Interesting article in Science

[MamaRoo]

Quote:
I don't know any researcher who doesn't get a great deal of joy out of figuring out a problem, or finding something new. For some of us, understanding IS pleasure.

 

[Royd]

Quote:

I went to the library to look for answers. I've never been willing to assume that the media, or some random person on the street is telling me the truth. I've always gone to look for it myself. Sadly, if more people were willing to take the time to verify things they here, there would be a lot less dissension in the world.

It's easy to make a false or misleading statement, and then use belligerence to try to bully people in to believing it. It's less easy to take the time to provide the truth.

Can you provide a link to that?

I say it always takes far more energy to tell a lie and keep it going than it does to tell the truth. Logically speaking.

 

[MamaRoo]

Quote:
Actually the original article was about animal behavior - there was no inference to human behavior.

Research on fruit flies leads to understanding human development: http://www.plosbiology.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pbio.0060284

Research on plants has lead to understanding human functioning: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/12/101201144612.htm

I don't happen to believe that gaining knowledge is ever nonsense, as you put it. If you are so insistent that research is done only out of fear or control, please provide some concrete, real-life examples for this. Not your opinion, someone else's published work.

 

[MamaRoo]

Quote:
I went to the library to look for answers. I've never been willing to assume that the media, or some random person on the street is telling me the truth. I've always gone to look for it myself. Sadly, if more people were willing to take the time to verify things they here, there would be a lot less dissension in the world.

It's easy to make a false or misleading statement, and then use belligerence to try to bully people in to believing it. It's less easy to take the time to provide the truth.

Can you provide a link to that?

I say it always takes far more energy to tell a lie and keep it going than it does to tell the truth. Logically speaking.

http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/internet/a/current_netlore.htm

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/people-lie-internet/story?id=13060797

http://news.cnet.com/2100-1023-204156.html

http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/199705/the-truth-about-lying

Examples of how untruths live on:
http://www.snopes.com/lost/lost.asp
http://www.snopes.com/racial/racial.asp

 

[Royd]

Quote:
I don't know any researcher who doesn't get a great deal of joy out of figuring out a problem, or finding something new. For some of us, understanding IS pleasure.

It's not the destination, it's the journey. And it's always more pleasurable, when someone else is buying gas and watching the instruments.

 

[Royd]

Quote:
Can you provide a link to that?

I say it always takes far more energy to tell a lie and keep it going than it does to tell the truth. Logically speaking.

http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/internet/a/current_netlore.htm

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/people-lie-internet/story?id=13060797

http://news.cnet.com/2100-1023-204156.html

http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/199705/the-truth-about-lying

Examples of how untruths live on:
http://www.snopes.com/lost/lost.asp
http://www.snopes.com/racial/racial.asp

Some of us just have a natural instinct for spotting hoaxes, a sixth sense, a gut feeling, and using public money to study the social habits of an Amazonian catfish, [true or not, doesn't matter] is nothing but a hoax. Do it on the private dime, and most of the scientific community will be whittled down to what's truly vital and necessary.

 

[MamaRoo]

Quote:
It is much easier to "spot a hoax" if you don't bother to invest in the truth before you start. Hopefully your "gold creating" plot of earth will keep you well without need of medicine, mechanical transportation, or clothing made of anything but woven natural fibers.

 

[mom'sfolly]

This thread baffles me. There seem to be a huge number of people who think that every experiment leads to or should lead to a practical, useful application. Life and science doesn't work that way. Little itty bitty steps lead to a greater understanding of the world; biological and otherwise. Science isn't just biology and medicine, and it isn't always linear, there are dead ends and side trips.

People study things for a variety of reasons, and fear may be one of them. But most truly gifted scientists are driven by an overwhelming curiousity. Why is the eternal question, and some people may see this questioning as a fear based. That is a BELIEF. Believing that curiousity is driven by fear doesn't mean it is. I believe that curiousity is an affirmation, and an act of taking joy in the world.

I think (again opinion) what Chickened is dancing around in his arguments if his feeling that scientific study is driven by those who fear the world, and are driven to understanding. I think his opinion is that people of faith don't require science to understand the world because god frees them from this fear. I may be completely misunderstanding what he is trying to say, but it seems this is what he implies, even if he won't say it directly.

Science, even experiments that don't work, advances our understanding. A great many, perhaps the majority, scientific experiments cannot be done by self-funded individuals. No one can build a high level particle accelerator in their basement on the change left over after all their normal expenses. You might not agree with how public money is spent for science, but no one is allowed a line item veto on their taxes. If you don't want public funding for science, then elect people who cut it completely. But remember that you will have to live in a world where every discovery is corporate controlled and managed. And you'll get to see your country increasingly become one driven from the marketplace and from influence.

 

[Royd]

mom'sfolly :

This thread baffles me. There seem to be a huge number of people who think that every experiment leads to or should lead to a practical, useful application. Life and science doesn't work that way. Little itty bitty steps lead to a greater understanding of the world; biological and otherwise. Science isn't just biology and medicine, and it isn't always linear, there are dead ends and side trips.

People study things for a variety of reasons, and fear may be one of them. But most truly gifted scientists are driven by an overwhelming curiousity. Why is the eternal question, and some people may see this questioning as a fear based. That is a BELIEF. Believing that curiousity is driven by fear doesn't mean it is. I believe that curiousity is an affirmation, and an act of taking joy in the world.

I think (again opinion) what Chickened is dancing around in his arguments if his feeling that scientific study is driven by those who fear the world, and are driven to understanding. I think his opinion is that people of faith don't require science to understand the world because god frees them from this fear. I may be completely misunderstanding what he is trying to say, but it seems this is what he implies, even if he won't say it directly.

Science, even experiments that don't work, advances our understanding. A great many, perhaps the majority, scientific experiments cannot be done by self-funded individuals. No one can build a high level particle accelerator in their basement on the change left over after all their normal expenses. You might not agree with how public money is spent for science, but no one is allowed a line item veto on their taxes. If you don't want public funding for science, then elect people who cut it completely. But remember that you will have to live in a world where every discovery is corporate controlled and managed. And you'll get to see your country increasingly become one driven from the marketplace and from influence.

As opposed to one being driven by idealistic agendas and huge beauraucracies?​

 

[MamaRoo]

Quote:
You have an amazing fixation on agendas and bureaucracy. Perhaps you could take your political comments to your own thread and let those interested in discussing science and knowledge continue on this one?