Little confused about feed

[Kiki]

I'll chime in.

If I were you I would leave them on the layer feed.

It won't kill your rooster...he will more than likely die from old age before feeding him layer feed had time to take him out.

You could end up with hens that don't eat enough oyster shell on the side and start having trouble by giving them the option of deciding on whether or not they want to eat it on the side.

 

[GC-Raptor]

Thanks so much for all the information!! Just to double-check...I need a food that is higher than 18% protein, right? Again, how high is too high or is there such a thing?

I only have layer type chickens. I've never had cockerels/roosters.
I buy day old chicks when I want to replenish my Flocks.
I currently have hens 1 year old and 40 months old.
I feed a Medicated Start & Grow feed 18% for the first 10 weeks. Then when bag is empty I switch to a Non-Medicated Starter-Grower 18% or a All-Flock/Flock Raiser crumble 20%, whatever is available or fresher when I'm at TSC.

When I switched to a 16% layers feed with my first Flock they started to feather pick. I switched back to a 18% layers feed and Pinless Peepers for 3 weeks to stop the feather picking.
I don't buy 18% layers feed because I can't always find it fresh. Hence the reason I buy a Non-Medicated Starter Grower or a All-Flock/Flock Raiser crumble.

I've never experienced feather picking on 18% Protein feed.
I've never fed higher than 20% Protein feed.

I don't breed/hatch chickens, but I've read that you get better hatch rates with 22% Protein feed. GC

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Just to double-check...I need a food that is higher than 18% protein, right? Again, how high is too high or is there such a thing?

Or at least 18% for the *best* results... including more nutrients in the eggs YOU eat... 22% was shown to have the highest hatch rate, which to me says more nutrients in the eggs my family eats.

It's true you could end up with a hen who doesn't eat enough OS on the side... I haven't used layer in at least 5 years, raised hundreds of birds since then and only get soft shells if it is a NEW LAYER hiccup still working itself out in the reproductive track. Making sure it is in a place they frequent and not out of sight out of mind is likely helpful.

I would not presume that WAS your cause of death, without a necropsy to confirm... in addition to not having other details. But for informational purposes, it isn't just the fat in meal worms that can CONTRIBUTE to (not cause) the liver condition which sometimes includes sudden death (many keepers will falsely assume heart attack or stroke)... but in my understanding... EXCESS energy from ANY source. Meal worms are a good source of protein, used in moderation with 48% protein and 40% fat....
http://www.sialis.org/raisingmealworms.htm#freeze

Eggs touted widely, are also good in moderation. Despite being a fantastic source of nutrients they are 34% protein and 64% fat by energy value (calories not volume which include all the water). Noting that half the protein and a good portion of the vital nutrients are found IN the yolk. The protein from eggs is reported as more digestible (absorbed) when cooked. Might as well include BOSS here as being best as TREAT only.

I would not feed above 30% protein for long periods of time. Excess protein is excreted as extra smelly waste and again can contribute to gout/kidney failure. That's the highest protein poultry feed I have seen to date labeled as Game bird and turkey starter. I use this sometimes a few weeks before hatching, sometimes during molt, and often for chicks.

I consider 20% protein (Purina flock raiser) to be a nice happy medium for dual purpose breeds. (I think 22% might be my preferred level, but I hatch tons and often have chicks)

I will also note that not all proteins are created equal... so adding in more soy or pea protein might not benefit a flock as much as say some fish protein or other animal derived protein ( I am seriously no expert and just have the basics here)... it's the amino acids that we are aiming to increase.. and chickens NEED some from animal sources... these are often added in (synthetic I believe) to the vegetarian rations most of us use. I always laugh when folks claim "vegetarian fed" chickens cuz to me that means they've never seen the light of day or a blade of grass. But I get that's often not what it actually means. But yes, chickens love many bugs! Since my birds free range I have zero control over how many fatty larva or pupa type things they might find.

Also in nature I noticed many animals are looking for more protein in the breeding and young rearing season than they are in the off season. And many even decrease protein instead of increasing it! Point being.. this is my current understanding and doesn't make my way the right way per say. I continue to research and you should to!

Huh... here's to over thinking... I WONDER if the animals I notice are simply consuming less protein because there is less AVAILABLE??!

My birds do face lighting seasons as I go natural. And the temperature varies slightly... but the ration stays available regardless of these changes. Maybe the birds eat less protein from pasture when I provide more??? And eat more grassy carbs to get the same energy but different nutrient profile.

So many unknowns... we do our best and let God do the rest!

Very seriously... as long as the formulated ration is not diminished in protein (& amino acids), vitamin, and mineral values by using EXCESS low value treats... ANY of the formulated commercial rations should meet the needs of your flock truly... even though I like doing MY best, that is different for everyone. Nutrition is key to so many things... but genetics cannot be emphasized enough on this topic... It's just that for folks ( especially who aren't actively and selectively breeding) genetics can be a mostly unknown. So again we arrive at doing OUR best, with the information we have available to us.

Sounds like your in for the long haul! I gotta see pics?

When in doubt, consider discussing it with your vet if they have any avian experience or show interest in gathering some. I have not discussed this issue to see where mine stands but he has been a tremendous support, maybe I will.

 

[Shadrach]

It's really simple. It says what the feed is for on the bag.
If it doesn't lay eggs then don't feed it layers feed.
You don't need any opinions. Just follow the instructions that the people who actually make the feed and understand its makeup provide.