How to send your farmer to jail Update on Tester Amendment Post 239

[Katy]

Quote:
I can guarentee that had the option of eating grain been available to cattle back in the day, they would have chosen a field of grain to graze and eat in over grass anyday of the week. You obviously have never had the "privilage" of trying to get a bunch of cows out of a milo or corn field when they found a hole in the fence. I hate to break it to you but they like grain!!!

Just like kids eating candy. Doesn't mean it is good for them in huge quantity over the long haul.

Cattle are no different than we are....different food sources in moderation for a healthy body.

I have to say I agree with seedcorn in that any grass fed beef I've ever had (both our own steer and another producer's) was pretty tough and not that good. We tried it one time and decided we'd wasted a whole animal. I too will take my nice tender grain-fed steak.

 

[dianneS]

This bill could outlaw the backyard garden as well! You could go to jail for growing tomatoes in a pot on your back porch! That is ridiculous!

 

[mame1616]

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Thanks. I do take into consideration who is giving me the info, as well. No one is going to make their side look bad, so they all put a bit of a spin on it. I have seen a lot of apples vs. oranges from both sides.

 

[noodleroo]

If you are not familiar with following legislation through the process, it can be very confusing. This bill is particularly confusing. But a quick look at what organizations favor or oppose this bill SHOUTS volumes of information.

 

[Dunkopf]

Some organizations and web sites appear to be doing one thing, when in fact they are actually supporting stuff for an entirely different reason. This bill is very unpopular with large producers that have a lot of money. Just because farmer Joe is on the front purporting to be a pro small farm guy doesn't mean that's what he's doing. Media is a very useful tool for everybody. Those with a lot of money use it to it's fullest extent.

 

[seedcorn]

1) How people eat, life styles is their choice (no one is forcing them to eat (both healthy and unhealthy)) decides their life span along w/genetics.

2) USA ag will grow whatever the consumer will buy. It's just that the consumer doesn't get to name his price.

3) My comment on sauces was "tongue in cheek" altho original sauces were developed to "cover up" the flavor of the main course. In defense good beef needs no sauces & I eat way too many sauces.

4) Each generation has it's own taste buds. I LOVE butter but people raised on margarine prefer it. Making butter cheaper for me..............so give me corn fed beef over grass fed. Small sampling but company I work for has French in their management, they LOVE our beef over France's grass fed.

5) As the world pop grows, 2 things will happen, we will consume less meat and we'll have to produce the greatest amount of food we can until (#2) someone starts another war to "thin" the pop. For us it'll be the poor dieing as the rich or those in power will never put their family members at risk.

6) On this bill, it's normal lawyer speak as no one in this thread can agree what it says. As long as our politicians can keep us stirred up over things that will never happen, they can continue to rape the country to pad their pockets (special interest groups sell more mags, articles, thus they love it as well).

 

[Dunkopf]

Quote:
Yep, I've never eaten grass fed beef though. So I have no opinion on that.

 

[booker81]

I took off to the land of minimal internet (aka only the cell phone), so I'm going to come back around....


First off, my "local" CAFOs are exactly that - licensed CAFO's. Concentrated Animal Feeding Operations. These in particular are dairies, however, looking through the licenses, one I forgot was the State Univeristy, which operates as a mixed CAFO (I've personally set foot in the dairy, sheep and swine units, however have not been to the chicken units).

The "big" crop farmer around here does mainly crops, but also had a very large herd of Black Angus, which he uses on field rotation and sells for a pretty penny for those "Certified Black Angus" packs of meat you see.

The CAFO folks also crop farm, as a way to increase their marginal profit - like any good farmer, they rotate crops - corn, soy and winter wheat are the best growers for this climate. Some of them grow hay as well. This climate usually runs about 3 to 4 cuttings, and irrigation is not generally necessary here.

I'd like to link one of the dairies near here, with 6500 acres, and 9500 cattle. It definately is a CAFO, by every definition.

http://www.greenmeadowfarms.com

If you look through, (and if you're in mid-MI, check them out, they offer guided and unguided tours), you don't see abuse, nastiness, horribleness. That's not the way to make money. That's not the way you get a world record milker. That's not how you drive a community either. This particular farm sells for very cheap, or donates, calves to 4H students to raise. They work with the university to try new methods for safer and better animal and waste management. They are active in the community. However, they will be tied under the label as "commercial", "factory" and "CAFO". While the big picture painted is gruesome and gross, when you get down to the bottom of it, most of these operations are family businesses. This area is "Big Ag", if you go by quantity, but each and every person who is at the base of the farms here, CAFOs and non alike, are almost ALL started as family farms. As demand grew, so did they, and that's how you end up with a Green Meadows with 9500 head. They didn't drive anyone out, nor have the folks I grew up with. They just took the reins from their parents and their parents parents. Land was cheap years and years ago, and the folks who tamed it are the forefathers of the folks today who manage it.

Just like the "big" granary here - which is "owned" by ADM, but is operated by local folks (including my brother at one point in his life.) ADM does work with Monsanto. Both are "Big Ag". However, very few folks would have to money or resources to process the mass quantity of grains this area produces. There are small mills around here as well that do a good business, but they are in business to process grains for livestock and personal use, not the grains that are necessary to feed the world. Harvest time here is big time. Most of the traffic on the road at that time isn't Chevy, Ford or Dodge, it's International, Case, Kubota, New Holland and John Deere.

While I suppose on an ethics level it would be nice to cut out ADM and Monsanto, realistically it would completely and utterly destroy so many people, not just to the folks I know, but even the end consumer, who would be without the millions of tons of soy, wheat, oats and corn that make the world go round. Heck, even sitting here indulging in a few sticks of my rare treat, Twizzlers, incorporate corn, wheat and soy.

If one doesn't care for a company's practices, it's right to say so. It's right to use your pocketbook to vote for your choices. Why else do you think the one farm near me chose to go the grass fed "Certified Black Angus" route? I personally don't think it's superior meat in flavor or quality, but then, I prefer wild venison

The drive for grass fed and specifically the marketing for "Certified Black Angus" made a niche he could fill, and he did.

Farmers wanted a crop that could thrive at the same time they suppressed weeds, and RoundUp Ready was created. It was a niche that was filled. Now, maybe it wasn't such a hot idea. DDT was a hot idea back in the 50's and 60's, it filled a niche, until it wasn't such a great idea (though it is still produced and used in various areas of the world.) Sometimes we are quick to jump on a bandwagon, until we find out it's not the best made deal, but rather than toss it and find something else, we should evaluate what is going on with an open mind and see what failure and progress has been made. Tossing ADM, Monsanto, Tyson, CAFOs etc to the side and shutting them down isn't a wise move, but neither is closing down all home based egg sellers, jam makers, single cow owners, and other small scale food producers. There is a happy medium to find, one that involves safe food, humane practices and environmental care. Without ADM, Tyson, Monsanto, and the like, we'd have a lot of silos filled with molding grains, a lot of bankrupt people, and a lot of starving people. If you don't care for their practices, then continue to support folks who don't use a middleman like those companies, but remember not everyone in the world may have such a choice, and their dollars will continue to go that way, and it's ok. You can spend your dollars how you wish, and I can spend mine.

Most of all, contact your congress folks and let them know you wish to keep your choice and ability to choose your food. I've only glanced at the summary of the bill, and fail to understand it's furor. I have no intention of "adulterating" or "misbranding" any of my food, and I would hope the places I purchase it from would kindly refrain from the same. I would rather Michigan get rid of it's ridiculous laws about the sale of homemade jam

(This post was written with multiple interruptions over a few hours, sorry for the randomness!)

 

[kstaven]

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You can talk about it. The only problem is that it makes some feel they need to defend their way as the only way to feed a nation. People often have an issue with accepting multiple options that are not the ones they chose to follow.

I don't think I've ever said that my way is the only way......generally speaking I think if a person would go back and read every thread that has dealt with this topic, as a rule the "back to the earth" movement is the "side" that basically always says to the other that you are totally wrong and that their way is the only way. That attitude in itself makes those of us who farm the way we do defensive. I'm sure if we farmers came on here continually slamming their profession and lifestyle they'd be defensive too. I'm all for feeding our families and other people healthy......I'm just not convinced that their way has to be the only way to do it. Not every person in this country has the means nor the inclination to grow their own food or even seek out locally grown food. I do think a person can eat healthy no matter which avenue they decide to follow. Until each country on the face of this planet can feed themselves there will continue to be the market for the food we produce.

I often wonder just what their experience with agriculture is....is it only what they've read or seen in some very slanted viewpoint documentary....have they actually ever been in involved in farming?

As my first post indicated I pointed out both sides have the extreme elements.

For the most part, you find the masses have no clue as to what it takes to produce food of any sort, and do not want to know as long as it is conveniently available and nicely packaged at the local grocer. Society has moved a long way from their rural roots on the past few generations.

 

[kstaven]

Quote:
And they also live longer than North Americans. Funny how that works.

As to the 6 + billion people. The harsh reality is that we as a species are overpopulated, and the numbers double every 40 - 45 years. Whether natural or manmade the human race will hit the point of a major die off and then we will not have to worry about not having the land mass to do things in a less destructive manner.

I take it you're referring to the Asians living longer than the North Americans? The US is a nation of over-weight people with all the ills that come along with obesity, but I think rather than blaming it on the people who grow the food, I personally would blame it on the manufacturers who turn the healthy product we grow into junk food. People want quick and easy when it comes to feeding their family. I have a member of my family that I have tried to convince for years to quit buying the over processed products that she buys to feed her kids and to start cooking more from scratch.....but she's not interested in doing that.....says she's too busy to cook.

Unfortunately that's how it is in a lot of families.

Is eating less processed foods not a more natural for us? Guess I wasn't clear.