My dream puppy, so sad - update Page 3

So sorry you are going through this. Your Sheltie is beautiful!!!

We lost our 7 year old Akita two summers ago to seizures. He started having them when he was 3 and they were intermittent, even while he was on 2 different meds ($300 a month!). We ended up stopping the meds because they weren't really making that much of a difference and they were hard on his liver. The last seizure he had was so violent that we think he hurt his back, because he was screaming in pain. We called the vet to come out and put him down, but he passed away before the vet got there. It was so heartbreaking to see him go through that! He was the best dog and we miss him so much!

You might want to double check the thyroid as well. The doctor couldn't pinpoint the reason for the seizures without doing extensive (and expensive) testing, MRI's, etc. The breeder claimed that they never had seizure issues in any of their line, but we highly doubted that.
 
I've got a mastiff that suffered from seizures from 6 months to 2 years old. We couldn't find the triggers for them. She had them almost every day. We had her on valium and phenobarbital. One night she had a bad seizure that she was not coming out of before she went back into another one..back to back.. we rushed her to the vet and she put the dog under heavy sedation. The seizure stopped and we decided to start her on sodium bromide...that stuff really helped her, she rarely had another seizure. We eventually tapered her off the meds and she's been fine ever since... well, fine aside from the brain damage she suffered from the last big one. She's 11 yrs old now and still acts like a puppy. If you put her on meds, try the sodium bromide first. The Pheno can cause liver issues over extended use. Hopefully, your pup will just grow out of it or you can find her triggers.
 
I have no answers. Just
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for you and your gorgeous dog.. She is absolutely beautiful. I pray that all comes out good. Please let us know how her vet visit goes.
 
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What a beautiful Sheltie!
I inherited a boston terrier mix who for 3 years had very frequent and horrific seizures. I did some research and decided to change her diet on the off chance that was what was the problem. I began feeding her home made food, made (of course)with human grade ingredients ...and NO Beef or wheat products ( basically oatmeal,rice, lentil peas,organic poultry, and all kinds of fruits and veggies.) It was a HUGE success! She has seizures only EXTREMELY rarely and Then only after she's gotten out of the yard and into the neighbor's outdoor cat's food. The change was almost immediate .
Before changing her diet she also had frequent ear troubles which are also gone completely.
After working with a pet groomer for almost 20 years i can tell you right now that we saw more food related health issues in the animals that came to see us for grooming than you can imagine!
Don't give up on your sweet baby! Honestly,i would consider a serious diet change before doing the drug route!
 
I will post the newest vaccine protocal when I get home.
And remember, the only vaccine legally required is rabies.
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agreed, a single seizure type event doesnt mean epilepsy, there are MANY things that can cause seizure like events,f rom low blood sugar, to stress to chemical interaction, to change in diet/formular ect...

its also very rare for even severe epileptic seizures to last 2 hours...
which makes me think reaction.

have you reacently put flea/tick protection on her
what about vaccinations?
what diet is she on? anything that might have changed reacently?

id rule out thyroid issues and do a general blood pannel...
but i wouldnt even consider seizure meds unless this becomes a frequent occurance.

given this episode id also start titer testing rather than vacinating (vacinations do make sezure disorders worse) and only getting the rabies unless titers say otherwise... (and even rabies id only do every 3 years because id have to...)

make sure she eats littler and often, blood sugar drop is a highly common cause of seizures, and when your in "active" or potentially stressfull situations keep a tube of nutrical handy just in case it is blood sugar related.

also keep a journal of her behaviours on a daily basis and try and figure out if this episode had a trigger.

it could be epilepsy, but given the lenght of the episode and the fact that this was her first its not a label (as an epileptic) id be personally willing to put on her at this point...
but it could also be something as simple as she didnt eat breakfast and her blood sugar dropped, or a doggy bug going around ect.

also be sure to drop a message to the breeder, they may also have some additional insight.

she is a stunner and i hope it turns out to be nothign serious!
 
One thing I see missing from this discussion is heartworm treatment. Was she treated for heartworm or other worms shortly before the episode? A large proportion of collie breeds have blood-brain barrier (BBB) issues, meaning things get into their brains that aren't supposed to. Worming medication is one of those things. If she is being treated with conventional worming drugs, talk to your vet about switching to a drug that is safe for collies. The reason for the BBB problem is that collies often have a mutation in a gene called MDR1 (multipe drug resistance gene 1). This mutation can allow toxins to accumulate in the brain and cause seizures or even death

You may know all of this already since you have experience with collies, but I thought I should add it to the discussion.
 
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Thanks for all the virtual hugs and sympathy everyone. I appreciate it.

Just got back from the vet and... well, you guys are good! He asked pretty much exactly the same things as you all did. Of course, Windy came back with a clean bill of health - today. So in the end, we've decided to do nothing, not even a blood test for now. The vet said it likely wouldn't show anything anyway right now, since it was plain she was acting normal. The plan is, since her episode lasted for 2 hours and I am all of 10 minutes away from his office, if she has another episode I will whisk her off to get a blood test while the seizures are happening. That way we'll know if she is reacting to low blood sugar, thyroid issue, etc. right at that moment.

In answer to some of the questions here that the vet also asked, trying to find the "trigger":

Contacted the breeders: No epilepsy in their lines and they hadn't ever seen such an odd type of seizure anyway. Even if the breeders are fibbing, I would know since Shelties of this line are all over the agility courses here - four others just in my training club alone. I would have heard about it if these lines were prone to epilepsy. The breeders were very concerned about Windy, both have health guarantees.

Thyroid: Sire tested good, dam not tested. Windy if DEFINITELY not lethargic EVER - quite the opposite.

Blood Sugar: Except when she was very small, Windy has always been fed twice a day with quite a few treats in between because she is still being trained on a daily basis. Nothing was different Saturday.

Food: No food changes. She has always been fed Taste of the Wild Pacific Stream, a grain free food. Treats are either Zukes (also grain free) or plain cooked chicken breast.

Vaccinations: Not recently. She had her three parvo/distemper combos and one rabies, but that was many months ago.

Heartworm/Lyme: I live in a beach city section of Los Angeles. We really don't have heartworm or Lyme here - the vet never sees it unless it is a dog that has visited another area. I have had dogs all my life here and none have ever been treated for heartworm and none ever tested positive for it, even after hiking in the Sierras. Same with Lyme. Yep, I know about MDR1 - my Collie is mutant/non mutant (thank god she isn't a double mutant!)

Fleas: Windy has never been treated with Frontline/Advantage/etc. Yet, she has never had a flea - I flea comb her regularly just to check. My Collie started having reactions of those topical flea treatments, so I stopped using them. And I found a wonderful thing. In my neighborhood and also the place where I train obedience and agility (near Beverly Hills), people are generally well educated about dog care. They all keep their dogs on those flea treatments - which means my two dogs seem to reap the benefits in that they have no one to catch fleas from. My Collie has been without flea protection for over a year and I have yet to find even one flea on her.

Toxins: I don't spray my garden (in fact, the whole time I've had Windy I've been conducting a no-spray experiment with my roses, ditching those that can't cut it without spraying). The back lawn doesn't even get fertilized (it is all Bermuda grass anyway, which is nearly a weed here). My neighbors don't usually spray either, but there may be a possibility they did.

So.....

The only thing we can come up with that is different from the usual is that Windy just came in heat for the first time. It is "wait and see." If she goes without an episode until her next heat, we know what the trigger is and she will be spayed. Agility folks like to wait until they are full grown to be spayed, and she will be by then. She will likely be spayed anyway, as even with this one episode she is unlikely to be considered part of the breeding program anymore - in spite of everyone raving about her excellent structure and great drive.
 
Our last golden, Livvie, had 3 seizures during her lifetime. Full blown grandd mal type seizures. All three coincided with her heat cycle. Once we had her spayed she nevere seized again. You have a beautiful animal - hopefully she will have no future neurological problems and prove worthy of breeding.
 
My Springer Spanial had an episode almost exactly like you described. Head bobbing and repetative head and leg motions.The episode lasted nearly an hour and a half. I took video of the episode and sent it by cell phone to my vet at that time who said she thought it was the result of some kind of toxin that was neurological in its effects. We never did determine what caused it.I did find a plant in my backyard that turned out to be wild datura but the vet wasnt sure if it caused the episode or not. It only happened once and she was perfectly fine after recovering.I hope your little girl will be fine.
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for you
 

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