how heritable are specific traits in chickens?

[capayvalleychick]

Maybe my question should be which defects are recessive, rather than how heritable ???

All defects can be bred out??? I've heard breeders say that certain defects are easier to breed out than others.

Kim

 

[3riverschick]

Maybe my question should be which defects are recessive, rather than how heritable ???

All defects can be bred out??? I've heard breeders say that certain defects are easier to breed out than others.

Kim

sex-linking can affect how hard it is to breed out a fault. I think poultry are harder to breed than dogs because there are so many sex-linked genes and traits.
karen

 

[3riverschick]

Sometimes I think we( I know I do) get caught up in the statistics of genetics. In reality, most all severe faults can be bred out by complementery visual matings. Then the recessives left over can be bred out by test mating and inbreeding. What breed do you have?
I found Judge Card's book on the breeding laws of poultry very illuminating and refreshing. Judge Card was Danne Honour's Uncle's Uncle.
Judge Card was a renowned Judge and breeder. http://archive.org/details/cu31924003158312 Becuase of the amount of sex-linked genes, it is even more important to start with the very best in Poultry.
A bit late to start with eggs or chicks now. But in the Fall, the highly respected breeders will often have last year's breeders for sale and the very good ones they decided not to run on and overwinter. It's a great way to get started if one missed the hatching season and redeems the time for this year, putting one on track for the winter shows. Plus the stock has been graded multiple times for excellence by the breeder. That is my plan this year. My started quad arrives here in August.
Best Regards,
Karen

 

[capayvalleychick]

Both my breeds have deteriorated so much over recent years that there are no "very best". I tried finding a breeder with better stock, but there was none. Well, this is true of the Silver Gray Dorkings, which is my primary focus. There is a breeder who has recently recreated the Delaware breed and hers are superior to everything else out there. For now, I'm still trying to improve upon an old strain.

You are fortunate that you can find good stock. I'm trying to breed just to improve size & type right now. If I culled all the birds with dq's, I wouldn't have anything left, so that's not an option. I have to use birds that have defects, at this point.

I have heard that some defects are harder to get rid of than others. For instance, side sprigs & split comb... I've read to never breed birds with those or you'll never get rid of it. In my very limited experience, it does seem to be a trait that is very heritable. OTOH, I've read that brassiness can easily be bred out in a few generations. So, I've gathered from this that some defects are worse than others, and I just wanted to know which those might be.

I'm sorry to the person who started this thread, I didn't mean to hijack it. I do have an interest in how to get broodiness in my flock and increase egg production, it's just much lower priority at this stage.

Kim

 

[tadkerson]

Read these on broodiness.

http://www.ajas.info/Editor/manuscript/upload/14-248.pdf

http://ps.fass.org/content/81/7/928.full.pdf


http://ps.fass.org/content/89/3/428.full.pdf+html

http://www.biomedcentral.com/content/pdf/1471-2156-11-17.pdf




Tim

 

[3riverschick]

Both my breeds have deteriorated so much over recent years that there are no "very best". I tried finding a breeder with better stock, but there was none. Well, this is true of the Silver Gray Dorkings, which is my primary focus. There is a breeder who has recently recreated the Delaware breed and hers are superior to everything else out there. For now, I'm still trying to improve upon an old strain.

You are fortunate that you can find good stock. I'm trying to breed just to improve size & type right now. If I culled all the birds with dq's, I wouldn't have anything left, so that's not an option. I have to use birds that have defects, at this point.

I have heard that some defects are harder to get rid of than others. For instance, side sprigs & split comb... I've read to never breed birds with those or you'll never get rid of it. In my very limited experience, it does seem to be a trait that is very heritable. OTOH, I've read that brassiness can easily be bred out in a few generations. So, I've gathered from this that some defects are worse than others, and I just wanted to know which those might be.

I'm sorry to the person who started this thread, I didn't mean to hijack it. I do have an interest in how to get broodiness in my flock and increase egg production, it's just much lower priority at this stage.

Kim

Hi Kim,
Looks like you have a ral challenge in front of you. Try the Marans thread for info on comb defects. They have recently run into it in several flocks and have been talking about it a lot the ast couple of months. Lots of pics and references there, plus practical experience in dealing with it.
Re the brassiness in a white bird:
http://www.poultryconnection.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-951.html

This a quote from another site
"Plumage colors and patterns are part of this feather formation process. As a feather is formed and extruded out of the follicle it becomes a non-living yet attached tissue (as is hair). The colors and patterns of the feather are not applied to the feather but are incorporated into the structure of the feathers as it is formed. This structural inclusion of color and pattern has a major effect on what color and pattern are visually perceived....only two pigment colors are capable of being generated by their follicles - black and brown. The pigment forming cells within the follicles are of two populations, those that synthesize black pigment (eumelanin) and those that synthesize brown pigment (pheomelanin)."
I am not sure but it is not likely that color would be added to feathers from what they have eaten. I did not copy all that is written about feathers here but the portion of the comment above about the color in a feather being cells, later mentioned as capsules, is also important. all other feather colors are not actually colors in the feather but a result of refracted light due to the structure of the feathers. something like how a prism breaks light up into a rainbow. But different structures in feathers allow only certain colors back out. and that is what we see as say a green or blue feather. there is actually no green or blue in the feather. You can see this for yourself by holding one up to a light or window and viewing light that is passing through it. I will usually look brown.
Given that the only two colors that could be added to a feather are brown or black and it is unlikely that corn could change the structure of an already formed and now dead feather I am not certain it was what your birds have eaten that would cause the color. it is more likely they are colored from the outside. Maybe investigate more closely what they may have come into contact with."
Warning it is a very long article that covers a lot of ground. but it is written in a fairly easy to read style. http://www.uncleginkscave.com/GC-WhitingHackleFarms.html *or* http://tinyurl.com/6lmcpv9
It is partially written by someone that has just a bit of experience with breeding. Tom Whiting of Whiting Hackle. The leading fly tying hackle producer in the world.
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Best,
Karen