Mareks

[microchick]

I'm thinking about it. All I can offer is my own personal experiences and as said, observations concerning dealing with Marek's disease not from a professional poultry keeper's or researchers POV but from the POV of a simple poultry keeper hobbyist.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

I'm thinking about it. All I can offer is my own personal experiences and as said, observations concerning dealing with Marek's disease not from a professional poultry keeper's or researchers POV but from the POV of a simple poultry keeper hobbyist.

^^This...that's what makes the article!

 

[Momma_Bear]

I'm sorry it has taken me so long to respond to this. I've been fighting the flu for over two weeks now. The medicine that I take for inflammatory arthritis makes me super susceptible to infections and unable to take a flu shot so it was quite an experience. I'm just now trying to catch up with things.

I hate to hear that you are still having trouble with bird loss and hate it even more that you still suspect that you are dealing with Marek's. There really isn't an easy answer to your question of 'getting rid of Marek's' because you really can't get rid of Marek's once you have an outbreak. You have to understand that science believes that Marek's is so prevalent that if you test birds from every flock in America you will discover that every flock has been exposed at some time. The trick is that if birds don't die from the disease, it is because they are resistant to it.

I'm going to use my flock of Buff Orpingtons and Welsummers as an example here. I had 22 laying hens and 6 roosters at one point. That number went up to over 40 birds with hens brooding chicks for me. Right now I have 11 5 year old hens and 2 roosters left. These birds at this point are my resistant birds and are doing well. Test any one of them though and they will come up positive for Marek's exposure as will birds from my bantam flock.

Now you have to look at where Marek's comes from. I asked the same questions you are asking in the beginning. Seems logical that if you cull them all and start over you can avoid the virus.

DING DING DING DING! RED ALERT! WRONG!

Marek's disease is airborne and can carry up to 5 miles on the wind. It is also transmittable via wild birds and via contact with the virus being carried in by shoes and clothing.

Been to the feed store? Chances are Farmer Brown has been too and Farmer Brown just tossed two dead chickens on the compost pile that he found dead that morning.......from Marek's. Farmer Brown walking through his property and then into the feed store has just spread the virus from his flock to potentially every flock whose owner has just went to the feed store to buy layer pellets.

Say that you decide to cull all of your birds and get new birds to replace them. How are you going to keep them away from wild birds? It can be done but now you have wild birds that are populating your property and every time they shake out their feathers they are reinfecting your property with whatever diseases that they are carrying on their dander including Marek's.

That pretty little robin sitting on your run fence just flew over from Farmer Brown's farm. Remember farmer Brown just had two birds tossed on the compost pile that succumbed to Marek's disease only Farmer Brown doesn't know that because if you have live stock you are going to eventually have dead stock.

Are you starting to get the picture here? No matter what you do no matter how careful you are you cannot stop this virus from coming onto your property.

Now back to my flock. I have 11 resistant hens and two roosters one of which is showing signs of having some sort of joint inflammation and the other that is showing no signs of the disease. I was told by somebody who knows this disease, a veterinarian scientist at the University of Missouri, that those are the birds that I need to be breeding to continue on my flock and breed resistant birds.

To cull birds that are showing no signs of the disease is basically tossing out the baby with the dirty bath water.

I know it is hard sitting back and watching birds die from this disease. At one point I was either finding a dead bird or culling a dying bird at the rate of one to two a week. I was pretty depressed by the whole situation but came to realize that I just needed to sit back and ride this out.

You cannot rid your property of this disease once it is there. Are you prepared to scrape off the top 6 inches of soil from every inch of your property? Are you prepared to burn every out building that has ever had a wild bird roost in it or are you prepared to throw a net over your entire property to keep wild birds out...no wait, that won't work, if a wild bird flies over your property that is carrying Marek's and it poops in flight and that poop lands on your newly sanitized property you are now reinfected.

I hope you are starting to see the big picture here concerning how difficult it is to remove Marek's from your property. Way much more work than any average chicken owner will want to do.

So this should be the plan.

DO NOTHING. Seriously. You are still going to lose a few more birds but the birds that survive this outbreak if it is indeed Marek's disease are going to be worth their weight in gold. Even if you have some other disease in your flock the birds that survive it are going to be fantastic, strong birds to breed for replacement birds.

What you should be doing is doing your best to keep the remaining birds healthy. Vitamins, probiotics. The best feed you can afford and practice the best biosecurity that you can.

I know what I'm asking is hard. It is agonizing to hold a beloved rooster or hen in your lap that is gasping for breath, pet them, tell them how much you love them and appreciate all the eggs the hen has given you or all the times that the rooster has made you laugh and then put them down and put a bullet in their heads. I've shed buckets of tears and agonized over every loss until I came to realize that if you have chickens you are going to have losses, either from disease or from predation. If you have Marek's well, you are going to have more losses than you counted on but you can overcome this infestation and have chickens left to enjoy.

I too thought about doing a 100% cull but thanks to that Doctor at Mizzou that told me not to do that I didn't. He told me I have a few birds left but those birds were vital to the survival of my flock and he was oh so right.

I commend you for sending off a dead bird to be tested and your attitude of 'I'm going to lick this' is just the attitude that you need but please don't cull your healthy birds just to bring in more birds that will probably even if vaccinated suffer a loss or more because you cannot realistically remove Marek's from your property.

I'm sorry for the long post but no post concerning surviving Marek's can be done in a few sentences.

Hang on. It does get better. Not great, but better.

I’m sorry you’ve been so ill, but glad you’re getting better. Honestly I’m not too sure what to say. All I can say is it makes lots of sense. However, all my hens are getting up in age and won’t lay much longer. Depending on how loud the cockerels are, just maybe I can keep one long enough for eggs to hatch. However not sure on that either. We’ve been needing to replace our flock, however once dying off we put a hold. It all makes complete sense though. Thank you

 

[microchick]

You can always go with hatching eggs in an incubator and brooding the chicks yourself. That is what is usually recommended. But there are two schools of thought. One that says eggs hatched by a broody hen show greater resistance to Marek's disease because they are exposed to the mother's dander upon hatching, then the other thought that says, yes but they are exposed to the disease immediately and you can prevent this by hatching eggs yourself and keeping the chicks inside and away from the flock as long as possible for their immune systems to develop. So idunno.

Marek's at best is a jigsaw puzzle with all the pieces the same color. Confusing and frustrating. I know that personally, I hatched well over 20 chicks under my broody Buff Orpingtons and Welsummer hens. 2 roosters and one Welsummer/Buff O chick survived to adulthood. Not very good odds. The birds that survived were with the exception of the two roosters and 1 hen, all from my original flock. I also had a Buff O hen hatch 4 bantam cross chicks for me and one of those 4 suffered a sudden death at less than a year of age. Brooded by a Marek's hen.

For me it's an experiment in progress. Everything will depend upon the success of the Fayoumi chicks growing to adulthood and crossbreeding with the Welsummer hens and the Bantam Cross hens. What works for me may not work for anybody else given the diversity of the Marek's virus and the strain of the virus that you are dealing with.

 

[townchicks]

Interested to see what the results are, and what you decide to do. I'm sorry for your losses.

 

[Momma_Bear]

You can always go with hatching eggs in an incubator and brooding the chicks yourself. That is what is usually recommended. But there are two schools of thought. One that says eggs hatched by a broody hen show greater resistance to Marek's disease because they are exposed to the mother's dander upon hatching, then the other thought that says, yes but they are exposed to the disease immediately and you can prevent this by hatching eggs yourself and keeping the chicks inside and away from the flock as long as possible for their immune systems to develop. So idunno.

Marek's at best is a jigsaw puzzle with all the pieces the same color. Confusing and frustrating. I know that personally, I hatched well over 20 chicks under my broody Buff Orpingtons and Welsummer hens. 2 roosters and one Welsummer/Buff O chick survived to adulthood. Not very good odds. The birds that survived were with the exception of the two roosters and 1 hen, all from my original flock. I also had a Buff O hen hatch 4 bantam cross chicks for me and one of those 4 suffered a sudden death at less than a year of age. Brooded by a Marek's hen.

For me it's an experiment in progress. Everything will depend upon the success of the Fayoumi chicks growing to adulthood and crossbreeding with the Welsummer hens and the Bantam Cross hens. What works for me may not work for anybody else given the diversity of the Marek's virus and the strain of the virus that you are dealing with.

I wish I could put under a broody hen, but for all the years I’ve had them, only 1 truely went broody. She’s one of the ones that passed. So that being said, I’ll have to hatch. I don’t mind the work though, I love it lol.

 

[Momma_Bear]

Interested to see what the results are, and what you decide to do. I'm sorry for your losses.

Thank you! Yesterday made it to week 1. If I don’t get results by week 2 (as they said it can take up to 2 weeks, but not usually) then we will call in for results. I’m ready for answers

 

[Momma_Bear]

I haven’t forgotten, just no results yet :/

 

[Redhead Rae]

I haven’t forgotten, just no results yet :/

Waiting is hard.

 

[Momma_Bear]

Waiting is hard.

It really is . Right now I’m dealing with a nasty piercing infection. So it’s slightly easier, but I’m Anxious to know..