Let's talk Cuckoo and WHITE marans... breeding strategies...

[pmessner]

Here is the other rooster colors, as chicks they where a light tan/brownish color. I have about 5 that look like this:




Then I have about 4 or 5 that where a dark chocolate type brown as chicks and this is what they look like now at almost 5 weeks old:








And I have another 4 or 5 that as chicks looked just like the first one I posted above in my first photo post that has the big comb and waddle, they all are the same age and look like they do not have any golden in them kinda just like regular cuckoos. Will they get golden in them later as they age?





LOVE the feathered feet! The underside of the feet still look a little yellow.. so I will be keeping an eye on that and cull if they aren't the desired color.

The fellow at the top definitely looks gcm roo to me... but yours are darker than mine. That is an issue I guess depending on the genetics of the cuckooing... I'm still a bit confused on that . Maybe some one can give us a good explanation of that? Looking at the ones att the bottom of your post I am still thinking that I do not see gold... just regular cuckoo. The ones that were dark chocolate brown as chicks will be your golden cuckoo pullets... the gcm coloring is autosexing and quite obvious... The chicks you have that do not appear gold will not change... they just aren't goldens. Are any blue?

 

[Hens and Roos]

Might want to calibrate your hygrometer too.... just thinking really. That really sucks. I hope you figure it out

thanks, that seems to be working fine, we are figuring that the themostat went out towards the end of the hatch as we can't get the temp to stablize- worked on it most of yesterday- DH ordered a new one hoping it will get here this week yet. I am going to see if I can get our 1st bator fired up and aleast start the eggs in it

Also the 1 chick to hatch out didn't make it, seemed like there was something wrong with it

 

[Chickielady]

thanks, that seems to be working fine, we are figuring that the themostat went out towards the end of the hatch as we can't get the temp to stablize- worked on it most of yesterday- DH ordered a new one hoping it will get here this week yet. I am going to see if I can get our 1st bator fired up and aleast start the eggs in it

Also the 1 chick to hatch out didn't make it, seemed like there was something wrong with it

That is so sad !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[OHmamma]

Ok here is a few photos of my GCMs I have 17 in 3 different ages. I have 2 that look like this. As a chick it was black with white points kinda like a BCM chick but lighter. I thought it was a hen but look at the comb and waddle development! Is this a rooster with no golden in it? Thanks for any help! Oh its 4 and a half weeks here.

From my experience with the GC the roos do not always show gold until they are older. Mine really came out when they came out of their 2nd juvie molt. As for the yellow feet I had that problem with some that I ordered from another breeder. It was very disappointing since I believed they were good Marans. I gave the white legged ones to a good friend and sent the others off to the freezer. They lay nice eggs and are very beautiful but I just dont have the time to work out yellow legs. I am planning on helping my friend I gave them too work it out but I just decided to start my own line in the meantime.

There is variation in the GC due to the barring pattern they inherit and the amount of gold/silver they express. You might get a lot of inconsistency unless you start culling for correct pattern. There are also difference caused by the slow/fast feathering genes. There are actually 4 genes that determine the growth rate of the feathers. The slower they grow the more evenly distributed the color but the pattern itself blurrs. (Good for hens bad for roos) The faster the more white appears which can cause the white tail feathers in some roos but often crisper barring overall. ( OK for roos bad for hens.) I did a lot of research on it but seem to have misplaced the files or I would share all the links. The ideal feathering trait you want to breed for in the cuckoo is the tardy gene it causes them to grow slower but keeps the hens and the roos more correct pattern wise.

 

[OHmamma]

The Cuckoos were put on hold for now as far as qualifying. The ones brought to the show had too much variation in the HENS which really surprised me. There were a some silver cuckoo hens mixed in and some carrying recessive white. Both will change the appearance of the hen and cause them to look odd compared to a nicely barred one. I expected the trouble to be with the roos, As far as they went there were a few that looked single bar and a couple with too much white in the tail feathers the biggest problem with them was that their barring was not very uniform. Most had too much white in their hackles. There were not as many as I thought there would be. I was rather disappointed and here I thought cuckoo was easy.

They are however, going to move towards getting the White Marans APA accepted. Then I think they might go towards Blacks then back to cuckoo for another shot. I hope so anyway, I personally would like to see the basic colors get accepted before any of the "secondary" ones. To me that just makes more sense. I still prefer my Copper Blues but from what I have seen at shows they are no where near being ready either.

In the meantime I will be steadily working on my cuckoo egg color. I am getting about 9 eggs a day from them and it is looking mighty good!! I will be offering chicks in a month or so. I am running some through to test fertility right now.

-Nicol

 

[flgardengirl]

The Cuckoos were put on hold for now as far as qualifying. The ones brought to the show had too much variation in the HENS which really surprised me. There were a some silver cuckoo hens mixed in and some carrying recessive white. Both will change the appearance of the hen and cause them to look odd compared to a nicely barred one. I expected the trouble to be with the roos, As far as they went there were a few that looked single bar and a couple with too much white in the tail feathers the biggest problem with them was that their barring was not very uniform. Most had too much white in their hackles. There were not as many as I thought there would be. I was rather disappointed and here I thought cuckoo was easy.

They are however, going to move towards getting the White Marans APA accepted. Then I think they might go towards Blacks then back to cuckoo for another shot. I hope so anyway, I personally would like to see the basic colors get accepted before any of the "secondary" ones. To me that just makes more sense. I still prefer my Copper Blues but from what I have seen at shows they are no where near being ready either.

In the meantime I will be steadily working on my cuckoo egg color. I am getting about 9 eggs a day from them and it is looking mighty good!! I will be offering chicks in a month or so. I am running some through to test fertility right now.

-Nicol

That's a shame about the cuckoos being put on hold. I am also surprised about the hens not being consistent. Are there any specific plans on how to go about improving on the (silver based) cuckoos?
I did kinda think the roos might not be uniform enough just looking at everyone's photos etc. and so much debate about how they 'should' look.
I don't know if it would be a good idea to get pure blacks approved soon either due to not being readily available (so how could they have really been being 'worked on' on a large scale?).

White Marans would probably be easier. I have seen some nice ones!!

If Blacks do go up for approval in the next year or so, I will be happy to come show mine. I don't think they are perfect but probably acceptable. My two older females have such different shaped bodies. One being so much larger than the other. My younger pullet is really nice looking. I think she will get really big bodied when she is done growing. She could use a little heavier shank feathering and that will be one thing I am working on as well as smaller combs on the males. I haven't been breeding them that long so I know there is work to be done and many more to be hatched!

We have a black broody on half a dozen eggs and 3 black eggs in the bator now. I am praying for lots of baby roos. I would of had more eggs incubating right now but had a breach in our black pen from a stupid EE roo who mates everything lol.
I will be hatching blacks all spring, summer and maybe fall if they slow down laying in the summer due to the heat.

 

[kian]

I have no idea what I'm supposed to be looking for in my Cuckoos. Here is one, age 26 weeks. Laid her first egg yesterday. I got her and her sister from a local ranch. The only Marans they breed are the Cuckoos, but I have no idea where their line originated or anything.



Here's her egg. I posted it first to Instagram so it's a little filtery. I do like the speckles, that surprised me.

 

[OHmamma]

I have no idea what I'm supposed to be looking for in my Cuckoos. Here is one, age 26 weeks. Laid her first egg yesterday. I got her and her sister from a local ranch. The only Marans they breed are the Cuckoos, but I have no idea where their line originated or anything.

Hi, your hen looks like she has carrying birchen, did you notice the lacing on her hackle feathers? Her pattern is also affected by it. I am not picking on her but using her as an example of one that has been crossed. That is how you can darken their eggs is by crossing them to a birchen, funny enough you get the silver birchen from a silver cuckoo but you have to have a silver cuckoo to get a silver birchen!

This is a great example of what a cuckoo hen should look like. It is from the Marans Uk site so of course she has clean legs!


Notice how she is dark and uniform all over with no trim or highlights in the hackle. Her pattern is consistent but the bars do not line up like a barred rock.This is what a black based or E/E hen with the barring gene should look like.

This pair in my opinion is just beautiful especially the roo.

The males also need to be uniform in pattern and color from head to toe.

These are Silver cuckoo notice the hackles of the hens are almost birchen like and the roo is almost white in his hackle and pyle. These are carrying the birchen gene or ER/ER

When you cross the two you get something similar to your hen in the picture. The roos will also have the lighter hackels and can also show the metallic sheen in their dark bars.

 

[pmessner]

Great pics Big Mamma. Is there a way to start a file somewhere of examples of what we are looking for that won't get buried in the thread... I'm still a bit new to this board. Also it was with great excitement that I saw gabbard farms golden cuckoo eggs on E bay this morning but when I open the pic files I found a few things that I would everyone to look at and discuss in hopes of clarifying what I am hearing here in this thread... so with hopes I am not offending any one... I am going to post this pics here for discussion.



above: The roo looks pretty nice to me... even the dark coloring which I tend to not like over the lighter.... but there are those white tails feathers... Is it even possible to get a golden cuckoo roo with no white tail feathering?

Now the hen...

overall coloring very flashy and nice, but her shape seems off to me... maybe it's because she is moving but her tail seems way too perked up? Is that just because the picture is of her running or am I right that the tail set is way too high?

 

[DMRippy]

Great pics Big Mamma. Is there a way to start a file somewhere of examples of what we are looking for that won't get buried in the thread... I'm still a bit new to this board. Also it was with great excitement that I saw gabbard farms golden cuckoo eggs on E bay this morning but when I open the pic files I found a few things that I would everyone to look at and discuss in hopes of clarifying what I am hearing here in this thread... so with hopes I am not offending any one... I am going to post this pics here for discussion.



above: The roo looks pretty nice to me... even the dark coloring which I tend to not like over the lighter.... but there are those white tails feathers... Is it even possible to get a golden cuckoo roo with no white tail feathering?

Now the hen...

overall coloring very flashy and nice, but her shape seems off to me... maybe it's because she is moving but her tail seems way too perked up? Is that just because the picture is of her running or am I right that the tail set is way too high?

I don't know what that en is but she is NOT a marans and not cuckoo marans either.... she is golden laced something look sebrightish or something.