Modified Hoop Coop Design Development

[Victoria-nola]

Sorry to hear that they abandoned it! Did a predator follow them in??? I have guineas now, but their coop is too small; I need to make something bigger... They are currently on a communal nest in the coop. I’ve been told that these communal nests often fail; hoping for the best!!!

Communal nests only fail if a predator gets to it. Our guineas are devoted to setting eggs and many of them have been killed on their nests. The fact that yours have a nest INSIDE their coop is a good sign, but I guess that means they spend all their time in the coop and don't free range? For sure, don't try to move the nest into a larger space, they will probably abandon it if you do. This assumes they are actually setting on the eggs and not just laying them.

What happened, and why our guineas abandoned their coop, is that we were having huge problems with raccoons going into the coop at dusk and eating the guineas feed-- we'd go out there to close the door and have to chase away one or more, very frequently. A couple of times a raccoon accidentally got closed in with them, and the second time a guinea was killed, which is a HORRIBLE thought. FInally, we went to visit my elderly inlaws, and our neighbors who love the guineas took on the chore of shutting the coop door at dusk. They never told us they actually did shoot the 4 raccoons they found in the coop one evening, but they hinted at it. And the guineas abandoned the coop afterwards.

I had wanted to put in an automatic door that would close, but the guineas frequently went inside the coop (or roost in the trees) so late into the dusk that I really thought the raccoons would just have already gone in and then the auto door would shut them in. So that never happened. But, we haven't lost any more to predators in the night now that they are roosting in (big old) trees, than we did when they were cooped. I know not everyone has that experience, but it's what's happened here.

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

Communal nests only fail if a predator gets to it. Our guineas are devoted to setting eggs and many of them have been killed on their nests. The fact that yours have a nest INSIDE their coop is a good sign, but I guess that means they spend all their time in the coop and don't free range? For sure, don't try to move the nest into a larger space, they will probably abandon it if you do. This assumes they are actually setting on the eggs and not just laying them.

What happened, and why our guineas abandoned their coop, is that we were having huge problems with raccoons going into the coop at dusk and eating the guineas feed-- we'd go out there to close the door and have to chase away one or more, very frequently. A couple of times a raccoon accidentally got closed in with them, and the second time a guinea was killed, which is a HORRIBLE thought. FInally, we went to visit my elderly inlaws, and our neighbors who love the guineas took on the chore of shutting the coop door at dusk. They never told us they actually did shoot the 4 raccoons they found in the coop one evening, but they hinted at it. And the guineas abandoned the coop afterwards.

I had wanted to put in an automatic door that would close, but the guineas frequently went inside the coop (or roost in the trees) so late into the dusk that I really thought the raccoons would just have already gone in and then the auto door would shut them in. So that never happened. But, we haven't lost any more to predators in the night now that they are roosting in (big old) trees, than we did when they were cooped. I know not everyone has that experience, but it's what's happened here.

Thanks for telling me about your raccoon issue - sounds like it was a tough situation! We certainly have raccoons here too, but have lost a guinea to a bobcat and had a black rat snake invade the nest in the coop... We have an automatic door and it’s all worked ok, but the coop is really too small, so I want to build a larger one without spending too much. I plan to put auto doors on that too, but I have worried about something getting trapped in there with them...

Our guineas free range, but after the bobcat took a duck and a guinea, I kept the guineas confined for ten days, and they started that nest in the coop. Once I let them out to free range again, they kept adding eggs to the nest, and eventually went broody on it, with first two hens, then one additional joining at about one week intervals as more eggs were laid. I now have five hens nesting and a huge number of eggs! Even after the snake attack they didn’t abandon the nest, but I don’t know how the nest with all of these different ages eggs will play out once keets start hatching.

Have you had any success with communal nests? Over at the guinea forum, I’ve gotten only horror stories so now I’m pretty nervous that the eggs won’t hatch or, worse, that guinea moms will kill the keets... Should start hatching very soon, so we’ll find out!

 

[Victoria-nola]

Thanks for telling me about your raccoon issue - sounds like it was a tough situation! We certainly have raccoons here too, but have lost a guinea to a bobcat and had a black rat snake invade the nest in the coop... We have an automatic door and it’s all worked ok, but the coop is really too small, so I want to build a larger one without spending too much. I plan to put auto doors on that too, but I have worried about something getting trapped in there with them...

Our guineas free range, but after the bobcat took a duck and a guinea, I kept the guineas confined for ten days, and they started that nest in the coop. Once I let them out to free range again, they kept adding eggs to the nest, and eventually went broody on it, with first two hens, then one additional joining at about one week intervals as more eggs were laid. I now have five hens nesting and a huge number of eggs! Even after the snake attack they didn’t abandon the nest, but I don’t know how the nest with all of these different ages eggs will play out once keets start hatching.

Have you had any success with communal nests? Over at the guinea forum, I’ve gotten only horror stories so now I’m pretty nervous that the eggs won’t hatch or, worse, that guinea moms will kill the keets... Should start hatching very soon, so we’ll find out!

I think you're so fortunate to have them nesting inside the coop. So many guineas are killed when they are sitting on their nest out in a field somewhere. I haven't been active around here in a long time, since before the big redesign, just so busy, but when I was active on the guinea forum, there were two different threads going that were basic guinea-101, let's discuss them in detail, huge long threads. On one, the dominant point of view was that guineas are stupid. On the other, the dominant point of view was that guineas are smart. Which camp someone is in very much influences their answers (and questions too). I'm in the camp that says guineas are smart. What I see is that guineas are barely domesticated and they don't do super well with human contrivances like coops and automatic doors and such, but they are very smart about how they deal with the natural world. And something I've learned over time is that they have a flock intelligence that they depend on. The group learns, and passes on learning. I've seen our flock really set back when key individuals die. People who sell their guineas randomly, or who butcher them, are constantly breaking up the flock structure and breaking down their flock intelligence. We keep our guineas as farm partners here on our small organic farm, where they have made a stunning difference in the insect pressure, so we see their flock intelligence.

Guineas could not survive in the wild if they routinely killed each other's keets, and guineas are barely domesticated. My observation is that they mate in pairs for the life of the individuals in the pair, and they raise their young communally. I have not seen a communal nest hatch out. We had two sets of keets hatch out last year naturally. One was set entirely by one pair, the other seems to have been set by more than one, but I never got to see them at it as the nest was hidden until they showed up with keets. Each nest produced about 10 keets, and the second one was brought out into public 2 days after the first. The keets immediately formed one large group, and they were all tended by a constant group of about 6 individuals, and others would come in and out temporarily. It was glorious.

The year before, there was a communal nest formed with 2 setters and multiple watchers. Each of the hens was picked off by a predator, and the morning we realized the second hen was gone we put a bunch of the eggs in our incubator and hatched them out. We use the Mama-Heating-Pad method for hatchlings. I never EVER saw any pecking at each other or squabbling when they were setting together. In my experience, the group supports the setters and they are all tremendously excited by the prospect.

All of which to say, I'm skeptical of the situations you've been told about. I guess that's saying enough. You know your birds and it sounds like your instincts are incredibly good. If I'd have locked my birds in that last night right after we got home, they probably would have reacclimated to the coop after the raccoon situation.

So, I would recommend maybe locking the door when the keets are born and letting them stay in shelter for the first few days. Our keets got picked off by predators horribly. None of them died, and all the guineas were wonderful mothers. But a young hawk set up business on our farm, and we have foxes that patrol the edges of the forest just hoping a chicken or guinea wanders too far in. Giving them some time to get their feet under them, and then having them go into the coop at night will give them a much greater likelihood of surviving to adulthood. Wait until you see the guineas herding around their charges! omg just magical.

And yeah, enlarging their coop is a great idea, just not before the hatch. Congratulations, again, on having your birds set a nest inside the coop. (Mine did, on my urging, but raccoon attacked the nest and they gave it up.) You sound like you're doing great and we can all only HOPE to be as fortunate as you are. I hope I get to hear how it goes.

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

I think you're so fortunate to have them nesting inside the coop. So many guineas are killed when they are sitting on their nest out in a field somewhere. I haven't been active around here in a long time, since before the big redesign, just so busy, but when I was active on the guinea forum, there were two different threads going that were basic guinea-101, let's discuss them in detail, huge long threads. On one, the dominant point of view was that guineas are stupid. On the other, the dominant point of view was that guineas are smart. Which camp someone is in very much influences their answers (and questions too). I'm in the camp that says guineas are smart. What I see is that guineas are barely domesticated and they don't do super well with human contrivances like coops and automatic doors and such, but they are very smart about how they deal with the natural world. And something I've learned over time is that they have a flock intelligence that they depend on. The group learns, and passes on learning. I've seen our flock really set back when key individuals die. People who sell their guineas randomly, or who butcher them, are constantly breaking up the flock structure and breaking down their flock intelligence. We keep our guineas as farm partners here on our small organic farm, where they have made a stunning difference in the insect pressure, so we see their flock intelligence.

Guineas could not survive in the wild if they routinely killed each other's keets, and guineas are barely domesticated. My observation is that they mate in pairs for the life of the individuals in the pair, and they raise their young communally. I have not seen a communal nest hatch out. We had two sets of keets hatch out last year naturally. One was set entirely by one pair, the other seems to have been set by more than one, but I never got to see them at it as the nest was hidden until they showed up with keets. Each nest produced about 10 keets, and the second one was brought out into public 2 days after the first. The keets immediately formed one large group, and they were all tended by a constant group of about 6 individuals, and others would come in and out temporarily. It was glorious.

The year before, there was a communal nest formed with 2 setters and multiple watchers. Each of the hens was picked off by a predator, and the morning we realized the second hen was gone we put a bunch of the eggs in our incubator and hatched them out. We use the Mama-Heating-Pad method for hatchlings. I never EVER saw any pecking at each other or squabbling when they were setting together. In my experience, the group supports the setters and they are all tremendously excited by the prospect.

All of which to say, I'm skeptical of the situations you've been told about. I guess that's saying enough. You know your birds and it sounds like your instincts are incredibly good. If I'd have locked my birds in that last night right after we got home, they probably would have reacclimated to the coop after the raccoon situation.

So, I would recommend maybe locking the door when the keets are born and letting them stay in shelter for the first few days. Our keets got picked off by predators horribly. None of them died, and all the guineas were wonderful mothers. But a young hawk set up business on our farm, and we have foxes that patrol the edges of the forest just hoping a chicken or guinea wanders too far in. Giving them some time to get their feet under them, and then having them go into the coop at night will give them a much greater likelihood of surviving to adulthood. Wait until you see the guineas herding around their charges! omg just magical.

And yeah, enlarging their coop is a great idea, just not before the hatch. Congratulations, again, on having your birds set a nest inside the coop. (Mine did, on my urging, but raccoon attacked the nest and they gave it up.) You sound like you're doing great and we can all only HOPE to be as fortunate as you are. I hope I get to hear how it goes.

Thanks for the encouragement, Victoria, and for sharing your lovely coop design. That is what I plan to build them, but it will take awhile (months at least!) until I can get to it. I’m thinking it will be about 7x 16 ft, with solid sides to about two feet then the panel arch and 1/2” aviary wire over that. It’s what I’ve used over our main coop (avatar pic) and it’s done well so far. I’m still puzzling I’ve the auto doors. I’ve seen a few people use “fly up” guinea doors, which would greatly help the predators trying to get in ahead of the doors closing... At least one of those people stated that the guineas don’t like the fly up doors so I had abandoned that idea. I just had a ridiculous idea that won’t work - the I.D. tags for dogs and cats that opens an auto pet door! Funny but not workable!

Anyway, I will certainly let you know how the guineas on the nest do; the first keets should be hatching by the end of this weekend. I actually just bought a camera that I’m hoping I can position on the nest so I can see what’s going on without disturbing them. I don’t know if the WiFi range will work, but if I get any pics I’ll post them!

I’m glad to hear that the guineas are working out so well on your farm! My family and I debate endlessly whether the guineas are really cutting down our tick population (of course I say that they have, but I’m hardly unbiased!) Here are a few fun pics: Ghost, my only male so proud papa to any keets that hatch, and guineas on the dog fence.

 

[Victoria-nola]

Thanks for the encouragement, Victoria, and for sharing your lovely coop design. That is what I plan to build them, but it will take awhile (months at least!) until I can get to it. I’m thinking it will be about 7x 16 ft, with solid sides to about two feet then the panel arch and 1/2” aviary wire over that. It’s what I’ve used over our main coop (avatar pic) and it’s done well so far. I’m still puzzling I’ve the auto doors. I’ve seen a few people use “fly up” guinea doors, which would greatly help the predators trying to get in ahead of the doors closing... At least one of those people stated that the guineas don’t like the fly up doors so I had abandoned that idea. I just had a ridiculous idea that won’t work - the I.D. tags for dogs and cats that opens an auto pet door! Funny but not workable!

Anyway, I will certainly let you know how the guineas on the nest do; the first keets should be hatching by the end of this weekend. I actually just bought a camera that I’m hoping I can position on the nest so I can see what’s going on without disturbing them. I don’t know if the WiFi range will work, but if I get any pics I’ll post them!

I’m glad to hear that the guineas are working out so well on your farm! My family and I debate endlessly whether the guineas are really cutting down our tick population (of course I say that they have, but I’m hardly unbiased!) Here are a few fun pics: Ghost, my only male so proud papa to any keets that hatch, and guineas on the dog fence.

Oh I know for a fact that the tick population has been vastly decreased. The first year we were here, we had no guineas. We made a fenced-in garden area and first solarized the ground to kill the weeds, then rented a rototiller, then planted it. Despite the fact that we had totally disturbed the ground, the garden was full of ticks. I always wear a thrift-store men's longsleeve cotton shirt in the garden, and light-colored work pants. I would reach down to harvest something, pull back my arm and have several ticks on my sleeve. It was really bad and very alarming. We had brought chickens with us, and they do help, but it wasn't stopping the ticks. All our animals had ticks and were bringing in ticks, despite being given anti-tick medications. We got guineas that first year but they didn't free range until the following spring. I might have seen 5 ticks all summer in the garden that year, and the pest insects in the garden were approximately 85-90% reduced, it was that dramatic. The last 2 years, no ticks evident in the garden, or out in the field where we've expanded and are growing produce for farmers' markets. No ticks around the house and barn fenced areas. Out in the woods, yeah, but the guineas patrol the edges too. They also go across the road over to the 3-4 neighbors, and they all LOVE to see them there because they know they are reducing insect pressure.

All our guineas are pearls. I see you've got a mixed flock. Hopefully some males will arise from your keet batch because that will give the group more natural stability. One thing I love about the guineas is that there's no huge competition between males, no harem and fighting like with chickens. They are very cooperative as a group. They will chase each other, but I've discovered that is male-female pair bonding, not male-male competition, and it's all in good fun.

Please do post me pictures. I absolutely LOVE that photo of your coop, that must have cost a few pennies! It's so fantastic! Do you have a post up about it anywhere that I could see more photos and read about what you've done there? p.s. We had a rat snake in our chicken coop for a couple of months, finally managed to get hold of it and relocate it. Using 1/2" hardware cloth I managed to make the coop (it's a stall in an old barn) rat- and larger-predator proof, but mice and apparently snakes can still sneak in. Would love to be able to build something from scratch like we had at our old place.

Oh, about the new guinea enclosure. Part of why the one we built worked so well for them is that it has a really high ceiling, and they like to roost high-- they roosted up on the cross-beams. That's why the tall sidewalls. But, you know your flock and already have them cooping, so they'll do well. Please post photos and reports! Or post me the link here where you're posting. Thanks.

 

[perchie.girl]

Oh I know for a fact that the tick population has been vastly decreased. The first year we were here, we had no guineas. We made a fenced-in garden area and first solarized the ground to kill the weeds, then rented a rototiller, then planted it. Despite the fact that we had totally disturbed the ground, the garden was full of ticks. I always wear a thrift-store men's longsleeve cotton shirt in the garden, and light-colored work pants. I would reach down to harvest something, pull back my arm and have several ticks on my sleeve. It was really bad and very alarming. We had brought chickens with us, and they do help, but it wasn't stopping the ticks. All our animals had ticks and were bringing in ticks, despite being given anti-tick medications. We got guineas that first year but they didn't free range until the following spring. I might have seen 5 ticks all summer in the garden that year, and the pest insects in the garden were approximately 85-90% reduced, it was that dramatic. The last 2 years, no ticks evident in the garden, or out in the field where we've expanded and are growing produce for farmers' markets. No ticks around the house and barn fenced areas. Out in the woods, yeah, but the guineas patrol the edges too. They also go across the road over to the 3-4 neighbors, and they all LOVE to see them there because they know they are reducing insect pressure.

All our guineas are pearls. I see you've got a mixed flock. Hopefully some males will arise from your keet batch because that will give the group more natural stability. One thing I love about the guineas is that there's no huge competition between males, no harem and fighting like with chickens. They are very cooperative as a group. They will chase each other, but I've discovered that is male-female pair bonding, not male-male competition, and it's all in good fun.

Please do post me pictures. I absolutely LOVE that photo of your coop, that must have cost a few pennies! It's so fantastic! Do you have a post up about it anywhere that I could see more photos and read about what you've done there? p.s. We had a rat snake in our chicken coop for a couple of months, finally managed to get hold of it and relocate it. Using 1/2" hardware cloth I managed to make the coop (it's a stall in an old barn) rat- and larger-predator proof, but mice and apparently snakes can still sneak in. Would love to be able to build something from scratch like we had at our old place.

Oh, about the new guinea enclosure. Part of why the one we built worked so well for them is that it has a really high ceiling, and they like to roost high-- they roosted up on the cross-beams. That's why the tall sidewalls. But, you know your flock and already have them cooping, so they'll do well. Please post photos and reports! Or post me the link here where you're posting. Thanks.

Love the report been following since the first post...

deb

 

[Victoria-nola]

Thanks, Deb, I remember your name from when I was active before, and I know we were friendly, but I don't remember much about your situation.

 

[aart]

What happened, and why our guineas abandoned their coop

So you figure they are safer out on their own and will not try to get them back into the hi-rise? Is it just sitting empty?

 

[Victoria-nola]

So you figure they are safer out on their own and will not try to get them back into the hi-rise? Is it just sitting empty?

Hi! There's no way to get them back in, they never all go in at the same time, especially if any humans are around they always split up. I can't even imagine it. They've been fine roosting in the trees. Winter before last we had 8" of snow that stuck for a week. They still refused to go into the barn or into their coop. So yeah, it's essentially sitting empty. We keep a waterer in there, and put grain in there every day. They will go in if there's a big storm in the middle of the day, they'll go in and hang out from time to time, usually once a day, but they won't stay in. If you walk toward the door and any are inside they race out. They still think of it as theirs, but just not a place to sleep. I do think they are pretty much just as safe in the trees as they were in the coop, considering that raccoons managed to kill a couple anyway. In some places that wouldn't be true, but it does seem to be the case here. At least, at this point.

 

[Victoria-nola]

Anyway, I will certainly let you know how the guineas on the nest do; the first keets should be hatching by the end of this weekend. I actually just bought a camera that I’m hoping I can position on the nest so I can see what’s going on without disturbing them. I don’t know if the WiFi range will work, but if I get any pics I’ll post them!

Hi-- Did you get any keets? How did it go? --Victoria
p.s. Nevermind. I went and found your posts about the big nest and what happened. When I wrote what I did, I don't think I realized just how giant that was. That must have been horrible to deal with, but good on you for getting them in and incubating. I'm a major fan of guineas and I do think you're on the right track with them being willing to nest inside. Wishing you well.