idealpoultry questions reply fast please

[theemon]

So I'm new to all this stuff right, I'm researching and I find and like efowl. Well I hear ideal thrown around so I researched it too, turns out right now this days order cutoffs have rhode island reds for . 1.05$ plus 7$ box charge total is 33.25$ wow right? Is there some hidden shipping charge or anything? Why is it for 8/28/12 only??


Am I missing something why they so cheap this 1 day? When they 1.95$ regularly.. need answers asap Kuz I might just get um now

 

[bruceh]

i just looked at their site. you do know that is for straight run meaning you get both male and female chicks. if your heart is set on the standard rhode island red these will not be the standard. hatchery stock is smaller in size and lighter in color comparred to heritage bred. however they will be great egg layers.
the males (cockerals) will be on the smaller side and produce some meat . you must grow them out. (18 to 24 weeks)
hatcheries some time run sales to unload birds. if they hatch more eggs than birds sold it becomes a problem for the hatchery. this is not prime time to be buying birds. you will have to feed them all winter into the spring before eggs will come. not a bad thing just giving you information.
if you have any questions pm me and i will tell you.
bruce

 

[theemon]

what do you mean by " hertiage breed " and these not being standard? both efowl and ideal say males at 8.5lb and females at 6.5 lb how big are regular "heritage" rir? i didnt know there was two kninds of rir... p.s if u dont reply in a few min ill pm you

 

[Fred's Hens]

Do a bit more research.

Hatcheries mass produce birds, and provide a service for people needing good laying birds. True bred, true to type? Not really. The only way one is going to get deep, almost black, mahogany, brick shaped Rhode Island Reds is to get them from the preservationists, the breeders who faithful maintain these birds, the hobbyists, the show folks, etc.

The Heritage Rhode Island Red thread is here: https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/407294/the-heritage-rhode-island-red-site

What you get from a mass production hatchery is a "representation" of the true bird. It'll be healthy. It will lay a large amount of eggs, but it will be lighter in weight and color, the temperament will be a crap shoot, and the body shape will rarely be true, brick shaped. Additionally, heritage fowl go broody and can hatch their own young, while a hatchery bird has pretty much had that instinct bred out of it. You have to decide what you really want. A true bred bird, or a utility bird; a production oriented, orange/red bird.

 

[mandelyn]

Also, Efowl is a middleman, not a hatchery. They will take your order and submit it elsewhere, depending on what you ordered. It's why they seem to have everything... they're not a hatchery.

Ideal is a hatchery, they actually have the birds.

Hatchery birds are geared towards production. Light weight hens lay more eggs, faster. Fewer days off and fewer/shorter breaks. So they will be "spent" sooner, because a hen is born with a predetermined amount of eggs to lay. They don't just go on laying forever. Heritage birds will lay the same amount of eggs, just fewer per year and longer into their lives.

Production type birds are bred for production. Not so much looks, correctness, going broody and being a good momma, or being a good rooster. Some nasty roosters come out of hatchery stock, because no one sat down and thought about the temperament of that rooster.

Where as a rooster from a hobby farm, the jerks don't last long, and they get replaced by a nicer rooster. Usually.

I know it took me about 3 generations of selective breeding to get good reliable rooster traits, to where every son was a good to his hens and not mean to his people.

Straight run chicks means they're sold as hatched. Out of 25 chicks, you could get 10 boys. Or 15. Or 20. Or 5. It's a dice roll. Cockerels are super cheap, and boys only. Sexed females are the most expensive way to buy chicks, but you get girls, mostly. Males can sneak through the process.

The pictures of the birds you see may not be what you end up with. Those are stock photos or drawings. The bird you get will not look like the hatchery drawing, just close to it. If you notice, many use the same photo/drawing as another hatchery.

Type in "rhode island red" into google images and see the range of types. The hatchery will give you the lighter looking birds. A true breeder will give those large, dark mahogany birds with the green sheen. An egg is an egg. You'll get brown eggs from either type. Production birds will lay well until about 3 years old. A heritage type will lay reasonably well going into 6-7-8 years, but she'll take a good 1-3 months off at a time, at varying times, depending on breed and the individual bird. The eggs will get smaller as the bird ages. My grandma had a hen that still laid a robin sized egg everyday most of the year, when she was 11 years old.

 

[theemon]

thank you all, im still undecided, i dont know how i want to go. i want big birds with a decent temperment, but i also want the el cheapo and faster egg laying.....



how much do heritage rir sell for? and is it hard to find heritage birds?

 

[Fred's Hens]

Yes, heritage birds cost more, are much harder to find, can only be found when the breeders are producing them, which is usually only in late winter through very early summer. Folks with good birds do not wear their birds out breeding for entire year, as a rule.

The heritage bird takes forever and a day to feather and takes half again as long to come into lay. Yes, they'll lay for 5 years, and grow larger, but that all takes feed and more feed. Just trying to be honest and forthright.

I have heritage birds and utility birds. Both. The difference is night and day. I try to tell folks honestly that heritage birds aren't for everyone. They just aren't. If all one wants is readily available, quick delivery, cheap price, quick to feather, quick to lay, lots of eggs and you're willing to face somewhat early burnout of those layers, then hatchery birds are right for you.

 

[J-Sanders]

thank you all, im still undecided, i dont know how i want to go. i want big birds with a decent temperment, but i also want the el cheapo and faster egg laying.....



how much do heritage rir sell for? and is it hard to find heritage birds?

Those are diametric desires. Unless, you start your own breeding/culling system. Hybrid/production birds have more vigor at the expense of temperament most times and the hatchery does not and for their business model cannot be selective as you can. Heritage birds are available but only by being patient. The breeder can only hatch so many eggs per year and you usually have to get on the waiting list for the best strains of birds.

If eggs is your goal then go with production reds. If long term commitment to the breed and the SOP then be patient and go with the heritage strains.

Jim

 

[aoxa]

Yes, heritage birds cost more, are much harder to find, can only be found when the breeders are producing them, which is usually only in late winter through very early summer.  Folks with good birds do not wear their birds out breeding for entire year, as a rule.

The heritage bird takes forever and a day to feather and takes half again as long to come into lay.  Yes, they'll lay for 5 years, and grow larger, but that all takes feed and more feed.  Just trying to be honest and forthright.

I have heritage birds and utility birds.  Both.  The difference is night and day.  I try to tell folks honestly that heritage birds aren't for everyone.  They just aren't.  If all one wants is readily available, quick delivery, cheap price, quick to feather, quick to lay, lots of eggs and you're willing to face somewhat early burnout of those layers, then hatchery birds are right for you.  

Great way to put it Fred.

OP: I suggest plain ol' Red Sex Links for laying and Cornish X for meat. If you want dual purpose birds that are both good for meat and eggs at an early age, I can't recommend anything as I haven't experienced an early layer who is also heavy enough to meet my idea of dual purpose.. Heritage birds do take forever to mature, but once they are there, they sure are something to behold.

A hatchery barred rock or RIR can not compare to heritage type in the looks department. For production only, go hatchery.

 

[theemon]

well i bucked up and bougjt um..... 25 chicls for 37$ shipped