Horse had diarreah...what could cause this? **UPDATE**

[sweetshoplady]

After 2 bouts with colic, I only get T&A for hay or O&A. Coastal does not have the roughage that the other does. And Psyllium 3 times a week. I have a very sandy pasture. Everything's been fine since.

You're very fortunate that she didn't colic. Very scary to go through. I gave mineral oil to my horse when he started to colic at my vet's recommendation.

Glad she's feeling better, and that you found a good vet.

 

[Florida chick]

Unttouchable Rose I would love for you to elaborate, I have different findings.

 

[Meesh]

What I've read about bran is that it has an inverted Ca ratio, and if the ration is not balanced WRT to Ca, it can cause the body to 'steal' calcium from the bones.

There's an article specifically about rice bran on Susan Garlinghouse's site. It's more inverted in the Ca ratio than wheat bran, but the information is largely the same.

http://www.shady-acres.com/susan/ricebran.shtml

There's another article about Ca that goes into further detail & gives the ratio for wheat bran. Seems like what I've read is that it just takes some care to balance things out if you feed it.

- Michelle
(glad not to have much sand)

 

[Florida chick]

It does deplete the system if fed regularly. BUT we are talking about removing "sand" in FL there are major issues with horses ingesting too much sand, even just while grazing. BY combining the Mineral oil, Sand clear ,wheat bran and electrolytes. They bond together to the sand and draw more of it out of the intestines.
After this is done the next feeding we add electrolytes into their grain to encourage drinking.

 

[UnttouchableRose]

Quote:
Meesh said it pretty well. Ca ratio is one of the main reasons. There is also research that shows bran depletes the gut of valuable moisture and can further cause dehydration.

Mineral Oil there is nothing wrong with necessarily but really it serves no purpose feeding it with feed.

If you in an area with high sand content your best to do as has been mentioned and keep horses from injesting it and use a quality sand treatment reguarly.

Many vets will tell you bran and mineral oil, just to appease you, if you get in depth into Equine Nutrition you will find out many vets don't know diddly about it. I'm not saying all of them but many of them don't. I for one have a hospital full of vets that are totally backwards when it comes to proper nutrition.

Let me do some digging around and I will return with some proof on the bran.

I may be new to this forum. However, I am not new to the horse world, and please do not go assuming because I am new here I know nothing. I currently raise Arabians and rehabilitate rescue horses, and have spent plenty of time researching, nutrition, various health problems and reproduction. I am not going to spit invalid information out without knowing on hand from my own knowledge that it is completely valid. You know nothing about me or what I know and I don't appreciate assumptions.

Thank you for such a warm welcome!

 

[UnttouchableRose]

Quote:
So how often are you feeding this?

Does it take the place of another meal or is it seperate?

I know a lot of people do, do this but they really don't know the risk they could be taking. If I did something like that with our TB, I'd be either digging a hole or spending another 1,000 at the vet, because I am almost positive that would send her directly into a another sever colic episode.


As for giving electrolytes, if a horse is not monitored properly feeding electrolytes when they need water can further dehydrate them.

I'll be happy to elaborate on this too. I am currently going in great depth on this subject because of the above mentioned TB. Right now I am still trying to find information on what to do if electrolytes are needed but do not encourage the drinking.

I knwo that sounds different but I almost the above mare over electrolytes and a colic issue. The electrolytes dehydrated her more because she wasn't drinking enough water to 'support' them, it depleted her gut of moisture and we spent 12 hours in a severe impaction colic.

 

[UnttouchableRose]

There are very mixed opinions on the usefullness of Bran, some think it's the cure all where others think it's the worst thing ever. I personally don't find a need to use it but if someone were going to use it, it is something I would consult with a experience nutritionist on first and customize it to your horses diet slowly. If it's introduced right and fed properly really there is nothing wrong with it but just giving bran mashes can be more harmful than good.

Copying quotes for right now..


"Wheat bran has an extremely inverted calcium phosphorus ratio. As a result, it should never be fed in large quantities on a daily basis, as it is likely to trigger "bran disease"-sometimes called "big head", a condition in which the horses system leaches calcium from the bones in order to try to balance the high concentration of phosphorus being taken in."
"The result is porpous, brittle bones, and it can be irreversible".
Any sudden change is diet- such as giving a "mash" of something the horse has never had can cause digestive upset. Any change to the diet should be done over a 2-3 week period.

Wheat Bran

To start, the main two products causing all the fuss are wheat bran and rice bran. Wheat bran is more similar to the bran products humans eat for its laxative effect. However, in horses it would take at least a 50 gallon drum full of wheat bran to exert any kind of laxative effect simply due to the unique intestinal design of the horse.
However, wheat bran may improve your horse's water consumption especially when feeding it as a wet mash. Although there is no direct laxative effect from the bran, it may improve water intake, in general. Too much bran can be constipating, so should be limited to a volume equivalent to less than a one pound coffee can each day. Wheat bran is also extremely high in phosphorus so should be fed to foals and growing horses with caution as it could create dietary imbalances of calcium and phophorus ratios. On the other hand, because of its high phosphorus content, it is useful to counterbalance the high calcium component of most legume hays. Consult your veterinarian in how best to manage the mineral balances in your horse's diet.

By weight, wheat bran has 12 % less energy than oats and 25 % less energy than corn. By volume, corn has four times more energy than wheat bran, while oats has twice as much energy as wheat bran. So to use this product as an energy substitute would be false logic.

Wheat Bran
Though wheat bran is a good source of fibre, do not feed it to horses in large quantities for prolonged periods of time. It is extremely high in phosphorus and will cause potentially debilitating calcium/phosphorous imbalances. Feeding horses excessive amounts of bran can cause nutritional secondary hyperparathyroidism or Big Head syndrome. Bran is also fairly high in protein (16%). If feeding it as a supplement, limit it to no more than .45 kg (1 lb) per adult horse per day and carefully balance the calcium/phosphorus ratio with calcium supplements. Wheat bran is not recommended as a major forage substitute. Wheat bran can also contain Fusarium-related mycotoxins during wet growing years.



I am going to stop with those it should be plenty proof.

 

[Florida chick]

Its all "IF's" If you feed the horse too much, IF you feed for prolonged periods. etc
We only do the bran with the mineral oil and with the Psyllium. Its the COMBO that works. We have 15 rescue horses and I have had horses 30 years, so I am pretty confident this works without any ill effects.

 

[UnttouchableRose]

Sure it is all "if" and pretty much everything you do is a risk. Personally all I am saying is that bran would not be something I would feed sparatically, I would be consistent and proper in doing so, and I am sure I could take you 100s of others that would agree with what I am saying. It's not the bran necessarily it's the inconsistency in the diet change that is my problem with it. Everything has it's risk. That's just not one I am taking. I'm not criticizing anyone for doing it merely stating my own opinion.

 

[sweetshoplady]

I think both of you are correct. I've noticed that horsies are pretty much individuals and what's best for their optimum health varies and depends on where they live.

Thanks for a most informative and beneficial debate.

I learned a lot!