Moving Forward- Breeding for Resistance to Marek's Disease

[chooks4life]

Well, I worked 8 years with the infamous Dr. Mary Newport , who lectured all over the world about how coconut oil reversed some of the Alzheimer's in her husband. She said that after months, the CO coats the nerves . I asked her about using it for my dog Baxter and his seizures and she told me use a tsp per 10 pounds, but increase it very slowly. About 4 months later, we noticed that Baxter had an increase in time between his seizures, and they were not as extreme. It was not a drastic difference, but to an owner of a dog with seizures, it certainly is something noticeable. BTW he has been on anti seizure medication for 8 years now, but still has them average monthly. In the past he's gone so far as to have them weekly.

From what I've read, grapeseed oil does almost the same thing. It saturates over time and then you get the true benefits... But from what I've seen/read, this is basically true of all oils, another important reason to avoid synthetic or overprocessed oils.

Now all we need is one brave person to hatch some unvaccinated chicks with exposure but start them out day one with coconut oil and see what happens with the Marek's symptoms, mostly the paralysis.

I volunteer!

I'm in the middle of moving house right now, will be going any day... But, if we can arrange someone with a vet-certified MDV case to give me a chook definitely carrying it, I'll have a go.

Best wishes.

 

[seminolewind]

Quote:
I think each chicken reacts differently to the immune suppression. It may be that the area that they are given is a factor by size of free range. . My property was virgin wooded when we built a house on it.

Out of that 29 left, 12 are older unvaccinated, 11 are hatchery vaccinated, and 6 vaccinated by me. I've lost lots of chickens from suppressed immune system, I believe the survivors have much better immune systems or more opportunity to be in a less concentrated area of virus.

Barring all other possibilities of death, I think Marek's has 2 parts: One is the younger chicken developing tumors that eventually kill them, and the other is how many die from Marek's caused suppressed / damaged immune system?

Which one do we build resistance to? How do you build resistance to both? What all have in common is a virus that has had an opportunity to suppress or damage the immune and build tumors , then remain and damage or suppress immune system for the life of the chicken, which has varying result of preventing the invasion or growth of bad bacteria. Varying results of resistance based on virulence, genetics, concentration of virus in environment, availability, and natural resistance .

What Marek's does is kill off the B cells which are the first line of defense in general. Then the T cells get involved that are specific to what they are fighting. The body eventually runs low on T cells, and the virus moves in. I think the virus then uses the T cells to be a factory for producing more Marek's virus. (Please correct me if that explanation is wrong).

So what exactly is it that one builds resistance to? Seems to me that the vaccine protects against the formation of tumors, but it does not protect the chicken against the continued suppression of the immune system, amount of damage based on other factors within the chicken or the environment.

 

[seminolewind]

I wonder if they emailed the report and I just didn't receive it. I'll check on that this week.

Check in your Spam folder. Some things end up there.

 

[seminolewind]

Quote:
I would have to read thru a lot of posts, so.....if you don't have it, don't take a chick with it

 

[speckledhen]

Check in your Spam folder. Some things end up there.

Nope, not there. Since we've had numerous emails, they don't go there, thankfully, but I did check both Trash and Spam.

 

[Nambroth]

This is my next endeavor . Just happened to come across this. (Nambroth)

VIRGIN COCONUT OIL: POTENTIAL IMMUNE SYSTEM BOOSTER FOR CHICKENS

I don't know if you recall me mentioning it before, but I always give it, and gently advise people to try small amounts of cold-pressed coconut oil when attempting to correct problems with vitamin deficiency and/or neurological problems. While I retain healthy skepticism (not scorn, just careful rational thought) about it being a 'wonder' food as many claim, it HAS been scientifically proven that medium-chain fats greatly aid in the absorption of vitamins, and that is exactly the types of fat coconut oil has. These medium chain fats are extremely important for nerve and brain function. Unfortunately, the fats used in most commercial feeds are 'cheap' and unstable fats, and have a tendency to not do their job especially if the feed is more than two months old. I suspect (not fact, just a personal theory) that over the long term this is causing some people to have vitamin deficiency in their birds, especially A and more often B.
To this end I do occasionally mix some coconut oil into my bird's oatmeal. As long as it is used in moderation, there is no evidence that it can cause any harm.

My vet also advised me that it is thought to stimulate appetite in ill birds.

 

[Nambroth]

All I know is good quality feed, fresh clean water, dry clean environment and plenty of natural sunlight and fresh air, extra vitamins and minerals. Not sure there is anything special to do, more than that. I've used probiotics, flax seed and have recently started sprinkling turmeric in their feeds. We use extra virgin olive oil to cook with so I use that in their special concoctions as well, seems to help circulation. Someone I know whose been raising birds almost as long as I've been alive swears that tomato juice helps with crop issues and it sure helped Caroline's sluggish crop this summer when tomatoes were plentiful and she got them all the time. Organic ACV with the mother has vitamins and helps with the gut and crop pH. So, all that combined is what I've done, but not all the time, just when I have time, in addition to the usual feeds and free ranging. Mostly, they get just their pelleted feed and the 11 grain scratch.

I am not sure if you caught it, but I recently posted about ACV: https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/741957/not-an-emergency-mareks-in-the-flock/2080#post_14249365
In short: It's awesome stuff but for general health, a powdered probiotic is very likely to have a much larger impact.

Also, and I definitely don't want to start any sort of scuffle on the forum regarding this stuff, but as much as it chaps my buns, it is often very hard to get real, genuine olive oil in the States unless you are super careful or buy it direct from the farm that presses it. There is an immense amount of "cheating" going on with olive oils (regrettably, most often including the expensive imported stuff). There is a legitimate Big Con going on with olive oil, which involves cutting it with cheap oils such as canola, corn, or soy oils. Which sort of negates the healthy aspect of using a good extra virgin olive oil (EVOO) for its health benefits. It really ticked me off to learn this. EVOO, even the real stuff, can also go rancid so always check the date, too. You can do a google search and fall into the rabbit hole if you are inclined. I will spare you all my ranting and invite you to search information about this if you are inclined... or ignore this nutty chicken girl if you don't want to think about it! (I don't blame you)

 

[lalaland]

I am not sure if you caught it, but I recently posted about ACV: https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/741957/not-an-emergency-mareks-in-the-flock/2080#post_14249365
In short: It's awesome stuff but for general health, a powdered probiotic is very likely to have a much larger impact.

Also, and I definitely don't want to start any sort of scuffle on the forum regarding this stuff, but as much as it chaps my buns, it is often very hard to get real, genuine olive oil in the States unless you are super careful or buy it direct from the farm that presses it. There is an immense amount of "cheating" going on with olive oils (regrettably, most often including the expensive imported stuff). There is a legitimate Big Con going on with olive oil, which involves cutting it with cheap oils such as canola, corn, or soy oils. Which sort of negates the healthy aspect of using a good extra virgin olive oil (EVOO) for its health benefits. It really ticked me off to learn this. EVOO, even the real stuff, can also go rancid so always check the date, too. You can do a google search and fall into the rabbit hole if you are inclined. I will spare you all my ranting and invite you to search information about this if you are inclined... or ignore this nutty chicken girl if you don't want to think about it! (I don't blame you)

I know! It is absolutely criminal. And it is the same way with honey, it is cut with corn syrup but american labeling laws allow it. You aren't getting honey if you are buying a national brand - well there is some honey in it but also other sweeteners and water.

 

[speckledhen]

I saw a huge report on it awhile back myself. It's hard to know what you're buying anymore, labels or no labels.

As for ACV, I've used it as a hot tea myself when I had a bad cold, which hasn't been in a very long time. With raw honey, it sure cuts the nasties.

 

[Nambroth]

I know! It is absolutely criminal. And it is the same way with honey, it is cut with corn syrup but american labeling laws allow it. You aren't getting honey if you are buying a national brand - well there is some honey in it but also other sweeteners and water.

(And Maple Syrup.. and other things!) At least it is easier for most people to find local or semi-local honey from ethical beekeepers, but it's hard to find the olive oil since it is something that can only be grown in some climates. BUT I will stop with this tangent now!