How to stop ascites fluid drip after draining? Anything that can be applied to the site safely?

[Cinnaminute]

Hi, in my experience with ascites (an EE hen named Cleo, who lasted a little over a year after she first filled up with fluid), when poking them (18 gauge needle) and letting them drain on their own, they almost always end up leaking all of the fluid out over the course of just 6-24 hours. That always made my hen get very sick (shock I assume). She'd stop eating, comb would turn purplish and fall over, and she'd be miserable for 3-7 days before getting over it. I only had to drain her in the summer months, between May and August, so it was worth it for her to have a happy time during fall, winter, and spring.

She passed away this July after a draining and I haven't forgiven myself for it (more info below). I have another hen, an RIR named Marcy, who started getting ascites this year. I want to avoid her going into shock since it looks like I'll have to drain her (this is the 3rd time she's filled and the worst - her comb is falling over and purplish, she's barely walking). Which is why I'm asking about something I can put on her to stop the drip once she's relieved of some of the fluid. Thanks for any help!

P.S. I'm going to try an epsom salt bath prior to draining. I also have access to meloxicam (1.5mg/ml), prescribed to my ferret for his spine injury. I've got more than enough so I can always offer some to Marcy to help with any pain, if you all think it's worth it. Otherwise I have aspirin on hand too.

--Extra Info--

Cleo passed after the 6th-ish time she had to be drained (drained June 24th and passed away July 6th). She was 3 years old. I regret that draining. She was so swollen it looked like she could barely poop, there was tons of pressure on her vent. She had to stand sideways just to scratch at the ground. But she was active, eating, happy, foraging. I feel I should've let her be and died on her own, if she was going to. Instead, she leaked all the fluid out, was icky for 7 days, and didn't bounce back. She lost weight and was already too skinny. Then she couldn't stand. I force fed her and she perked up enough to eat on her own. Comb was proper red and standing up again. She could manage to stand to poop and then lay back down. I thought she was coming around. But the next day she only slept. Stopped pooping entirely. She was dying and I had to let her go. I feel I stripped her of her last happy days and it's haunted me ever since...

Marcy started getting ascites this year after going on a random soft-shelling spree that no amount of calcium helped with. The last thing she laid was a plain full yellow yolk all by itself with maybe a little white. She swelled up twice already (this is the third time). I've refused to drain her due to my bad experience. I've kept her on milk thistle nearly daily. She just molted (her first molt despite the fact that she turns 3 years old in February) and looks gorgeous. She eats great, good weight on her. But she's become absolutely miserable the past few days. Comb is purplish and falling over. She won't forage or walk around. Just stands there or lays there in her hiding spot. She ate just last night, but her crop is full this morning (though she did have food available so she might've eaten some more this morning). She's pooping, but has it stuck on her feathers, likely do to being unable to position herself properly to poop. I don't see her at risk of dying soon (minus the ascites buildup) and draining her seems worthwhile to give her relief. I'm scared to do so, but I'm going to since her comfort matters more than whatever trauma I have. But I want to avoid the worst case scenario if possible.

 

[nuthatched]

Unfortunately, it sounds like she's dying already and suffering as well.
I'm sorry, I'd recommend you put her down.

It's odd that you're having this problem repeatedly, are these production breeds? What's their diet?

 

[Cinnaminute]

She's my 2nd hen out of 21 chickens I've had, so it's still very new for me. All of my chickens are her age and older. First was an Easter Egger who slept with my other EEs in their own coop. And this girl is an RIR who sleeps in another separate coop with my sussex and leghorns. They eat only Purina Flock Raiser for their diet. Though they do free range for 6+ hours, so they get some other tidbits from that. I offer a random hard boiled egg at times, mainly to get them all back into their runs early if I need them to. Summer months, when it's gotten over 100F, I'll let them have cold watermelon to keep them hydrated. Deworm 4 times a year (and do Corid treatment then too).

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Try Aloe Detox, @coach723 gives instructions in the link below.

Milk Thistle may help a little since it does have some mild diuretic properties and can offer some Liver and Kidney support.

Ascites (aka Water Belly) is a symptom. What's causing the fluid to accumulate? It's hard to know. It may be reproductive and/or organ dysfunction, these 2 "categories" covers a wide variety of conditions, so unless you have a necropsy performed, its just a guess as to what is causing the fluid to accumulate.

It's a very good idea to hydrate the hen very well before and after draining. I understand that sounds counterintuitive but it can help reduce the stress of draining and hopefully they don't go into shock and can bounce back easier. Give electrolytes before and after draining, see if that makes a difference.

I'm sorry you had a bad experience. Draining a hen 6 times over a period of time, that's a lot of fluid continuing to accumulate. Unfortunately, when they start having symptoms of Fluid (Ascites), draining is not a cure, but a supportive care measure to bring relief for a period of time, the underlying condition (cause) still exists and usually continues to worsen in time, which in turn causes a drastic decline no matter what treatment(s) are administered.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...ove-now-laid-egg.1446105/page-4#post-24045478

 

[Cinnaminute]

@Wyorp Rock Thank you for wonderful info. I've never happened across the aloe detox, so I'll be sure to read up on that.

Yeah, even with my first one, I did understand I was only putting off the inevitable. I do think I should've let her be that last time, but I also know she was going to be gone soon anyway.

Both hens have shown signs of reproductive issues prior to the onset of ascites. I figure the best I can do is help them live their best lives as comfortably as possible until that's no longer an option. On that note, I went ahead and drained Marcy earlier this afternoon. She hadn't pooped for at least 5 hours and her crop was still full from the late night/early morning meal she ate (and she had no appetite anymore besides a nibble on a hard boiled egg). She also refused to drink at all. She didn't have water overnight and didn't touch any all day. So draining felt like the right course of action. I gave her .15mg/ml of Meloxicam prior. Since the draining she pooped twice. Ate some hard boiled egg. And drank a ton. Which, as you stated, hydration is important. My other hen would drink a ton too. I did forget to add the electrolytes, so thanks for reminding me of that!

Frustratingly, she dripped out everything over the past 6 hours. So here's hoping she can pull through and have a good rest of the year. And I can try out the aloe detox. I've had little to no luck with dandelion tea. Thanks again

 

[Wyorp Rock]

@Wyorp Rock Thank you for wonderful info. I've never happened across the aloe detox, so I'll be sure to read up on that.

Yeah, even with my first one, I did understand I was only putting off the inevitable. I do think I should've let her be that last time, but I also know she was going to be gone soon anyway.

Both hens have shown signs of reproductive issues prior to the onset of ascites. I figure the best I can do is help them live their best lives as comfortably as possible until that's no longer an option. On that note, I went ahead and drained Marcy earlier this afternoon. She hadn't pooped for at least 5 hours and her crop was still full from the late night/early morning meal she ate (and she had no appetite anymore besides a nibble on a hard boiled egg). She also refused to drink at all. She didn't have water overnight and didn't touch any all day. So draining felt like the right course of action. I gave her .15mg/ml of Meloxicam prior. Since the draining she pooped twice. Ate some hard boiled egg. And drank a ton. Which, as you stated, hydration is important. My other hen would drink a ton too. I did forget to add the electrolytes, so thanks for reminding me of that!

Frustratingly, she dripped out everything over the past 6 hours. So here's hoping she can pull through and have a good rest of the year. And I can try out the aloe detox. I've had little to no luck with dandelion tea. Thanks again

Hopefully she'll bounce back some, it's good that she's drinking now.

The poor girl, it sounds like she did need draining if she wasn't pooping and crop was very slow. The fluid build up can make it difficult for the body to function properly (as you know), so this is a good start to see her eliminating now.

Some folks have used Dandelion Tea and found it helpful, others have not. I think often we have to try a few things to figure out what works best or change things up if needed.

Coach has written/posted about the Detox numerous times, so if you search for "Detox" along with her username here on BYC you'll find quite a bit of info.

I hope Marcy feels better soon, keep us posted.