Meal Worms or Black Soldier Fly Larvae?

[jlwquilter]

I don't do bugs, that's why I free-range my girls. Don't mind touching them, I just don't like to spend hard earned $$$ on them....

Years ago I worked in a sporting goods store. Come fishing season the store had live Crickets in an empty fish tank. Hundreds of tan colored Crickets in a covered tank being fed cardboard egg cartons. When the customer asked for the Crickets I was to catch them, count them and put them in a container.... I did it once and I quit! Couldn't stand 200+ Crickets climbing all over my arm. I felt like they wanted me for lunch!!!

I can understand that! I’ve never dealt with crickets so don’t know how I’d feel about them. I do have compactor though. There’s a species called African NightCrawlers. They get to be 24” or more in length. Totally creeps me out! I don’t care how great they are at eating carbon and giving loads of castings. Nope. Not for me. I’ll happily stay with my nice red wigglers

 

[jlwquilter]

Yes you’re right also, to an extent. Those atoms or nutrients have variations or types and some are bio available and some are not. Some help and some don’t.
It’s like saying all natural is the way to go. Hemlock is all natural and break down into atoms. Cancer is made up of atoms. Don’t want that either.
These are extreme examples, I admit that. But the kind of atoms and nutrients and where they come from can indeed matter.
I’ll get this wrong but there’s 2 types of phosphorus (at least). One helps with calcium uptake and is important to have in chicken feed. The other type (phytate) inhibits calcium uptake but they’re are both ‘phosphorus’.

I think it’s great if mealworms can eat plastics! I’m just not going to put that into my food chain if I can help it. I already have too much real plastics in me as it is!

 

[Down Under]

You might be right, to an extent, but you are a human, not an insect. And if you consider that polystyrene is composed largely of carbon and hydrogen which provide the mealworms with a source of carbohydrates it is really no different from other food sources. It's all about the atoms- everything in the world is made up of atoms which, when broken down, provide nutrients for all of the various creatures on earth.

Now, if I was going to consume mealworms myself (I don't) I might also prefer that they be raised on grain and veggies, but in truth, it doesn't really matter.

Somehow I don't think that you are going to convince me of that mate.
I used to work with plastics, not styrene but many others and I can tell you first hand that they are not good be covered in on the outside of your body let alone the inside of your body so what is the styrene doing to the inside of the insects body?
Also if you have ever walked into a fiberglass shop the styrene fumes can be overwhelming even when the shop has the appropriate extraction systems in place and the warnings on styrene inhalation over long periods of time say it may cause central nervous system effects including headache, fatigue, weakness and depression.
Added to that the media here is constantly jumping up and down saying that our food is full of micro plastics and now they have been found in human blood samples.
So to me I am picturing someone pulling a handful of maggots out of a toxic waste dump and telling everyone that they are safe and nutritious... um no thanks.

 

[Down Under]

Ok the insect control part of frass works like this: when you add frass to the plant soil (I use a thin circle at the drip line) the plant sense the presence of a bug. It sends out its defenses. But of course there’s not really a live bug. Now a real bug comes along and poops. The plant senses it faster and sends out its defenses faster as it’s a ‘been there, done that’ reaction. It’s exactly how vaccines work.
I do re-frass every few weeks or if it rains pretty good. I have seen my plants decline and get bug attacked if I forget the frass them. The difference really is amazing.

Wow that is interesting, I will have to give that a try. I remember reading a study years ago about giving plants colloidal silver and it having a similar effect on the plants defence system while the plant only took the amount of silver that it actually needed out of the solution.

Sorry everyone for getting a bit off topic... back to the worms and the fly's...

 

[RealSpecialKay]

I've done a ton of R&D on this
All mealworms currently for sale in the US are from China. Many labels list a US company but if you read the fine print it will say a product of China. Chinese meal worms are often fed sewage because they are not for human consumption. Same is true for BFSL from China.
However, there are BFSL grown in the US but they are a lot more expensive and a bit less expensive are grown outside the US but guaranteed to be fed only fruits and vegetables. That's what we use.

Well, I have ducks as pets. (No chickens, sorry.) But considering what my ducks CHOOSE to drink (YUCK YUCK YUCK), sewage would not be too far off. They RACE to drink the FILTHY, POOPY water when we dump out their pools!! Eeeewwww!! Seriously though, Chinese sewage does not sound too healthy. We do get our BFSL from the US.

 

[lightm]

First off I agree with the what they eat is what I end up eating too so try to stay with the natural foods like veggie, bugs, etc. I’m not a purist though. I do the best I reasonable can.

Ok the insect control part of grass works like this: when you add grass to the plant soil (I use a thin circle at the drip line) the plant sense the presence of a bug. It sends out its defenses. But of course there’s not really a live bug. Now a real bug comes along and poops. The plant senses it faster and sends out its defenses faster as it’s a ‘been there, done that’ reaction. It’s exactly how vaccines work.
I do re-frass every few weeks or if it rains pretty good. I have seen my plants decline and get bug attacked if I forget the frass them. The difference really is amazing.

Since I have chickens (duh) I’m using the whole mealworm cycle effectively and efficiently. The mealworms as chicken food, the frass to help my plants, the beetles lay the eggs and I feed the dead ones to the chickens too, and the eggs to keep the cycle going.

I feed the mealies older veggies that I get from a free source of my garden so no cost there. I bought 5,000 mealies from Rainbow Mealworms in California 2 years ago. Cost me $40 total at the time. Honestly 5000 was more than needed even with the learning curve losses but it was negligible for that amount given that shipping was half the total. I had over 12 bins of mealies at one time. Since I also had (still have as a small business) red wiggler worms I couldn’t keep up with caregiving. So I slowly decreased my mealie bins over several months by feeding them out more to the chickens. I am actually now in the process of ramping them up again so I can increase the feed out to my chickens.

The biggest out of pocket cost I have is bedding. I do buy wheat bran at TSC, bake it to kill grain mites, and store airtight until I use it. I haven’t bought any wheat bran in over 6 months so I don’t know current pricing. But a 50# bag lasts a very long time.

I also will bake and grind layer feed, oats, crackers, etc to use as bedding and food substrate for the mealies. Those items however I get free or really cheap.

I feel very good about my very modest investment in mealworms as the value I’ve gotten out of them. YMMV.

The insect control part of frass is so interesting! Thanks for sharing. I will give it a try too.

Raising mealworms has been so easy, practically no work as all of them are in one bin. I feed them carrot peels or apple cores when I remember, and I still get a good amount. My chickens love them!

 

[CurlyChickenGirly]

We started with mealworms and switched to the black soldier fly larvae. Probably didn’t help that one batch we got was burnt to a crisp and the girls refused to eat it! Hopefully someday we can raise them ourselves.

 

[Chicken_Obsesser]

We use both, mealworms because my birds like them better(the texture)and black soldier fly larvae because they have more protein.

 

[member 104844]

Well, I have ducks as pets. (No chickens, sorry.) But considering what my ducks CHOOSE to drink (YUCK YUCK YUCK), sewage would not be too far off. They RACE to drink the FILTHY, POOPY water when we dump out their pools!! Eeeewwww!! Seriously though, Chinese sewage does not sound too healthy. We do get our BFSL from the US.

I have ducks (turkeys, geese) but no chickens also.
Their hands down favorite is Happy Hoppers. They DO have a weird smell and are expensive so I only do those very occasionally when I’m training them to come when the bag is shaken.
I raise my own mealworms, but since that takes months, I still have to supplement with bought worms. Yes it’s Chinese, but there is a bucket of Mealworms & Shirmp (yes, it’s misspelled) that helps when you have a big flock. The turkeys aren’t wild about the shirmp but waterfowl scarf it up.
I emptied my first frass bin after about 6 months to refresh it. It’s wheat bran, oatmeal flakes and random worms and pupae - beetles were sifted out. I just feed it to the ducks, is there an issue with that? I’m concerned if I put it on my garden they’d eat it anyway and damage the plants.
I also have an old egg carton in there for them to hide under, made from pulp and they eat it. Even with enough veg in there. I won’t put styrofoam in there, but the pulp they do chew on.

 

[Mother of Chaos]

We use both, mealworms because my birds like them better(the texture)and black soldier fly larvae because they have more protein.

Same here.

I'm a bit envious of what @fuzzi's chickens call her ("She Who Brings Grapes"). I'm pretty sure that mine think of me as Maggot Mom.