Landrace/adaptive breeding discussion

[LaurenRitz]

Has anyone with acreage successfully created a 2nd flock with outcasts from the original flock?

Current drama:
I have three brothers who are 9 months old, half game. I keep an eye on them to make sure they never challenge the top rooster (American Game, Hatch). They sometimes spar between themselves, but it's never been serious since they were 6 weeks old.

Until yesterday. Maverick (fierce fighter at 6 wks old) and Nick (never a fighter) were going at each other. Nick submitted to Maverick and it was over. Then they fought again, and Big Red (top rooster, AG) broke them up. He went after each, and they each ran from him. I checked once more, a little later, to make sure all was peaceful, and it was.

Then, an hour or two later, I went outside and discovered Big Red standing over a dead Nick, pecking at his bloody head. Maverick was no where to be found.

I don't know which one killed Nick. Big Red had fought someone enough to be limping. The third brother (Iceman) had bloodstained feathers, but seemed fine and roosted with everyone like normal.

Late this morning, Maverick showed himself. He was very battered and being chased by both Big Red and Iceman. I shooed the other two away and got Mav into a crate. I guess he will survive, but he is in bad shape.

Maverick is a very good rooster, in my opinion. I regularly see him round up stray hens and bring them to safety when the alarm call is given. He has successfully wooed a little, low-ranking pullet. I've never seen him attempt to harass Big Red's favorite hens, or challenge Big Red in any obvious way. I wish I knew what really went down.

I'm wondering about the possibility of setting up Maverick and his girlfriend in a spot some distance away. I don't know anyone locally who would want a half-breed gamecock, and I'm afraid he will be killed if I keep him with the flock.

If he heals from his fight-wounds, it seems more useful to give him a chance at establishing his own flock. But I don't really know what I'm doing, here.

BTW: I was told by the breeder who sold me Big Red that he would not just suddenly snap and kill the other males, that I would see their fights escalating & I would notice that the younger male wasn't backing down, & that's how I would know it was time to separate them. I suspect Maverick is the instigator, somehow, but I can't read chicken behavior enough to know.

It sounds like Maverick took the beta role in the flock. He escorted the hens, rounded them up, did all the little chores the Alpha didn't want to do. Then spring approaches and the hormones start raging.

My guess is on Maverick as the killer, that Nick challenged and refused to back down, the Alpha was too late breaking it up and lit into Maverick, and Maverick thought might as well be hanged for a sheep and fought back.

I'd say watch closely and see if Iceman settles into the role as Beta. If he does, and you leave Maverick with the flock, they'll always be fighting.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

If you can't take care of animals, don't get them!

^^^ so much this!

 

[BlindLemonChicken]

I don’t have a lot of experience with rooster juggling but I have recently tried to create a second flock. It failed. I think because I initially quarantined a Leghorn rooster in the run of the Naked Neck thing’s coop. So they both figured that was their territory even after I manually put the Leghorn in the barn. Now they both sleep in the coop and the barn hens are rooster-less. So I suspect territory is more important than hens. The hens seem to wander with whichever rooster they think is best that particular day.

 

[Wild Iris]

It sounds like Maverick took the beta role in the flock. He escorted the hens, rounded them up, did all the little chores the Alpha didn't want to do. Then spring approaches and the hormones start raging.

My guess is on Maverick as the killer, that Nick challenged and refused to back down, the Alpha was too late breaking it up and lit into Maverick, and Maverick thought might as well be hanged for a sheep and fought back.

I'd say watch closely and see if Iceman settles into the role as Beta. If he does, and you leave Maverick with the flock, they'll always be fighting.

Thank you so much for this insight; it makes a lot of sense. I didn't know they divided duties like this, but you are describing it very closely. Alpha stayed with his special ladies and Maverick managed the others, but had one girl that he was sweet on.

I'll watch to see whether Iceman picks up Maverick's duties. If he does, I will feel better about letting Maverick go.

I don't know how long it will take maverick to recover--his breathing was rattling, and he just stood like a statue in the crate without moving, all day long.

 

[Wild Iris]

I don’t have a lot of experience with rooster juggling but I have recently tried to create a second flock. It failed. I think because I initially quarantined a Leghorn rooster in the run of the Naked Neck thing’s coop. So they both figured that was their territory even after I manually put the Leghorn in the barn. Now they both sleep in the coop and the barn hens are rooster-less. So I suspect territory is more important than hens. The hens seem to wander with whichever rooster they think is best that particular day.

Oh, that's interesting. So if I move Maverick out on his own, it should be to the next hill, or something like that.

 

[Wild Iris]

When I’ve tried to do it on purpose by throwing out flocks in the far flung reaches of the property, its never lasted more than a few weeks, then the flocks reintegrate at the farm yard and the roosters come to blows...
I am thinking that my past attempts have failed because the hen chooses her preferred rooster and I cannot make a flock by just taking a rooster out of a pen and throwing it out with hens that didn’t choose to run with it. What may be happening now is some hens are preferring the mature junglefowl hybrid and others are preferring the black yard mix stag.

It's interesting that a flock can be made by acquiring chickens and housing & feeding them together, but you can't divide up that flock as easily, once it's made.

 

[LaurenRitz]

It's interesting that a flock can be made by acquiring chickens and housing & feeding them together, but you can't divide up that flock as easily, once it's made.

Do you use coops? If you lock Maverick in a different coop for a couple days that will become "his" territory. I have 3 of my boys (the sons of the Alpha) who are in a different coop with two girls who refused to be shifted to rafter roosting. They join the flock during the day, but they have their own coop at night.

 

[LaurenRitz]

Thank you so much for this insight; it makes a lot of sense. I didn't know they divided duties like this, but you are describing it very closely. Alpha stayed with his special ladies and Maverick managed the others, but had one girl that he was sweet on.

I'll watch to see whether Iceman picks up Maverick's duties. If he does, I will feel better about letting Maverick go.

I don't know how long it will take maverick to recover--his breathing was rattling, and he just stood like a statue in the crate without moving, all day long.

You also may see low level cockerels babysitting broody Mamas with their chicks, patrolling the edges while the flock forages, dealing with hurt or frightened hens, and taking over the rearing of chicks after Mama weans them.

Your boy is in shock. Try opening the cage and see if he's willing to leave. Otherwise, just make sure he has food and water and let him recover at his own pace.

 

[Wild Iris]

Do you use coops? If you lock Maverick in a different coop for a couple days that will become "his" territory. I have 3 of my boys (the sons of the Alpha) who are in a different coop with two girls who refused to be shifted to rafter roosting. They join the flock during the day, but they have their own coop at night.

I have a small, moveable coop that will hold about 12 chickens for roosting & 2 nesting boxes. It's open during the day and I close it at night against predators. Maverick used to sleep in there with about 6-7 others, including juveniles & layer hens; he was the only older male in there. Last night he did not go in the coop--I don't know where he slept.

I will see what I can do about setting aside some space for him for a little while.

 

[Wild Iris]

You also may see low level cockerels babysitting broody Mamas with their chicks, patrolling the edges while the flock forages, dealing with hurt or frightened hens, and taking over the rearing of chicks after Mama weans them.

Your boy is in shock. Try opening the cage and see if he's willing to leave. Otherwise, just make sure he has food and water and let him recover at his own pace.

That is so interesting--I have noticed that sort of behavior! I wasn't quite sure what to make of it.