How to raise poultry with neighbors?

[K0k0shka]

The neighborhood does not count as an ecosystem.

When people mention the neighbors, you say the guineas/turkeys won't be going into the neighbors' yards but into the woods. But when people mention the woods (the local ecosystem), now you say it's not the woods but the neighborhood... So where will they be going then? If they're in people's yards, it's a problem of intrusion and bird shit on their property. And if they go into the woods, then yes the woods absolutely are a local ecosystem, where domestic birds don't belong. It's a problem either way. They belong on your property.

Also, guineas share the exact same niche as turkeys (which are found in the wild here). Tell me one thing that a guinea could possibly do to ¨destroy¨ resources. They actually get rid of invasive bugs and ticks.

Sharing the same niche as wildlife actually argues against your point, not for it. If they are in the same niche, then they are in direct competition with wildlife. Domestic birds/animals are usually larger and bolder than their wild counterparts, and push them out of an area. Animals are territorial. If a pushier animal comes into an area, it forces the local animals to leave, depriving them of the resources of that area and putting them in conflict with other animals whose territory they've now been pushed into. It's not just about the people-centric costs and benefits, like ticks. Nature is a balance act that includes a lot more than us.

Also, chickens have been free ranging in American soil for decades, ever since the first Jamestown settlement in Virginia. These ground birds share the same niche as wild turkeys so they are no problem to the vivid ecosystem of America.

The settlers aren't exactly role models to be followed. They brought all kinds of pest species with them and let them loose, they destroyed the Northeast's forests to clear land for agriculture, and caused untold damages to all kinds of American ecosystems. We should be looking to the past to learn from its mistakes, not to justify making them all over again.

 

[NatJ]

I live in a close-knit suburban neighborhood...

...guineas...I want them to get out of my yard every morning and go into the forest near my neighborhoods...

Who owns the forest? The answer can make a big difference in whether your plan will work, or whether there will be problems.

 

[Mo_fawaazzz]

Who owns the forest? The answer can make a big difference in whether your plan will work, or whether there will be problems.

It is not private property

 

[Mo_fawaazzz]

When people mention the neighbors, you say the guineas/turkeys won't be going into the neighbors' yards but into the woods. But when people mention the woods (the local ecosystem), now you say it's not the woods but the neighborhood... So where will they be going then? If they're in people's yards, it's a problem of intrusion and bird shit on their property. And if they go into the woods, then yes the woods absolutely are a local ecosystem, where domestic birds don't belong. It's a problem either way. They belong on your property.


Sharing the same niche as wildlife actually argues against your point, not for it. If they are in the same niche, then they are in direct competition with wildlife. Domestic birds/animals are usually larger and bolder than their wild counterparts, and push them out of an area. Animals are territorial. If a pushier animal comes into an area, it forces the local animals to leave, depriving them of the resources of that area and putting them in conflict with other animals whose territory they've now been pushed into. It's not just about the people-centric costs and benefits, like ticks. Nature is a balance act that includes a lot more than us.


The settlers aren't exactly role models to be followed. They brought all kinds of pest species with them and let them loose, they destroyed the Northeast's forests to clear land for agriculture, and caused untold damages to all kinds of American ecosystems. We should be looking to the past to learn from its mistakes, not to justify making them all over again.

Even my lawn is a local ecosystem. Isnt letting your chickens go killing like 500 bug species?

The U.S. is far away from being a pure ecosystem. I can assure you that two guineafowl are not gonna destroy the wild turkey population. Actually, wild turkeys know how to survive better than guineas! They would actually outcompete the guineas.

I can assure you that 2 guineas roaming about aint gonna destroy some ecosystem. Ecosystems are strong and can handle mere two guineas. If current ecosystems (especially those including eastern bluebird populations in north VA) have adapted to 3 billion invasive house sparrows, im sure that two guineas wont do much. Regarding my turkeys and ducks, they are VA species anyways. My turkeys are standard bronze heritages and my ducks are lake mallards.


If you wanna save the ecosystem then its best to stop farming entirely and let the forest grow past your backyard. Actually its better to stop living in your house! Lets get rid of all our houses (since they interfere with the ecosystem and cost a lot of trees) and live in the wild like an animal. Why dont we ALL go back to the humans' native territory in Africa because we are an invasive species disturbing the ecosystem?


I love animals and I love the ecosystem, but the ecosystem is hardy enough to handle an entire army of houses (most of our native species are still going strong and the ecosystem has not collapsed in Virginia regardless of all the new houses and cities being built). The ecosystem wont care about 2 guineafowl. Perhaps they may just feed the foxes and enrich the food chain!

 

[Mo_fawaazzz]

The settlers aren't exactly role models to be followed.

Then why raise chickens?
Why farm invasive crops?
Simple diseases from chickens and common Asian/African crops cause thousands of native animal/plant deaths. But it never ever destroys an ecosystem, because ecosystems are tolerant and hardy.

However, if you release a possible invasive species (that has no natural predators) like a snakehead fish or burmese pythons, then you have got a problems.

Guineafowl in the same habitat as wild turkeys have the same predators as wild turkeys (maybe more predators) and can easily be controlled.

 

[Mo_fawaazzz]

the birds in my area take feathers from my ducks for their nests..

My birds aint ruining the ecosystem thats for sure. You are speaking as if I am releasing 5 billion invasive emus into the fragile Virginian ecosystem... I only got 2 guineas, 4 ducks, and 4 turkeys.. I dont see what could go wrong..

 

[K0k0shka]

This isn't about your 2 guineas. This is about a mindset that a whole lot of people have, and who release a whole lot more than 2 guineas out onto land they don't own, but feel entitled to. One drop won't drown anybody, but you get enough drops and now you have an ocean. There are enough people out there who think this way that when you put them together, the damage that their collective actions lead to are quite significant. That's how collective problems work. Each one of us individually won't wreck the world, but there's a lot of us and when you add us all together, a lot of small individual actions add up to a lot of damage.

 

[LRH97]

I think the bottom line really is that no one has the right to assume everyone will be fine with domestic animals running about the neighborhood unchecked. It presents a whole host of problems. Animosity with neighbors, messing with wildlife, and the biggest problem IMO: a disservice to the animals themselves. Fact of the matter is, the guineas will not last unprotected. Very possible the turkeys won't either. You should not raise domestic species to feed the wildlife. Why you'd even want to with feed prices the way they are, I don't know.

I don't appreciate my neighbor's dog coming over to my property because my dogs hate him for one thing, and I know he's a bird chaser. I expect him to keep him on his property. On the same token, I keep my birds on my property. It's just responsible ownership and courtesy.

 

[Mo_fawaazzz]

This isn't about your 2 guineas. This is about a mindset that a whole lot of people have, and who release a whole lot more than 2 guineas out onto land they don't own, but feel entitled to. One drop won't drown anybody, but you get enough drops and now you have an ocean. There are enough people out there who think this way that when you put them together, the damage that their collective actions lead to are quite significant. That's how collective problems work. Each one of us individually won't wreck the world, but there's a lot of us and when you add us all together, a lot of small individual actions add up to a lot of damage.

I would not agree to releasing an army of chickens into the wild. Maximum ig would be 10 turkeys or maybe 5 guineas, but no more than that.

 

[Logar]

it doesn’t matter whether it is your neighbor’s property or public land, your animals don’t belong there. They only belong on your property.

And just because there are only 2 guineas doesn’t mean anything. 10 guineas can do a lot more damage that 100 Burmese pythons.

How will you feel when they go a bit too far and only one returns? what if one of your neighbors uses pesticides or some other chemical and they eat something with the chemicals on it? What happens if they go too far and a hunter sees them? What about if they come across a road? Heck, I wouldn’t even risk it with your turkeys.

While no one can stop you, it is your responsibility to keep your animals safe and contained from being a nuisance.