles]

Kids, what ya gonna do with them !?!

I came home from errands today and went out to gather eggs at the far coop. Looked down and there was
one of my stud cocks at my feet. Now all my coops are fully enclosed. Hum... not good. He came up to me
and let me pick him up while I wondered which coop was open. Turns out it was Knight and Day and the
small white coop on the other side of our property was wide open. Sweetie, the outcross hen, was still in
the coop. I have no idea how long they were out. The lawn is quite dug up around the front of the coop.
But Knight and Day came to me, that was such a relief. I have been working hard to make friends with him
this winter. Found one of his large wing feathers out on the lawn. 6 weeks to grow it back in, sigh.
Looks like the neighborhood kids have been "joking" again. Nuts, now I have to put locks on all the coops.
Best,
Karen

You could try to catch them with a cheap web cam set up to monitor your coop when you leave again. So you can talk to his parents and show them the proof. Just a thought.

 

[hellbender]

Punji stick!


EDIT: Of course I jest. Or not so much.

 

[RedRidge]

 
Most birds that I have seen are always carrying some sort of parasite load, due to parasites being carried by wild birds and earthworms.Parasite numbers multiply very fast on overgrazed range, or in deep litter, especially if there is crowding.I run my own fecals, so I know what I'[m dealing with. Hopefully this cold winter has knocked the parasites down a bit.




Here is my feeding program for my Orps.


All babies get Purina Medicated Chick Starter from day one, until 4 1/2

months old. The little babies also get Quaker Rolled Oats once a day, soaked

in hot

water  at 3 days old.

At 4 weeks, the babies go on my grain mix for the big birds, in addition to

their

Med. Starter free choice.


I feed whole grains, in addition to their regular ration, to increase

internal organ size.The grains are fed once a day in the evening.


The grain mix is:


1 Part rolled oats

1 part Scratch or Wild Bird seed

1  parts Boss    in cool weather. Hulled sunflower seeds in very hot weather.

1 part Calf Manna



All adults have free choice Flockraiser, and oyster shell. I also give them

meat scraps a few times a week. I feed the grains in pans.


All birds are out for at least 4-5 hours a day on good grass.


Worming.......MOST IMPORTANT


All babies are wormed with Wazine in their water at 2 + 3 weeks. Wazine is

never used again .


Safeguard 10 % Goat wormer, alternating with Valbazan at 4 weeks, 6,8,10,

12, 14 weeks

1/4 cc at 4,6,8 weeks

1/2 cc at 10,12,14 weeks.


5 mos on...... I check fecals, and worm about 4 times a year with the

Safeguard, or with Valbazan. 1 CC per Big bird over 8 lbs., repeating in

10-14 days.


Coops are sprayed with liquid PERMETHRIN about 4 times a year. Birds are

sprayed, 4 times a year with diluted Permethrin for lice and mites.


If you follow this program, you will raise big, healthy birds. Please

remember that the imported birds have not developed immunity to US bugs, or

parasites. 

I think you have, in part, copied my protocol!  jajaja

What egg withdrawal time do you use (for both hatching and eating), for safeguard and valbazin?

 

[thedragonlady]

What egg withdrawal time do you use (for both hatching and eating), for safeguard and valbazin?

There is no egg withdrawal time for hatching eggs. I do try to have birds wormed just before breeding season though.We eat the eggs from birds wormed with Valbazan and Safeguard. If you sell eggs though you should wait for at least a week before selling those eggs. It IS possible that someone might be sensitive to those wormers, but I doubt it occurs often.Both of those anthelmintic drugs are used in third world countries to worm people.

 

[Arielle]

I seem to be having a bit of a problem that I could use some help with. I keep my spare roosters in a 4x4 foot pen, also 4 foot tall. It has good ventilation and the free range hens walk by them all day long. I give them fresh water all the time and mostly layer pellets with a little bit of scratch. It seems that if they are in there very long say a month or six weeks they start going down hill, loosing weight, feathers do not look so good and might even loose some feathers. Does anybody have any ideas what I could do different?

Thank you
Scott

In addition to the other information you have received, the layer is designed for layers . THe girls when laying eat a huge amt of feed and the components are balanced for high consumption and making eggs. As you are giving the boys a bit of scratch, consider an18-20% protein feed, with animal protein, or add a very small amount from another source( fish meal) a few times a week. Greens are very beneficial too; my penned birds enjoy a handful of alfalfa hay, fruits, chopped vegetables. If yours are not willing to eat that, then add liquid vitamins to the water.

 

[RedRidge]

What egg withdrawal time do you use (for both hatching and eating), for safeguard and valbazin?

There is no egg withdrawal time for hatching eggs. I do try to have birds wormed just before breeding season though.We eat the eggs from birds wormed with Valbazan and Safeguard. If you sell eggs though you should wait for at least a week before selling those eggs. It IS possible that someone might be sensitive to those wormers, but I doubt it occurs often.Both of those anthelmintic drugs are used in third world countries to worm people.

I can't figure out if this makes me sound stubborn, ignorant, or lucky but I do annual fecals and have never had a heavy problem. Before I continue I should knock on wood... In 15 years I have never wormed a chicken of any age, or treated coops. Our feed medicated feed. I guess as the saying goes - "if it ain't broke I ain't gonna fix it"

Off to finish lighting the fire for the boiler and setting up the cones... it's semi annual butcher day here. Let's hope the weather holds.

 

[gjensen]

I seem to be having a bit of a problem that I could use some help with. I keep my spare roosters in a 4x4 foot pen, also 4 foot tall. It has good ventilation and the free range hens walk by them all day long. I give them fresh water all the time and mostly layer pellets with a little bit of scratch. It seems that if they are in there very long say a month or six weeks they start going down hill, loosing weight, feathers do not look so good and might even loose some feathers. Does anybody have any ideas what I could do different?

Thank you
Scott

Scott, it is just an opinion, but I am a believer in males being kept mentally fit. You may already do it, but I would alternate letting them out. They could use some stimuli from time to time. Some sunshine and some fresh greens.

I think the protein in the layer ration is fine for maintenance, but it is a basic ration designed for commercial layers. Condition is not a priority in the feed, and the calcium is a bit high for males.

Other than switching the feed and checking for parasites, I would alternately let them out, and bring those that do not get out fresh greens every day. I am guessing that will make a difference for you.

I also think that 4' x 4' is a little small. I see gamecock breeders using 4'x '4' pens and keeping males in good condition. They tend to be on grass though, and American games are small birds. I think for large dual purpose birds 5' x 5' is adequate, but I would be letting them out to run regularly.

Sunshine and greens help a lot concerning keeping birds fit and in good condition. It is good that you see the difference in their fitness. Many can't or for some reason don't care to see it. You will figure out what they need to keep them in physically and mentally fit.