INDIANA BYC'ers HERE!

[flyladyrocks]

I haven't posted in awhile, but since I ended up with frostbit chickens Friday night I thought I'd let you know what I found out. We left for a robotics tournament at 5:30 AM yesterday (too early to see the chickens they were asleep) and did not get back until 5:30 PM. Got out of the car and my 10 yo daughter started crying b/c she could see the blackened combs. Both Thurs. and Friday night it went down to 17 or 18 here. Vaseline did not help. I did a bunch or research last night and vaseline will help protect them from moisture freezing on their combs and wattles and causing frostbite, but it does not actually protect them from them cold. When they get cold their body redirects some of the circulation from the combs and wattles to help conserve energy. The chicken that was the worst was her royal highness Queen Elizabeth. She wants a whole roost to herself and therefore was not getting the advantage of the warm snuggle. Granted, winter majorly snuck up on us. We have had so much go wrong in the past few months that our temporary little tikes playhouse coop is still what they use. The winter coop is not done yet. So obviously a good coop is very important in the keeping warm process. I brought them inside last night and probably for the next few nights unless we can figure something else out. That was fun. At least they stayed warm enough last night to be laying today!

My medium comb Legbar dig great in the cold. She has not a hint of frostbite, but I think that is b/c her best friend, a Buff Orpington literally sleeps on top of her and keeps her warm. The Buff has a tiny comb and one tip is black.

I put vaseline on them last night and this morning, hoping to help heal as well as protect from the water they get on their wattles, but from all I have read I can't expect it to protect from the cold. Hope that helps and your chickens stay pretty!

Originally Posted by Faraday40

 

[Leahs Mom]

A STORY OF FROSTBITE

I want to post a little about frostbite and what I did last year when I had a problem, hoping it might be of use to someone here.

PREVENTION is best! I'm very careful not to give open waterers in which the roos or birds with larger wattles have their wattles in the water while they drink. I was also feeding wet feed last year and provided restricted opening feed dishes for the same reason.

One day, I got the great idea to change how I had my feed set up last year. I thought it would still keep the wattles out, but I was wrong, and in just one feeding, "Mister" got frostbite on the wattles. He already had a couple of tips that were bothered but they were not of great concern. These wattles looked bad.



I started looking to see the things that other folks were doing for frostbite. Everything I saw appeared to be causing much worse problems with the birds than the frostbite itself. Some were just putting various oily substances on. Some people were bringing them inside the house, treating, then putting them back out over and over. Some used other things. As soon as they started treating, huge portions of wattles and combs were turning black, becoming putrid, and causing a huge amount of trauma to the birds. You can see samples of it all over BYC if you search. And everyone thinks that's what needs to be done. Many of these "treated" birds have lost huge portions of both comb and wattles.


From observing these things, I began to question the wisdom of treating in that way. So this is what I decided to do:

-I decided that I'd take a "hands-off" approach unless it appeared that it was deteriorating. I was looking for any wetness, oozing, rotting of flesh, etc.

-If I did not see any of those things, I would be "totally hands-off". I did not want to make things worse than they already were as I had seen so many others do.

-I decided that if I did observe any of those signs, He would come into the warm area, be treated, and remain INSIDE for the remainder of the winter. No going in and out. This would be an "all or nothing" thing until the weather was consistently above freezing to avoid extra trauma after the fact.


************************************************************************************
So here is a cc from last year's "FROSTBITE CHRONICLES"


FROSTBITE CHRONICLES - FEBRUARY 9, 2014 UPDATE: 1 MONTH AFTER INITIAL FROSTBITE

Quick update:
-Had changed my wet feed setup and it didn't work correctly; have since returned it to the better setup which is restricted access so that they don't have wattles dragging through wet feed.

-Jan. 9 when things weren't working, Mister got frostbite on the wattles.

So...I'm taking photos and tracking how he does. I'm watching for any signs of infection, wetness/rotting, etc. If I see anything that looks like deterioration, inability to eat or drink, etc., I will change my MO. In the meantime:

-I have not treated or even touched it. I do not want to cause more trauma to the tissue by handling it.
-I have NOT brought him in to warmer temperatures than the outside hen house. It is not heated.
-I have kept the hen shed doors closed if there is an extreme wind chill to be sure none of the "lowers" get chased outside and stuck in those extremes.

*****************************

Just took updated photos for February 9, 2013. Newest photos posted at bottom of post. Photos listed in date order. You can see the progression. They continue to look good.
As of Feb 9, Right wattle looks completely healed; small spot remains on left.




January 9, 2013:
Day after he got it. -7ish outside; -30s windchill.

This was caused by getting wattles into the wet feed when I made a change to the way it was set up. I always have wet food and water in restricted opening feeders and waterers so the wattles don't get in there. This day I had made a change to my feed setup and in just that one time, he got frostbite on his wattles because they got in the feed. This would have also happened if he were drinking water from an open bucket, bowl, etc.






January 15:
Temperatures in the 40s for a few days.






January 26
Temperatures in the 20's

Look how nicely this is healing!







FEBRUARY 9, 2014.


RIGHT SIDE APPEARS TO BE COMPLETELY HEALED.






LEFT SIDE STILL HAS SMALL SPOT.







I DID NOT TOUCH THESE WATTLES. THEY HEALED ON THEIR OWN.

-I did fix the feed back to it's original situation that kept the wattles out.
-I do continue to keep water with restricted openings. This also protects feet from mistakenly getting into the water and risking frostbite there as well.


@jchny2000 now has Mister. I'm guessing that she could not tell that he ever had frostbite. Janet, if you have a camera and can catch a photo, could you post a current photo of Mister?




These photos were taken in April, 2014. The stuff on his comb is not frostbite... I should have washed him off before taking the photos but didn't..wish I had.

Check out those wattles.... A far cry from what I was seeing on the threads in which folks were treating and having a rotted, infected mess and lost huge portions of wattles and combs.

 

[flyladyrocks]

Thanks for the encouragement and the info and pictures. Gives me a little hope for my poor chickens.

Can you explain what your feeding setup is? You mention it, I see your pics of the waterer- is it similar to that? What was the "new" set-up that did not work? Also wondering if there is some way for the water to get out of the jar, or if the water in there is just to weigh it down.

I am pretty much a stressed out basketcase over the weather and the frostbite. We are going out of town for a few days this week which worries me too. Tomorrow they are supposed to have their new larger wood coop finished. The kids and I are about to go out and finish the covered run, and make a lean-to for tonight, kinda a temporary fix from the unfinished part of the coop. With how cold it is supposed to be this week and while we are gone I think I will confine them to the covered run and not have the neighbor girl let them out to free range.

Keeping them inside for us means, in the main living area of our house! So last night was sorta a desperate situations calls for desperate measures thing and not something I want to do on a regular basis. Chickens in my dining room is not practical.

Originally Posted by Leahs Mom

 

[ChickCrazed]

Going in and out of the house is not good for them in this cold either, the extreme swings in temperature are bad. Keep in mind all of our chickens made it through the 10 day -15 degree weather last winter (with only a couple very specific exceptions)! As hard as it is on US, they will be fine! Most likely your frostbite was due to lack of proper ventilation, not cold. Make sure you put vents in the new coop and they should come through it just fine! I also did not treat the few little spots of frostbite I had on combs last winter. They were not bothered by them and they healed fine on their own.

 

[SallyinIndiana]

I had a few with frostbite last year. Not a one died from frostbite. But the rooster that had it the worst lost the points on his comb. The hens theirs healed up completely. I took a hands off approach even when there was a bit of blood. I thought of using flour but the thoughts of white on a red comb and hens with cabin fever did not sit well with me. I just knew there would be pecking.

 

[Granny Hatchet]

great post. most of my roosters dubbed themselves this past winter. they didnt seem to be in pain and I also did the "hands off" approach . Of course at the time mine werent as nice as that beautiful blue one a few posts up. they were bantams that are supposed to have it done. I dont show so it didnt matter to me as long as they werent in pain. I do want to throw something out here though. I just started in seramas and they need supplemental heat through the winter. It is my understanding they cant go below 40 degrees. so all of the tiny bantams suffer worse then the LF do.

 

[racinchickins]

Quote: What size is the tank in your basement? I am thinking something like that.
Which tank are you referring to? I have various fish tanks down there from 10g to 125g. I also have the big stock tank that is 300g that I have been using lately to brood chicks. I think my plan next year if I get Tilapia is to keep them in the larger fish tanks while they are small. While I'm doing this, I'll brood chicks in the stock tank. Then later in the summer after the chicks go outside, I'll move the larger Tilapia to the stock tank for growout until fall.
Yes, the stock tank. That's my thought too, it would be dual purpose. How many would it comfortably hold? I have a few larger filters, two 55 gal tanks and one 75gal. Tons of tank stuff, going to inventory what's here and figure out what is the best to raise. Its like chickens, so many different types, hybrids lol, pretty interesting.
Not exactly sure how many - at least 20-30 with good filtration. I need to get out all my aquaponics/aquaculture info and go over it again. Sounds like a winter project....

 

[CCCCCCCCHICKENS]

I have a rooster that lost all his toes due to frostbite. He still has little nubs just couldn't save his toes. So definitely treat and take precautions. In my case there wasn't much more I could do for him. But luckily frostbite isn't really a big deal and I definitely have never heard of a chicken dying from it. Chickens are tough little animals

 

[CCCCCCCCHICKENS]

great post. most of my roosters dubbed themselves this past winter. they didnt seem to be in pain and I also did the "hands off" approach . Of course at the time mine werent as nice as that beautiful blue one a few posts up. they were bantams that are supposed to have it done. I dont show so it didnt matter to me as long as they werent in pain.  I do want to throw something out here though. I just started in seramas and they need supplemental heat through the winter. It is my understanding they cant go below 40 degrees. so all of the tiny bantams suffer worse then the LF do.

Not all bantams have it bad in winter. Logically an LF will stay warmer longer than a bantam just because of size. Most bantams don't need special treatment winter. Minus a few breeds like sermas and modern game bantams. My Cochins and white rock bantams do great

 

[bradselig]

I also don't mess with frostbite. I also don't put anything on combs to prevent. I also use open waterers. I'm more afraid of them stepping in it during winter but again didn't gave any issues last year even in the extreme cold.