Iowa Blues - Breed thread and discussion

[IowaBlueCurt]

I'm still very doubtful about this flock when considering the details at the present with addition to the pictures. The blood gets pumping when I think about a remnant flock lingering around somewhere in the nation, however, the details need to add up and currently the dates aren't in alignment........yet. The biggest thing that isn't adding up presently, is the flock establishment date. It was shared that the flock in Mass. obtained their Iowa Blue stock in 1947, however, the breed wasn't named until 1952-1954 when W.C. Fenton coined them Iowa Blues. So, to have a reciept of purchase for a breed that wasn't named yet, would be pretty remarkable. Also, Fenton Hatchery is the first hatchery that can be proven to have sold Iowa Blues. John Logston started his breed creation in the 1920's but didn't finish the work until 1952 when W.C Fenton bought out his flock. Per Fenton's relatives, he didn't sell stock out of state due to regulations. So we know that his hatchery wasn't shipping out of state. I suppose it could be possible that someone purchased stock from him and took them out of state, but again, this would have been after 1952 at the soonest, which is five years after the date mentioned as the start date to the Mass. flock.

Color and type are pretty far off from the look of the pictures. Now, a flock that was closed since the 40's could be very unique in both type and color, especially when considering situations were loss of animals, etc. can effect who gets to propagate the next generation. That said, particularly the color but also the type aren't lining up with the pictures we have of the original Iowas. The genes the Mass. flock is exhibiting just didn't exist in the original population based on color photos and first hand accounts.

The birds have a canny resemblence to Ideal's stock in both color and type so it does cause some suspicion. I don't state that out of an accusation, but rather, we want to do our best to make sure that any remanant flock truely is a remnant flock. This same process will apply to any future flock that may be found. We have to test the dates, the type, the color, and the history of the flock to make sure all details line up with our breed's history.

I'm excited to hear more about this flock, but I'm not getting my hopes up..........yet.

 

[Candy442]

I could not open the picture links unfortunately...

 

[IowaBlueCurt]

Eric was told that the pictures are recent.

 

[IowaBlueCurt]

Here's a picture as shared from the flock in Mass.


Below are pictures of birds directly from Ideal Hatchery. NOTE: Ideal does NOT sell an Iowa, what they call Iowa Blues do not meet our Standard in type or color and their flock does not meet the historical understandings of the Iowas based on first hand accounts and color pictures. It is possible to breed birds out of their stock that can meet the Standard, but ask Kari, it takes years and is the result of hatching out thousands of chicks over multiple generations (what are you on now Kari? 10 generations removed from the original birds you obtained from Ideal stock?) The point is, Iowas should not look like this and to start with their stock takes lots of time, money, and work to improve them to where they need to be. Any evidence of gold leakage (which is what the male above and the males/females below carry) is evidence of outside blood. The originals did not possess this gene. (I have a better pic of a male from Ideal with gold leakage on my camera, I'll try to get it posted in the next couple of days).




Below are pictures of the original Iowa Blues -






There is a very distinct difference in type and color when comparing the two different sets of photos. Notice how clean and bright white they males are in color. Hope this helps others to understand why I believe the flock in Mass. is not a remnant flock. When we look at potential remnant flocks we've got two primary areas where we look to verify a flock. The first is to compare the flock history with the breed history to make sure they line up. The second is to compare the flock individuals to the original population (using first hand accounts, pictures, and when possible first hand witness). As our breed history is paired with the Mass. flock history it isn't lining up the way it should, and when we add the pictures of the flock to our knowledge base of the original stock (accounts and pictures), they are coming up short on type and color as well.

Over the years I have seen first hand numerous males and females that look like the birds in Mass. (more than I ever care to count). In the past, each of these individuals have sprung from Ideal's flock. My best assessment is that this flock too has sprung from Ideal and there is a misunderstanding along the way.

 

[mrandmrschicken]

Better pics of his birds would be in order. He took these quick to email to me.
Candy, I am PMing you a promo committee website that I'd like your opinion on. It may take a few minutes for me to get done.

We will not have a large attendance of IB's at the State Fair as planned but, we are warmly welcomed to use table space around the registration table.
WE NEED PEOPLE TO BE WILLING TO SIT AT THESE TABLES AND SHOW SOME PRIDE IN OUR GROUP AND THE HARD WORK AND TIME WE HAVE INVESTED IN IT. Even just to meet for an hour and share a rootbeer. Please make an attempt. Kari is working hard, and we have people who want to buy chicks at the fair. You can sell stock if you buy a pen. I have reserved pens and thses birds are not going to other members flocks but to new flock owners.
Please take some time. Please. As for me. I have no IB's but will be the loudest cheerleader there. I will care for and feed anyones birds they choose to bring. This is Iowa and we need to promote what we are doing. We cannot sell advertising items, but we can sell chicks and hand out club info.
Lets be a positive force in the poultry world and even stronger in preservation.

 

[kimfischer]

hey, i was wondering if anybody knew if there was going to be iowa Blue chickens at the Waverly S.W.A.P meet this year... i would love to get some of them and help bring back that breed...and if not does anyone no which breed of chickens i would have to breed together to get a close match the the Iowa Blue? in the farm show magazine i found that they are a cross between a Chinese cock pheasant with a Black Minorca hen and a Rhode island red hen which i think i can get at the waverly or waukon swap meets this year.
so if anyone can help me out that would be great

 

[Candy442]

I sure would love to go, making the trip to the Iowa State Fair is a long one for us unfortunately. I will check out the link for promotions.

I thought I would post one month old photos of June Bug, Cocoa, and Tiny dancer. Any comments?

JuneBug


Cocoa



Tiny Dancer

 

[iamfivewire]

They are pretty & growing up fast . . . . .& getting hyper-fiesty

 

[IowaBlueCurt]

I like June Bug a lot. Cocoa is still a little too dark, but give him more time to see how he finishes out. Tiny Dancer is an ideal Silver example. Just look at her face markings, very typical, and in my opinion, so beautiful.

 

[Candy442]

Thanks Curt

. Junebug is actually 5 days older than Cocoa to be fair...Cocoa has diamonds of pattern right now and although the picture doesnt show it those markings actually look gray blue

. Tiny is a beautiful site but seems much more behind in development than her hatchmate Cocoa