I have lots of questions about mites

[BesideStillWaters]

Hope the next treatment works!

Me too! Managed to get it on him again. We used a pump spray and soaked him pretty well.

The first treatment hardly did a thing for our rooster. Subsequent spritzes and dustings worked, but mites would inevitably pop up again in force 4-5 days later, and I'd treat him again. That's why I sucked it up and dipped. I know that's your last resort, but if these bugs keep driving you crazy, know that it's an option that may not be as bad as you think.

Oohhh I see. If we have to dip, I'll let you know - we're going to try another time of spraying and how it works.

It would still be better if lice people would weigh in here. If I were you, I'd search this site (using that search button at the top right) for the term "lice" and tag active members who seem to know lice. That could get more eyes on your questions.

Yeah, I'll try it - the few people I had found so far were on old threads and the people hadn't been active for years.

Ah, gotcha. Then yeah, could be those bugs who clean up gross stuff. Did you treat the roosts and coop with Permethrin as well?

Yes, we did. We mixed it stronger for the roosts / house walls. We didn't treat their run though. Now I'm thinking we may need to...

I will say that once mites hit, I started keeping an even cleaner coop to make it easier to de-bug the coop any time a mite popped up.

I plan to do the same! Ugh, so much poo. The good news is, the garden liked it.

That's a bunch of roosters! I love them, too. Wish they weren't so complicated. Do you have a bachelor situation for them or just a ton of hens, and they're all getting along?

Yes, bachelor situation, except for one. We had too many roosters; I was new to this, and most of the ladies have a LOT of feather damage because of my mistake of having too many roosters with them, and then the rooster I picked to say with them was way too aggressive with the ladies. I sold three roosters, but the other three I kinda turned into pets and couldn't bear selling them, so I separated them from the girls until the feather grow back. And then I'll pick one to be with them. This is Avi a couple of months ago; she has some down growing back in now and doesn't look as bare, but the lice thing is NOT helping matters:

Haha, definitely feed your roosters! I meant many adult feeds are for layers and supposedly provide too much calcium to roosters long term. If you want to feed a non-layer, you have to look for the elusive "flock maintainer" or "all flock" type feed, or just feed a starter/grower with the nutrition profile you're looking for. And of course offer a good calcium source, like oyster shell, on the side for laying ladies.

Oh, I do! ...probably too much. They are big and fat. I can feed them nonlayer easily because they aren't with the ladies.

x2 on my earlier suggestion to search the site and tag others so your questions get more exposure.

Will do! I'll try to do this later tonight because I'm heading outside now to supervise them while they free-range the front yard.

In my experience, I wouldn't be worried about full integration until more like 3 months. At 2 months, I'm doing like you--letting them live in an adjacent space to get acquainted.

The reason I want to do it earlier than I did last time is because at 3 months, the new ones wouldn't get used to my blind hen, Amber. They would beat her mercilessly until she was bleeding. I was hoping if they are introduced younger, they won't do that.

But if their house is very close to the others, they may already have the lice, so then it becomes a question of what's the safest pesticide for very young chicks. Keep researching!!

Currently, one hen, Banshee (who just healed from an injury) is in a cage right next to the large cage the chicks are in. I didn't see any lice on her - treated her anyway because I free-range her in the front yard with the others - but I see nothing on the chicks. Yet. Banshee has been healed for a while, but I didn't want to put her back in with her sisters until the lice thing is resolved since she seemed to be clear. No feather loss / no feathers chewed on, her back isn't inflamed like her sisters were. I'm hoping for the best.

 

[BesideStillWaters]

Side note that there's another thread about protein and mixing feed going on right now that you might like: https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/question-about-protein.1471604/

Oh, thanks! I'll check that out!

 

[BesideStillWaters]

x2 on my earlier suggestion to search the site and tag others so your questions get more exposure.

Okay, here we go:

@Mamatomany123 @Sablehaven @CluckerFamily @casportpony @cmom @Isaac 0 @Winter Creek Coop

 

[HiEverybirdy]

Yes, bachelor situation, except for one. We had too many roosters; I was new to this, and most of the ladies have a LOT of feather damage because of my mistake of having too many roosters with them, and then the rooster I picked to say with them was way too aggressive with the ladies. I sold three roosters, but the other three I kinda turned into pets and couldn't bear selling them, so I separated them from the girls until the feather grow back. And then I'll pick one to be with them. This is Avi a couple of months ago; she has some down growing back in now and doesn't look as bare, but the lice thing is NOT helping matters:

Same. Not adjusting our rooster situation in a timely way was my biggest mistake in year 1 with chickens. Some roosters aren't good at roostering.

I actually think, in our case, removing the overbearing rooster helped us overcome mites, as the flock is now under less stress (translating to stronger immune systems) and have agency to dustbathe whenever they want without worrying about the rooster pushing them around. Sigh, roosters.

Since you have a clearer look at some of their backs, have you been able to see bugs/eggs congregating around the base of their feathers?

The reason I want to do it earlier than I did last time is because at 3 months, the new ones wouldn't get used to my blind hen, Amber. They would beat her mercilessly until she was bleeding. I was hoping if they are introduced younger, they won't do that.

That makes sense.

At the end of the day, the new chickens might get the [suspected] lice at some point. I know with mites, it's not "if" but "when" will they'll show up again. In my experience, if you can get the big infestation under control, and the flock has good nutrition, clean coops, and a strong dustbathing game, future appearances are much easier to deal with.

Currently, one hen, Banshee (who just healed from an injury) is in a cage right next to the large cage the chicks are in. I didn't see any lice on her - treated her anyway because I free-range her in the front yard with the others - but I see nothing on the chicks. Yet. Banshee has been healed for a while, but I didn't want to put her back in with her sisters until the lice thing is resolved since she seemed to be clear. No feather loss / no feathers chewed on, her back isn't inflamed like her sisters were. I'm hoping for the best.

Ranging together might not be much of a concern. When it comes to integrating birds, supervised ranging could be a good way to work on it, but don't have them roost together at night until you're satisfied you've slayed the bugs.

With mites at least, the coop is where problems bubble over. Our flock opts to roost in 2 separate coops (they split up by brown layers and colored layers each night). When mites show up, it's almost always among the brown layers. Since most of the colored layers dislike being handled, and I tend to catch mites right away, I've taken to only treating the brown layers directly, and then refreshing nesting material and treating roosts in both coops. I haven't seen a mite on a colored layer or their coop since last year.

It's also possible they're a more mite-resistant kind of bird, if that's possible. They're Easter Eggers and have been hardy. Anywho, when it comes to external parasites, ranging together is less dicey than roosting together, I do believe.

 

[Zackknoll]

I've been reading different threads and different articles on mites and some opinions seem to conflict, so I was hoping to get some clarification on a few things.

What I'm dealing with:

I had one chicken, Banshee, that had an injury and was bullied when I tried to reintroduce her to the flock a week later. I had chicks in our bathroom that I raised and they were way too big for the little cage, so I moved the chicks into the large cage and moved Banshee into the small cage in the bathroom. I was horrified to see mites in the bedding a few days later. Found it it was in the feed. I took her and the cage outside, cleaned everything I could (some mites on the floor but thankfully it wasn't any worse than that) and sprinkled seven dust on the floor where the cage was for good measure, in case I missed a few when sweeping and cleaning.

Fast forward another few days, and the flock starts shaking their heads a LOT and I thought those killer buffalo gnats were bothering them again, so I sprayed them with vanilla. This time, it didn't help. I didn't see any signs of mites around the vent, so I was so confused. (I couldn't check every chicken though, because most don't appreciate me picking them up and looking at their backsides. ) But when I picked up one of my roosters, Bae, and got VERY close to his face, I could see tiny glimmers of something shining off his face. I think they may be Northern Fowl Mites. My friend found this article: https://www.hobbyfarms.com/parasite...AjthSDHo8HwyOCGmNIX1kfMybtXbbNv1D9OJICx1_ZrtQ However, they aren't red, they are more grayish white looking to me, so I'm wondering if they are juvenile mites...? Whatever they are, I want them off the chickens, obviously.

The questions:

If these are Northern Fowl mites, what are the odds some of those got loose in the bathroom while Banshee was in there? I also brought Banshee into the master bedroom (carpeted room) when I first brought her inside to show my bed-ridden dad my beautiful girl - what are the odds any dropped off Banshee and onto the carpet in there? I seven dusted the carpet after bringing Banshee in just to be safe, now I'm glad I did, but I'm still a nervous wreck.

Some people say chicken mites don't go for humans, and others say that's a myth. This is one place that says they WILL bite humans but are unable to complete their life cycle. (I'm assuming this means they are not able to reproduce?) https://dermnetnz.org/topics/bird-m...AjthSDHo8HwyOCGmNIX1kfMybtXbbNv1D9OJICx1_ZrtQ
"Although they may feed on human blood, bird mites are not able to complete their life cycle on humans and they do not burrow beneath the skin." (So on chickens they burrow beneath the skin?! Wha?)
However, I found someone linked to this and it says it has been known to feed on humans. http://entnemdept.ufl.edu/creatures/livestock/poultry/chicken_mite.htm So does this mean they will feed on humans but cannot reproduce? This is very confusing.

If I handle the chickens, will these mites get on me, and if they do, will simply showing get them off? I don't want to spread the mites to our house or other chickens. However, when I discovered the grain mites, I moved Banshee's small cage and put it on top of the large cage (with cardboard between the layers to prevent Banshee from pooping on the chicks). I have a feeling it may be too late and the damage is done at this point.

Looks like some people prefer seven dust and others prefer permethrin to get rid of these things on the birds themselves. I have one rooster that we bought last year that I can't catch. If I mix up some DE and seven dust to add to the dust bathing area and let him dust himself, will that take care of any mites on him? (Otherwise I don't know how I can get rid of the mites on him if he has any.) The one thing that seems fairly consistent is that DE is useless to kill but might be used as a preventative. Since it rained and the ground is wet, I wanted to offer DE and seven dust in the place of the dirt. (I'm also looking into ordering some permethrin dust, but it will take a few days to ship. Wanted to try something in the meantime.)

If I have any other questions, I'll add them here later, but I think this is a pretty good start. I know the first thing I need to do is clean out the chicken house and cover everything in permethrin, so I'm going to do that shortly. Any advice is welcome!

Showering will get them off. But I had them get into blankets and furniture.

 

[BesideStillWaters]

Same. Not adjusting our rooster situation in a timely way was my biggest mistake in year 1 with chickens. Some roosters aren't good at roostering.

Yeah, some definitely aren't. The one I sold terrorized my hens just for fun it seemed like. The three I kept don't do that intentionally, but they will hurt the hens solely because the feather loss means their feet are on the skin and that may be how Banshee got injured.

I actually think, in our case, removing the overbearing rooster helped us overcome mites, as the flock is now under less stress (translating to stronger immune systems) and have agency to dustbathe whenever they want without worrying about the rooster pushing them around. Sigh, roosters.

That makes sense.

Since you have a clearer look at some of their backs, have you been able to see bugs/eggs congregating around the base of their feathers?

I have looked and I see none. The main ones I'm seeing these things on are the one rooster and his two hens. We got them off the two hens but Wild Thang keeps giving them back to them. I don't see any signs of eggs, just the bugs. I have the permethrin powder now, so I may try that before I consider... dipping...

But Amber, my blind hen, keeps shaking her head and itching her face even though I don't see any signs of mites anymore. I'm not sure what is going on, if she still has them and I'm missing them or what...

At the end of the day, the new chickens might get the [suspected] lice at some point. I know with mites, it's not "if" but "when" will they'll show up again. In my experience, if you can get the big infestation under control, and the flock has good nutrition, clean coops, and a strong dustbathing game, future appearances are much easier to deal with.

That's a relief! At the moment, I want to make sure these things stay off the chicks until I can sell the roosters of the bunch. Don't want to accidentally sell someone a mite / lice infested bird.

Ranging together might not be much of a concern. When it comes to integrating birds, supervised ranging could be a good way to work on it, but don't have them roost together at night until you're satisfied you've slayed the bugs.

Will do! These babies need to be introduced soon. Their cage is way too small.

With mites at least, the coop is where problems bubble over. Our flock opts to roost in 2 separate coops (they split up by brown layers and colored layers each night). When mites show up, it's almost always among the brown layers. Since most of the colored layers dislike being handled, and I tend to catch mites right away, I've taken to only treating the brown layers directly, and then refreshing nesting material and treating roosts in both coops. I haven't seen a mite on a colored layer or their coop since last year.

That's great!

It's also possible they're a more mite-resistant kind of bird, if that's possible. They're Easter Eggers and have been hardy. Anywho, when it comes to external parasites, ranging together is less dicey than roosting together, I do believe.

Oohhh. I wanted Easter Eggers but that's the first bird the pet shop sold out of, haha.

Showering will get them off. But I had them get into blankets and furniture.

Eww! How did you get them out of the blankets and furniture? I've been changing clothes before I sit on furniture as a precaution. Now I'm glad I've been doing that.

 

[HiEverybirdy]

That's weird you aren't seeing the bugs or their eggs on feather shafts or skin. That yellow bug on your arm sure looks like pictures of poultry lice. But again, while I've dealt with mites, I haven't seen lice in person.

There are so many things that can affect chickens, and the more you learn, the more you realize you don't know! I guarantee someone out there has gone through this exact thing. Hopefully your treatments will work for whatever's "bugging" your flock, and at some point more people will find your post and weigh in, or be helped by it

If you're selling the boys as pets instead of meat, you can drop a tiny bit of Ivermectin on the necks of grown birds. It's off-label, so you'll want to do research to decide if it's right for you and nail down the correct dosage, but Ivermectin can be super helpful if not overused (using too frequently can apparently create resistance). Here's a good blog post about it:
https://bitchinchickens.com/2019/04/29/ivermectin-for-parasite-control/comment-page-1/

Is Amber still shaking her head? Is she calm enough you can get a really close look at her face or even in her ears? Could her eyes be bothering her?

Sometimes it's just a habit. We have a couple who went through head-flicking stages as their face feathers grew in at 5 or 6 weeks, and sometimes I still see them doing it, maybe out of excitement, but they're perfectly healthy otherwise, not accompanied by other symptoms. But if it's a new habit, that's a little strange.

 

[BesideStillWaters]

That's weird you aren't seeing the bugs or their eggs on feather shafts or skin. That yellow bug on your arm sure looks like pictures of poultry lice. But again, while I've dealt with mites, I haven't seen lice in person.

I agree, I'm confused too.

There are so many things that can affect chickens, and the more you learn, the more you realize you don't know! I guarantee someone out there has gone through this exact thing. Hopefully your treatments will work for whatever's "bugging" your flock, and at some point more people will find your post and weigh in, or be helped by it

I reached my hand into the nest to check for eggs, and got my hands and arm covered in whatever they are. Some were bigger and whiter, and some were almost so small I didn't see them. I hope they weren't on my hands when I was feeding my chicks. I usually scrub my arms but I didn't see any lice so I didn't bother. I didn't notice them until my arm started to itch and I really REALLY looked because they were that small. I'm afraid I exposed them to whatever these things are.

If they are still mite / lice free, I'm seriously contemplating selling most of the chicks at this point, because I'm not even able to care for the 12 I already had. When we spray, I don't see any bugs for a week, and then they come back in force. I'm extremely discouraged. I didn't want to have to buy the Elector PSP. I have an amazon account but no credit card attached to it, so I can't buy anything. (I download free ebooks for Kindle with it.) I was just at Tractor Supply yesterday and I'm kicking myself that I didn't look for GardStar Garden and Poultry Dust, but I had a massive headache and I wasn't thinking straight.

If you're selling the boys as pets instead of meat, you can drop a tiny bit of Ivermectin on the necks of grown birds. It's off-label, so you'll want to do research to decide if it's right for you and nail down the correct dosage, but Ivermectin can be super helpful if not overused (using too frequently can apparently create resistance). Here's a good blog post about it:
https://bitchinchickens.com/2019/04/29/ivermectin-for-parasite-control/comment-page-1/

Thanks, I may consider it for a few of my pet roosters, but I do intend to sell some eggs (that's why I hatched out the last batch of chicks). I don't know what the people who will buy the roosters are going to do with them. I hope they will be pets, but I sell them to the pet store, and I don't know who gets them from there.

Is Amber still shaking her head? Is she calm enough you can get a really close look at her face or even in her ears? Could her eyes be bothering her?
Sometimes it's just a habit. We have a couple who went through head-flicking stages as their face feathers grew in at 5 or 6 weeks, and sometimes I still see them doing it, maybe out of excitement, but they're perfectly healthy otherwise, not accompanied by other symptoms. But if it's a new habit, that's a little strange.

Yes, she is. She's not one of the chicks; she's four years old, I believe. A friend gave her to me. She started doing this only this year. Yes, she is very calm, I've tried taking macro shots of her face looking for mites or lice, but she shakes her head too much and the photos blur. We are going to treat her again today anyway.

Also, my boys are still shaking their heads. Bae especially. He's a total sweetheart, so I also got macros of his face. His head shaking isn't as bad, so the shots came out clear.

 

[BesideStillWaters]

I've only ever had to dip one bird, the one with the worst mites, our big rooster. That was before I learned about Ivermectin and after trying liquid Permethrin and poultry dust for a month and seeing mites return weekly. I was at wit's end, so invested in the wildly expensive Elector PSP, mixed the recommended dose with warm water in a storage bin, and he LOVED it. You've never seen such a proud, wet chicken. It was obvious he felt immediately better.

The others got spritzed on vents and under their wings, and I sprayed down the roosts and all the crannies around the coops. Repeated the process in 2 weeks (except just spritzed the rooster instead of dipping him again). We were mite free for a couple months. Recurrences have been far smaller than mite-splosion. Of course, I also catch them more quickly because I know what to look for now.

Do you have any advice on how to dip a chicken? Do you hold their wings down or let them splash it everywhere? Their feathers, especially wings and back, seem to be kinda waterproof, so how do you get the liquid to stick long enough to do any good?

 

[BesideStillWaters]

I managed to get photos, and unexpectedly, Wild Thang (the boy I couldn't catch) is fine with the camera. Just no touching him. So I have photos of him. It's bad. There are more than I first thought.

View attachment 2683995

View attachment 2683998

The best I can see in the vent area:

View attachment 2684008

In the center of this photo is some bug that gt on m when cleaning the chicken house and it bit me. it really stung whatever it is.

View attachment 2684001

This is another bug I found:

View attachment 2684004

It's kind of hard to see, but in the center of this photo is what I suspect are red mites? There were a ton of these in the chicken house and run, but none that I saw on the chickens. They like to hang out on the poo nad under the food and water dishes:

View attachment 2684006

@Lady of McCamley I was reading your older post here https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/my-chicken-has-mites-now-what.1273674/page-2#post-20483008 and I'm still not entirely sure what it is that is plaguing my chickens. Do you have any guesses?
Also appreciated the articles you linked to.