Java Thread

[bnjrob]

I bought a chicken at a market in Ireland this morning. The guy selling the chickens there told us she's a White Bantam Java. I'll post a pic of her tomorrow morning and I'd love to hear your opinions. I honestly didn't expect to find a rare breed chicken at a rural farmer's market and I'm wondering about this little hen, to be honest. To his credit he sold me a Silver Leghorn last week which I've compared to pic I found online and she looks "right". He had some gorgeous leghorns for sale and I picked up 2 young brown pullets and a white one as well. My DH fell in love with the bantam and it was only when I researched the breed that I found they are listed as rare, with the white ones very much so.

Am interested to see.

There are very few White Javas here in the US since they have not been recognized by the American Poultry Association for around a hundred years when they removed from the list of recognized Java colors. And as far as I know, there is only one person that has been working to make bantam Javas - in Black - here in the US and I have not seen any photos of his or know how successful he has been with making a bantam Java.

 

[sumi]

Here she is:



I've never heard of this breed before yesterday, so I did some research. I posted some links in my thread here:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/723656/finally-got-some-chickens-again/50 (Post #56)

I'm honestly not hassled if she's not pure or is a Java X. She's a really sweet little hen and my DH adores her already. That's why we bought her, to be honest. I was surprised about what I read about Java chickens, so I decided to ask you all... So have a look and tell me what you think.

 

[Marty1876]

Yay! A Java thread!

I just had shipped in an entire mottled Java flock. Its a small flock, 5 girls and 3 roos age 12 months. All arrived in great shape, and are in my barn in cages for a week or so until I've sure of their health. No mixing of new stock with old here.

I also bought some Java chicks from a breeder, so I've got the adult flock, plus 4 mottled Java chicks.

Here at the suburban farmstead, we're a historic property, so we've chosen to mostly keep and breed historic birds in need of preservation and breeding. Javas are the chickens we decided on, so I'm trying to get a good mix in from several bloodlines. We also have Ancona Ducks, Exhibition Buff and Gray Dewlap Toulouse geese, White African geese,and sebastopol geese. I also have a brahma, 2 BCMs, and 5 silkies for good measure. They are outnumbered by the Javas now though.

I'm delighted to find this thread, and I hope you don't mind me joining you.

 

[bnjrob]

Here she is:



I've never heard of this breed before yesterday, so I did some research. I posted some links in my thread here:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/723656/finally-got-some-chickens-again/50 (Post #56)

I'm honestly not hassled if she's not pure or is a Java X. She's a really sweet little hen and my DH adores her already. That's why we bought her, to be honest. I was surprised about what I read about Java chickens, so I decided to ask you all... So have a look and tell me what you think.

Can't tell from the photo how well she conforms to the body type standard, but she certainly has a Java look about her. Any idea about how much she weighs and how tall she is? What color are her eyes and her legs and feet?

 

[Poultry Friend]

Here she is:



I've never heard of this breed before yesterday, so I did some research. I posted some links in my thread here:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/723656/finally-got-some-chickens-again/50 (Post #56)

I'm honestly not hassled if she's not pure or is a Java X. She's a really sweet little hen and my DH adores her already. That's why we bought her, to be honest. I was surprised about what I read about Java chickens, so I decided to ask you all... So have a look and tell me what you think.

Hmm..I have not seen any bantam Javas, although I do know that one person was working on black as was already stated. Could you take a picture of her side? Honestly, she does not remind me of a Java. But the picture is at an odd angle. Also, the whites I have look like a different color then this hen. Not sure if this is just lighting or not, but she almost appears grey/orange. My whites are bright white with some light gold feathers on their backs. I do know some white Javas will show a grey shadow bleed threw but it does not show in all the feathers.

It is possible that he was working on white bantam Javas and has only breed one or two generations. That would make her a project bird, but better pictures are needed to know for sure.



One of my silver Javas. This is a new mutation from a closed black flock, but kinda shows body type.


Poor picture of the white's, but you can see they are very white.


Better picture of a silver's head.

 

[bnjrob]

The tail angle looks similar to an old Java photo in a book I have and the head/comb looks Java-y. Since this chicken is in Ireland, there is likely to be differences even if it is a true Java, since they tend to have different looks than our American chickens anyway. Would be really interested to know where the seller got the chicken and the background.

 

[sumi]

Thanks for the replies. I'm afraid weighing her would be near impossible. We only have a small kitchen scale and she's still a bit strange and nervous around us, so I doubt she'll allow it...
Poultry Friend: She does have the grey shadow bleed you described so well, as well as at least one black feather. I've read online that this sometimes comes out in whites as they were originally bred from blacks. I'll see if I can find that article. I'll also see if I can get a better pic of her, but it's pouring with rain (again!) and the light's not great outside. And our camera's flash makes the chickens look like ghosts.
BTW your chickens are gorgeous! I've read about White, Black and Auburn, but not Silver. What other varieties are there?
bnjrob: We're going to have to wait for Friday market before I can talk to the seller. I am very interested in there origins myself and I'd like to buy his other Javas as well

I wish I'd done my research before he packed up and went home. His farm is quite far form where we live. I will let you know what he says.

In the meantime, have you got more pics I can use for comparison? I found very few online and some are at odd angles (worse than mine).

 

[bnjrob]

I've read about White, Black and Auburn, but not Silver. What other varieties are there?

The American Poultry Association only recognizes Black and Mottled. There are some Whites here in the US and some Silvers have popped up, in addition to the Auburns. There has also been talk of some Blue Javas being hatched but haven't heard anything else. Behl Farms had those silvers orignally. They had given me a list of the colors they had brought out in their flock but I can't find the list. I do remember that Partridge was on the list though. PoultryFriend, do you remember what other colors Lyle Behl has?

As far as colors goes, for your info, there are some that believe that any color except Black or Black and Mottled, are due to mating with other breeds. I don't believe this myself (at least I don't believe any interbreeding has occurred in the 20th century), after researching old books and seeing that the APA Standard has changed over the years, and that old (greater than 100 yr old) books have mentioned "non-standard" feather coloring popping up in both the Blacks and the Mottleds before the turn of the 20th century. The history of the Java in the US is not set in stone though, there are several different theories about how they came into being.

bnjrob: We're going to have to wait for Friday market before I can talk to the seller. I am very interested in there origins myself and I'd like to buy his other Javas as well

I wish I'd done my research before he packed up and went home. His farm is quite far form where we live. I will let you know what he says.

Give that farmer a good interrogation! And get his contact info. Tell him there are Americans that are waiting to learn more about his chickens!

I know that one of the UK poultry associations has standards for some of the same breeds we have here in the US that differ, making the chickens on the other side of the big pond look different than ours. Basically, these Standards of Perfection are merely the consensus of what some people wanted to see in particular birds. So finding out about what they are calling Javas where you are at, is something I'm interested in. If we can get enough information, the members of our Java breeders organization might like to learn about Javas that are being raised in other parts of the world.

In the meantime, have you got more pics I can use for comparison? I found very few online and some are at odd angles (worse than mine). .

Here's some pics since I'm not sure you would be able to access some of the US websites.


Image above is from an 1897 book.



Image above is from a book from 1902.



Image above is from 1899


I think the image above is from 1910.



Photo above is one of our Black Java cockerels that started showing more of an Auburn color. This is from about 3 months ago, He is bigger now and has even better coloring. We've got two of these cockerels that came from a Black hatch. We also have a runt cockerel that is black but has brown edging to his feathers (he'll be getting eaten soon due to poor size and bad attitude).




Photo above is from about 6 months ago - these are some of our Mottled Java pullets and cockerels.

I need to get new photos, especially of our Blacks. It's hard to get decent photos - our Javas are active chickens and don't like to sit still and pose for the side/top/back view photos that I really need to observe them for body type.




Photo above is a Mottled hen from an 1897 book.


You'll notice the differences in the tail angle of the hen in the various photos from different years. There have been changes to the Standard of Perfection over the last 100+ years which could account for some of the differences in our American Javas as well.

 

[sumi]

Thank you, that is very interesting!
My 2 brown Leghorns decided they don't like the bantam so they've teamed up on her and she's refusing to leave the coop. We're going to build her her own little coop and run this week and see about getting her some friends on Friday. I really hope that guy brings the others again. DH told me he had a look at the other Javas he had there and they were pure white. He picked this one because of her grey/white colouring. He had them in a crate in the back of his van with a guinea fowl. I didn't want to look at them as I vowed to only buy another chicken if it's a leghorn I can use for breeding.
I am definitely going to interrogate him! I'm very interested in his chicken stock and I'm thinking it will be worth the drive out to his farm to go have a look at what he's got. He brings different chickens to the Friday markets and he's got some stunning birds. Apart from the bantams and Leghorns he also had some RIR, Barred Rock, Salmon Favourelles... Due to lack of space here we haven't bought many, but I want to get more of those Javas (if that's what they are).
I'll see if I can find more info on Java on our side of the pond.

 

[bnjrob]

Guess that isn't too surprising since she is so different looking from the Leghorns. We had to take the Auburn-y colored cockerels out of our Black Java flock because they were getting picked on so bad. The Blacks just did not like having chickens living with them that were a different color than they were. But until the auburn coloring started showing up, they all lived happily together without a problem. Chickens and their personalities!