Is purina feed okay?

[U_Stormcrow]

I have had this issue specifically with purina chick starter and while I cant be for sure there's something wrong, my experience with purina dog food and catfood makes me not trust them.

[...]

I apologize if I offended you or made you feel the need to advocate for their corporate interest, but I feel the things purina cost me cant be replaced. I certainly dont trust them any more today.

Which corporate interest??? you do realize that the (Nestle) Purina that makes dog & cat food, and the Purina (Mills) [which is Purina Animal Nutrition, a subsidiary of Land O Lakes] that makes Chicken food are TWO DIFFERENT COMPANIES????

Enough so that one Purina made statement about the other Purina a few years back.

Generally, a single bag of feed isn't going to cause health issues related to nutrition in the course of a couple days, nor will changing feed miraculously fix those issues. Did you look at the mill date??? How long was the feed on the shelf??? There are plenty of things outside the control of the mill, related to feed storage that can negatively impact nutrition - (molds, mildews, rancidity, aspergillis fungi, etc) - and potentially health consequences.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

But people w/ no prior posting history, making drive by unfalsifiable allegations against one maker or another, usually mid winter, typically followed quickly by claims off reduced rate of lay, and yet another explosion of conspiracies on FaceBook and other social media? Those we are familiar with.

Is it that time already? I've not unpacked the Halloween decorations yet. I thought I'd have till mid December, at least.

Picture of your bag of feed please, showing the mill date and the guaranteed nutritional label. Also, what part of the county are you in???

 

[Mother of Chaos]

Which corporate interest??? you do realize that the (Nestle) Purina that makes dog & cat food, and the Purina (Mills) [which is Purina Animal Nutrition, a subsidiary of Land O Lakes] that makes Chicken food are TWO DIFFERENT COMPANIES????

Enough so that one Purina made statement about the other Purina a few years back.

Ooo, burn! Sounds like there's no love lost there! I had not heard this before.

FWIW, my cat is on Purina Cat Chow Naturals, the one with the bag art that looks like a medieval woodcut, and the chickens are on Kalmbach. All are thriving.

 

[BellSlayer]

We had our birds on Purina for quite a while. I agree, it smelled like Play-Doh. They did eat it just fine, though when Purina went and changed their formulation or whatever the hubbub was about that, we switched. After some research, we decided on Kalmbach. The first time I gave it to them, they immediately all started eating around the Purina, only getting the Kalmbach! They're still on the Kalmbach feeds - which honestly smell so yummy, haha.

I have noticed that difference. Also, there are times the animals (and I) dont seem to have an appetite. I can only "imagine" the animals must experience something environmental like i do that affects my smell and taste and appetite. I do try very hard to make sure they ARE eating and getting the nutrients they need, and im going to have to start making the food it seems. I was really only here to explore some potential for homemade starter and feed. Different things people have tried and succeeded with.

Um… what??

Um… what??

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I have noticed that difference. Also, there are times the animals (and I) dont seem to have an appetite. I can only "imagine" the animals must experience something environmental like i do that affects my smell and taste and appetite. I do try very hard to make sure they ARE eating and getting the nutrients they need, and im going to have to start making the food it seems. I was really only here to explore some potential for homemade starter and feed. Different things people have tried and succeeded with.

Making feed at home is cheap and easy.

Making quality, nutritionally balanced, feed at home is difficult and expensive.

In my years here on BYC I've looked at LOTS of "make at home" feed recipes - and with two exceptions, they couldn't even get crude protein, mKe, and a decent amino acid balance right, much less address the birds vitamin, mineral, and micronutrient needs. and unless you have a free, or nearly free, source of your primary ingredients, they tend to be significantly more expensive as well. You can't buy small quantities at retail and expect to compete with a producer buying trainloads on the open market or at wholesale several steps up the delivery chain.

 

[BellSlayer]

I have noticed that difference. Also, there are times the animals (and I) dont seem to have an appetite. I can only "imagine" the animals must experience something environmental like i do that affects my smell and taste and appetite. I do try very hard to make sure they ARE eating and getting the nutrients they need, and im going to have to start making the food it seems. I was really only here to explore some potential for homemade starter and feed. Different things people have tried and succeeded with.

While I was trying to find a way to explain my birds not eating the purina chick starter, I was TRYING to think of times my animals didnt like something, or anything, ( sometimes they'd go back to eating it much later). Im not so closed minded, but im more than twice burnt on the NAME. A chick needs to eat and get a good start. My other animals are all well past their baby stage with roosters and toms getting processed soon (when im far away because I cant handle that. I keep the animals alive and dont like the other part. When i was younger, it didnt bother me. Add in complex trauma here... i dont do well with the death of my animals).

I think its interesting how things I started typing and chose not to post till I had time and a clear head happened to be all posted. I have an issue affecting my brain stem and, depending on pressure, other parts of my brain will be affected so whenever I believe im not thinking clearly or I get stuck in a loop, I like to just go do other things. Sometimes my thoughts come out in pieces or missing words or about an entirely different topic. I get the nervous system dysregulation along with brain dysfunction. Its a lot of fun. Dealing with all the lovely people in the world isnt something I can do when it gets that way.

I even wanted to delete my post because I was trying to put up an intro asking about homemade starter not stay on my band wagon about purina. Yes, the whole mess pisses me off. Its also everything else so I have to really step back and look it over again.

The chick I wanted to hatch died before the other eggs could hatch. Normally, I wouldnt be hatching eggs right now (i had some eggs from a hen that was killed, and i have no other bantam hens).. I really would like to make sure the chicks that hatch are able to get what they need as ive repeatedly had this issue with purina chick starter. I could not find anything else.

If I throw the starter outside and my turkeys wont eat it, then im more concerned. I tried to review the product, and it wouldnt publish. I also couldnt reach the company. I looked online for a reason. Though, I realized I wasnt interested in trying to look for a relevant post early on.

Why dont my chicks eat purina start & grow? I dont have the answer, but none of the other birds will eat it after 2 days of just free ranging. They eat lint and Styrofoam, but they're not willing to eat this stuff.

I suppose the real test would be if the goats didnt eat it, but I am not that curious about the enigma at hand.

I came to find homemade chick starter someone has found works well for them. I dont care about the rest.

And no, I dont belong here.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Home made starter is easy. People have been doing it for thousands of years.

Which ferment process to use varies by what you are feeding, and what your birds most need. Sourdough, beer, wine, vinegar, yogurt, kombucha, natto, soy sauce, surströmming, rakfisk are all the results of fermentation. They are not interchangeable.

Or, you can simply cover with water, and stir occasionally, and expect that your natural environment will do what is needed. Surprisingly, perhaps, it often does. {you will no doubt observe that chicken feeds tend to be grain heavy, while "cover in water, stir occasionally" is (crudely) the sourdough process - which involves a milled grain}.

If you want a make at home recipe of proven value - one that hits the targets when you crunch the numbers, and has years of use by lots of satisfied individuals, Justin Rhode's recipe (scroll down to "Simple Homemade Chicken Feed Recipe Formula") is a good place to start. Joel Salatin has a good recipe too (for laying hens, NOT a starter feed!), but Joel's recipe goes hand in hand w/ Joel's system. Best not to use one w/o the other.

One of the first things you will notice about both? They use a Nutribalancer to help ensure they have the right vitamins, minerals, micronutrients. Second thing you will notice if you pay close attention? Fish Meal and Soybeans. Protein dense sources w/ good Amino Acid profiles. I assume you've not priced Nutribalancer and quality fish meal lately.

 

[BellSlayer]

Um… what??

To speak publicly in support of a brand and vouch for it is to advocate for it.

Clearly, I upset someone and then everyone.

If only the company would've been reachable and a review possible, then I wouldnt have found this post.

Purina is big enough with enough support that its got people on the payroll who should be handling this stuff. They dont have to. Unless enough people are affected, and unless its some massive food poisoning, middle man having to dish out refunds sort of issue arises, no one will be hearing about it.

Ooo, burn! Sounds like there's no love lost there! I had not heard this before.

FWIW, my cat is on Purina Cat Chow Naturals, the one with the bag art that looks like a medieval woodcut, and the chickens are on Kalmbach. All are thriving.

My cats were on very expensive Purina foods (i had even tried more expensive foods i purchased from the vet before settling on purina). I had a rescue that had a bad upper respiratory and uti, and I was convinced I was feeding my cats the best. That rescue was a kitten when I got him, and we should've had more years with him. He went downhill fast and hard, but after my other rescue died suddenly. She was younger and I'd had them for about 7 years.

I lost them to kidney failure, and it was very hard for me to watch (2 went within 3 days of eachother).

i was told by my vet the food caused it, and it wasnt uncommon (this was around 2010).

I thought I was taking good care of them and feeding them quality food.

Making feed at home is cheap and easy.

Making quality, nutritionally balanced, feed at home is difficult and expensive.

In my years here on BYC I've looked at LOTS of "make at home" feed recipes - and with two exceptions, they couldn't even get crude protein, mKe, and a decent amino acid balance right, much less address the birds vitamin, mineral, and micronutrient needs. and unless you have a free, or nearly free, source of your primary ingredients, they tend to be significantly more expensive as well. You can't buy small quantities at retail and expect to compete with a producer buying trainloads on the open market or at wholesale several steps up the delivery chain.

I am wanting to look at chick starter for this batch of hatches. The rest is beyond my reach. I honestly wont be keeping animals too much longer....

 

[Mother of Chaos]

I am wanting to look at chick starter for this batch of hatches. The rest is beyond my reach. I honestly wont be keeping animals too much longer....

I'm sorry to read this. Do you have a strong plan for who could take over your flock when you no longer can?